No indictment for officer in choking death of man

[julius]

I thought when referencing a president, you call them "President XXXX" not "mr" or "mrs"?

Am I remembering wrong?

I wish this (the death, not the Mr thing) was an isolated incidence. But sadly, it's become all too common and kind of like what bodyman5000 and 1 said, it's almost like it's accepted by the country now.

NOT saying that anyone here was OK with it, but it no longer shocks us. Same with gun violence in schools, or domestic violence.

Chris Brown beats the snot out of Rihanna, and give it a few months and he's back selling records and no one cares anymore. These cops murdered someone over selling illegal cigs. Yeah, he "resisted" arrest, but hello? Does one who sells cigs illegally really create that big of a fucking deal?

True, he could've responded different, but so could the cops. And only one of them is dead, and only one of them is pretty much free and clear to walk the streets now.

There's a culture problem in police and a problem in how minorities (only certain minorities too) respond to authority in these kinds of situations. This isn't a right or wrong, who do we blame situation, it's a God damnit, we're the United State of America, when did we become chicken shit about open and frank discussions about ourselves and coming up with ways to better our nation, thing.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Sly, you're damn near rotten to the core! But not quite yet.

Oh! sorry Sly, that was the Bman.

It was a statement showing how the police have done so much evil shit that a cynical first reaction isn't necessarily out of line.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

I thought when referencing a president, you call them "President XXXX" not "mr" or "mrs"?

Am I remembering wrong?

I wish this (the death, not the Mr thing) was an isolated incidence. But sadly, it's become all too common and kind of like what bodyman5000 and 1 said, it's almost like it's accepted by the country now.

NOT saying that anyone here was OK with it, but it no longer shocks us. Same with gun violence in schools, or domestic violence.

Chris Brown beats the snot out of Rihanna, and give it a few months and he's back selling records and no one cares anymore. These cops murdered someone over selling illegal cigs. Yeah, he "resisted" arrest, but hello? Does one who sells cigs illegally really create that big of a fucking deal?

True, he could've responded different, but so could the cops. And only one of them is dead, and only one of them is pretty much free and clear to walk the streets now.

There's a culture problem in police and a problem in how minorities (only certain minorities too) respond to authority in these kinds of situations. This isn't a right or wrong, who do we blame situation, it's a God damnit, we're the United State of America, when did we become chicken shit about open and frank discussions about ourselves and coming up with ways to better our nation, thing.

I hope nobody thinks it ok.

 

[julius]

I hope nobody thinks it ok.

I probably worded it wrong. I think people have gotten used to it/numb to it, so it doesn't shock us anymore.

 

[magnifier661]

Was it murder though?

 

[BlazerDuckSeahawkFan94]

Wow, That's amazing. Need more people like this in every community in our country.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Was it murder though?

Arguable if it is murder. A lesser form of homicide? Sure as hell looks like it to me!

Think of it this way - if a rent-a-cop had done the exact same thing, would there be any doubt charges would be filed? If one private citizen did that to another?

 

[magnifier661]

Arguable if it is murder. A lesser form of homicide? Sure as hell looks like it to me!

Think of it this way - if a rent-a-cop had done the exact same thing, would there be any doubt charges would be filed? If one private citizen did that to another?

I think they should have tried to charge him with "man slaughter". That would have stuck

 

[lawai'a]

reckless endangerment at the very least

even denny's crowd realizes that some times there has to be a federal government

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

no insightful commentary from el prez?

:MARIS61:

 

[Sinobas]

It might sound bad due to the outcome but the honest truth is he didn't put his hands up when asked. He was apprehensive. Should he have gotten out of the car and put his hands up and this still happens then it is an entirely different story.

This video is a perfect example of how we are quick to form opinions without having proper evidence....which is different than doing the wrong thing when provided with substatial evidence.

Nobody should die because of a mistake, but that is what happened here. You can't have that open amount of defiance in that situation and expect the officers not to become fearful for their lives.

I agree, if he hadn't died this would be a case of an officer using excessive force, or an improper technique. Officers should stay away from the neck area unless they are really in dangerous struggle, but the man had already been subdued and was surrounded by 4 other policemen.

I think it would be silly to indict him for murder....maybe manslaughter. You can make a solid case that this should have at least gone to trial for manslaughter.

