Now I have to hear a year of this worthless Derek Jeter crap

[BigDaddyAl1973]

Only player to have 200 hits, 100 runs and 300 total bases in the post season. Add that to a career where he's over .300 lifetime and has an outside shot at 3500 hits and that's impressive enough without talking about the intangibles.

no one is saying he wasn't/isn't a great player. He is just not the greatest thing since sliced bread. Why is that so difficult for fans to understand.

Look at Barry Larkin, his stats (average, OBS, SLG and OPS) are all very similar to Jeter. Yes Jeter has over 1k more hits..he also has over 3k at bats.
Barry Larkin outside of a couple of seasons did not play with nearly the same lineup as Derek Jeter did. Barry Larkin is a HOFer and so will Derek Jeter.

Derek Jeter is not in the same breath as Babe Ruth, Joe DiMaggio, Mickey Mantel, Willie Mays as far as all around players, yet here in NYC the fan base considers him God like.

 

[Rick2583]

no one is saying he wasn't/isn't a great player. He is just not the greatest thing since sliced bread. Why is that so difficult for fans to understand.

Look at Barry Larkin, his stats (average, OBS, SLG and OPS) are all very similar to Jeter. Yes Jeter has over 1k more hits..he also has over 3k at bats.
Barry Larkin outside of a couple of seasons did not play with nearly the same lineup as Derek Jeter did. Barry Larkin is a HOFer and so will Derek Jeter.

Derek Jeter is not in the same breath as Babe Ruth, Joe DiMaggio, Mickey Mantel, Willie Mays as far as all around players, yet here in NYC the fan base considers him God like.

Al please don't fall in with the others that are comparing apples to oranges. You're comparing a singles hitter to HR & RBI hitters. Of course there numbers are going to be higher. You're also comparing a SS to outfielders. Like I said, apples to oranges.

 

[BigDaddyAl1973]

Barry Larkin was a fellow SS though

 

[Rick2583]

Barry Larkin was a fellow SS though

I was looking at your last line where you said that Jeter is not in the same breath as the big HR RBI guys you mentioned. And you're right, differant type of hitter & a more demanding position. You need to compare his numbers to any shortstop not named Banks, Ripkin or A Rod (HR hitters). Because no one is saying that he's among the best players ever. Most if not all of us are saying his over all numbers puts him just behind Wagner as greatest SS ever.

 

[BigDaddyAl1973]

Al please don't fall in with the others that are comparing apples to oranges. You're comparing a singles hitter to HR & RBI hitters. Of course there numbers are going to be higher. You're also comparing a SS to outfielders. Like I said, apples to oranges.

Ok, let me ask you this...do you put Ichiro in the same class as the before mentioned all time great outfielders? Ichiro's all around game was just as impressive as Jeter's. Way better defense, speed galore. high average, stolen bases....

When you look at the Yankee championship teams...

1996
Bernie Williams had a better year
Wade Boggs had a similar year
Tino Martinez had a very good year
Paul O'neill had a good year

I think it is fair to say when you look at the 96 lineup, Jeter is not the first person you are most afraid of (no disrespect again he was a great player but look at the stats of the players in the surrounding lineup)

1998
Bernie Williams had a better year than Jeter
Paul O'Neil had as good a season as Jeter
hell even Scott Brosius hit 300 on that team

So yes jeter and his 324 average was very good, but he was THE guy on that team.

1999
This was the year you could....possibly...say Jeter carried the team with his 349 aerage and 24 hrs and 102 rbi's
Bernie wiliams hit 342, 25 and 115


2000
Same could be said with 2000 as Jeter had a 339 average with 15 and 73
Bernie's average dipped that year to 307 with 30 and 121...his RBI production can be attributed to Jeter scoring 119 times
Jorge Posada and his 28/86 with 35 doubles (more than jeter) had a terrific season and led the team in ops

2009
Jeter and his 334 led the team but it may be safe to say a Roided up ARod was more feared
Cano with his 320 and 25 hrs sure helped

So yes Jeter was a great player, but in each of the WS seasons did he carry the team? No...he was as much a part of the success as others in the lineup.

 

[BigDaddyAl1973]

have I also mentioned that my favorite player of all time is Bernie Williams

 

[Disturbed]

Ichiro and Jeter are great comparisons offensively. Great singles hitters. Ichiro won't go down as am all time great and I'm a Mariners fan. Obviously Jeter played a much harder position so that's the main difference. Also Ichiro hit .350-.370 in his prime AND he was ELITE defensively at his position in his prime unlike Jeter.


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[Rick2583]

Ichiro and Jeter are great comparisons offensively. Great singles hitters. Ichiro won't go down as am all time great and I'm a Mariners fan. Obviously Jeter played a much harder position so that's the main difference. Also Ichiro hit .350-.370 in his prime AND he was ELITE defensively at his position in his prime unlike Jeter.


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Disturbed,I'm going to be completely fair here I would take Ichiro's first 10 seasons (a fucking amazing 10 straight 200 hit seasons) over every & any great singles hitters, Carew, Gwynn, Boggs Jeter etc. And it is my opinion that had Ichiro started his career here in the states he would have shattered Rose's hit record. So yes he & Jeter are great comparisons. Both 1st ballot HOFers IMO.

Al I'm not trying to down play your point but again Williams, O'Neill, Posada were middle of the order guys & had more power so again the power #s are going to be better then Jeter's when it comes to HRs & RBI. So to be fair we have to look at the other stats like OBP, OPS, hitting with RISP etc, which I haven't done. Just saying.

 

[Disturbed]

Yeah Ichiro had an amazing 10 year run for sure. I just happen to think singles are very overrated.


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[Rick2583]

Yeah Ichiro had an amazing 10 year run for sure. I just happen to think singles are very overrated.


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Look at it this way, if it weren't for those singles there would be a lot more solo HRs. Those singles are just non HR hitters doing there jobs for the big boppers.

 

[chuckd3534]

Because no one is saying that he's among the best players ever. Most if not all of us are saying his over all numbers puts him just behind Wagner as greatest SS ever.


So you think Jeter is the 2nd best SS ever Rick? Just curious.

 

[Rick2583]

Because no one is saying that he's among the best players ever. Most if not all of us are saying his over all numbers puts him just behind Wagner as greatest SS ever.


So you think Jeter is the 2nd best SS ever Rick? Just curious.

Over all numbers wise yes.

 

[Pastafazul]

good Lord, HELP!!

 

[SaveLundy]

have I also mentioned that my favorite player of all time is Bernie Williams

+1 he was a true joy to watch play.

 

[Pastafazul]

was ruth the best pitcher in baseball? the best base stealer? the best reliever? his fielding% the best ever? the best pinch hitter? did he have the most singles? doubles? triples? most put outs? whip? war? yet he is the most popular player ever! cause he hit dingers and he was larger then life, literally and FIGURatively

 

[BigDaddyAl1973]

you may want to check in on his pitching there pasta, he was a VERY good pitcher before using his skills for antoher position