 

[Sinobas]

Also, I the officer was actually correct when he said he didn't have Garner in a chokehold. If he had him in a chockhold he'd have passed out within seconds. He was squeezing his neck though, and looked like he put his knee on his neck, and the coronor said he died of neck compression.

 

[Denny Crane]

http://inthesetimes.com/article/17213/jon_burge_torture_chicago_has_not_paid_for_his_crimes

Burge’s 2010 conviction for perjury came nearly 20 years after his reign of racist terror finally ended. From 1972 to 1991, he led a torture ring of white Chicago detectives who routinely used electric shock, suffocation with plastic bags and typewriter covers, mock executions and brutal attacks on the genitals to obtain confessions from their victims. A team of lawyers at the People’s Law Office, including myself, documented 118 such cases. But a series of police superintendents, numerous Cook County prosecutors and a cover-up that implicated former Mayor Richard M. Daley (during his time as both mayor and state’s attorney) protected Burge and his men from prosecution until well after the statute of limitations had run out on their crimes of torture.

Like Al Capone's prosecution for tax evasion, Burge could only be prosecuted for lying about what he and his men did, not for the deeds themselves. He was sentenced to the maximum term of four and a half years, and ended up serving three and a half before being released to a halfway house—a stark contrast to the fates of his victims, many of whom received death sentences or life in prison on the basis of confessions that were tortured from them.

 

[PDXFonz]

I agree, if he hadn't died this would be a case of an officer using excessive force, or an improper technique. Officers should stay away from the neck area unless they are really in dangerous struggle, but the man had already been subdued and was surrounded by 4 other policemen.

I think it would be silly to indict him for murder....maybe manslaughter. You can make a solid case that this should have at least gone to trial for manslaughter.

....we are talking about two completely different situations...the guy who choked the man in NYc is murder.

 

[Sinobas]

....we are talking about two completely different situations...the guy who choked the man in NYc is murder.

Oh, I thought you were talking about Eric Garner. Murder has to be pre-meditated, for this case to be murder, the officer would have had to intended to kill Mr. Garner, and I think that is clearly not the case.

 

[PDXFonz]

Oh, I thought you were talking about Eric Garner. Murder has to be pre-meditated, for this case to be murder, the officer would have had to intended to kill Mr. Garner, and I think that is clearly not the case.

The man stated he couldn't breath multiple times. Ignoring those cries for help is murder. He can't act like he didn't know it would kill him, the man told him he was going to die if he didn't stop choking him, and he kept doing it.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

The man stated he couldn't breath multiple times. Ignoring those cries for help is murder. He can't act like he didn't know it would kill him, the man told him he was going to die if he didn't stop choking him, and he kept doing it.

And if the cop was under the impression that he wasn't actually choking Garner? If he reasoned "this hold cuts off blood supply, not airway; this guy is lying about not being able to breathe"--does that still equate to willful intent to kill?

 

[PDXFonz]

And if the cop was under the impression that he wasn't actually choking Garner? If he reasoned "this hold cuts off blood supply, not airway; this guy is lying about not being able to breathe"--does that still equate to willful intent to kill?

I think it should, it points to the problem of trust that society is breeding. It's only going to get worse if it doesn't get better. Misconceptions, jaded perceptions, and misguided assumptions...

 

[Denny Crane]

Second degree murder fits, IMO.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Second degree murder fits, IMO.

So, you believe that the officer intended to end Garner's life.

 

[Denny Crane]

So, you believe that the officer intended to end Garner's life.

"a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life."

 

[PtldPlatypus]

"a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life."

Ah, sorry--I missed the second definition.

 

[Denny Crane]

Ah, sorry--I missed the second definition.

Manslaughter at the very least.

 

[Mediocre Man]

99 times out of 100 I side with the police. Their jobs are dangerous, and most of the time the people did something wrong. While I on't quite know why the guy was put in a choke hold, it certainly seemed unnecessary

 

[Sinobas]

A choke hold puts a person to sleep in a matter of seconds, this guy was not out. I think they should have let up too in this case....but on the flip side, how often do they have people BSing them as they are trying to arrest them?

 

[Sinobas]

"a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life."

To display "lack of concern for human life" you have to establish that the guy did something that he could have reasonalbly expected to end a person's life. For example, if I go outside and start firing off random gun shots and it hits someone.

 

[Denny Crane]

Not stopping when the guy couldn't breathe? Seems not concerned to me.