Exclusive Official Around the NBA: November 2022

[PDXFonz]

Blazers were 2-2 without Lillard. Mavs would be one of the worst teams in the NBA without Luka.

You could make an argument that Lillard in many ways is better than Luka, and yes you could argue Lillard ultimately contributes more to winning. Others could make many arguments the other direction.

Ultimately their both clear elite stars in this game. Personally I'd put Luka a bit above Dame mostly just for his physical size, as well as his youth which gives him more potential to improve. I don't believe Luka can really be overrated when he's a clear top5 player in this league.

If your saying Luka is not a winner then surely Dame isn't either. Luka at 23 carried his teams to the WCF last year winning a game. 32 year old Lillard never has.

Fair and valid points. But…

The 2019-20 and 2021-22 seasons have been the weakest postseasons in a while. Biggest window we’ve seen in perhaps 20 years.

2013-14 Blazers (Year Dame hit the 0.9) could have won it either of those last two years. We’d have smashed the L*kers in the first round.

 

[PDXFonz]

The Mavs played the Jazz first round.

Narrowly skipped past PHX, which had NOP without Zion and newly acquired CJ in the first round.

Then got smashed by the Warriors.

I wish we could get draws like that in the playoffs.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

The Mavs played the Jazz first round.

Narrowly skipped past PHX, which had NOP without Zion and newly acquired CJ in the first round.

Then got smashed by the Warriors.

I wish we could get draws like that in the playoffs.

You mean like 2019 years ago when we got a Russ-led Thunder squad, and then "narrowly skipped past" DEN, which had SAS with a newly acquired Derozan in the first round?

 

[PDXFonz]

Which team wins a 7 game series?
No. Player Pos Ht Wt Birth Date Exp College

8 Al-Farouq Aminu PF 6-8 220 September 21, 1990 us 8 Wake Forest
2 Wade Baldwin PG 6-4 200 March 29, 1996 us 2 Vanderbilt
33 Zach Collins C 6-11 250 November 19, 1997 us 1 Gonzaga
31 Seth Curry SG 6-2 185 August 23, 1990 us 4 Liberty, Duke
00 Enes Freedom C 6-10 250 May 20, 1992 ch 7
4 Maurice Harkless SF 6-7 220 May 11, 1993 us 6 St. John's
5 Rodney Hood SG 6-8 208 October 20, 1992 us 4 Mississippi State, Duke
17 Skal Labissière PF 6-10 235 March 18, 1996 ht 2 Kentucky
10 Jake Layman SF 6-8 209 March 7, 1994 us 2 Maryland
11 Meyers Leonard C 7-0 260 February 27, 1992 us 6 Illinois
0 Damian Lillard PG 6-2 195 July 15, 1990 us 6 Weber State
3 CJ McCollum SG 6-3 190 September 19, 1991 us 5 Lehigh
27 Jusuf Nurkić C 6-11 290 August 23, 1994 ba 4
24 Anfernee Simons SG 6-3 181 June 8, 1999 us R
6 Nik Stauskas SG 6-6 205 October 7, 1993 ca 4 Michigan
50 Caleb Swanigan PF 6-9 260 April 18, 1997 us 1 Purdue
9 Gary Trent Jr. SG 6-5 209 January 18, 1999 us R Duke
1 Evan Turner PG 6-6 220 October 27, 1988 us 8 Ohio State

Vs

2 Tyler Bey SF 6-7 215 February 10, 1998 us R Colorado
13 Jalen Brunson PG 6-1 190 August 31, 1996 us 2 Villanova
3 Trey Burke PG 6-0 185 November 12, 1992 us 7 Michigan
33 Willie Cauley-Stein C 7-0 240 August 18, 1993 us 5 Kentucky
77 Luka Dončić PG 6-7 230 February 28, 1999 si 2
10 Dorian Finney-Smith PF 6-7 220 May 4, 1993 us 4 Florida
8 Josh Green SG 6-5 200 November 16, 2000 au R Arizona
11 Tim Hardaway Jr. SG 6-5 205 March 16, 1992 us 7 Michigan
14 Nate Hinton SG 6-5 210 June 8, 1999 us R Houston
25 Wes Iwundu SF 6-6 195 December 20, 1994 us 3 Kansas State
16 James Johnson PF 6-7 240 February 20, 1987 us 11 Wake Forest
42 Maxi Kleber PF 6-10 240 January 29, 1992 de 3
51 Boban Marjanović C 7-3 290 August 15, 1988 rs 5
44 Nicolò Melli PF 6-9 236 January 26, 1991 it 1
6 Kristaps Porziņģis C 7-3 240 August 2, 1995 lv 4
7 Dwight Powell C 6-10 240 July 20, 1991 ca 6 Stanford
17 J.J. Redick SG 6-3 200 June 24, 1984 us 14 Duke
0 Josh Richardson SG 6-5 200 September 15, 1993 us 5 Tennessee
1 Tyrell Terry PG 6-2 160 September 28, 2000 us R Stanford

 

[PDXFonz]

You mean like 2019 years ago when we got a Russ-led Thunder squad, and then "narrowly skipped past" DEN, which had SAS with a newly acquired Derozan in the first round?

Somewhat. See above post

 

[BigGameDamian]

I wouldn't trade for KAT. He's a bad pairing with Lillard or Simons let alone both.

Why? I think he’d be great with a guy like Dame. Where he wouldn’t have to be the main guy. KAT would be an upgrade over Nurkic.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Why? I think he’d be great with a guy like Dame. Where he wouldn’t have to be the main guy. KAT would be an upgrade over Nurkic.

I can't imagine having both KAT and Dame on the payroll together 3-4 years from now...

 

[wizenheimer]

You could be right, holy crap I thought he was making $36m/year not $55m/yr.

Oops ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

yeah, they signed him to that extension in July. It boggled my mind. And I was wrong about it being 55M/year; it's actually 56M/year....geeeeezuz

I have arrived at the point that I think it's nearly impossible to build a contender in the new NBA around a C. The championship sweet spot is in 2-way wings and 3-point shooting. That's the template that has to be stenciled across the payrolls if a team wants to contend...IMO, of course. Jokic and Embiid have been by far the best C's in the NBA now for 4-5 seasons. Top-10 MVP talents. yet between the two of them combined they have exactly 1 win in the conference finals, which is only one win more than Dame has.

sure, you could argue it's more due to roster construction than their talent. The problem is their salaries become the lodestone of the roster constructions and you still have to infill the supporting cast, and competition for those all-star wings is intense.

you have to go back to Tim Duncan 9 years ago to find a featured 'C' who led his team to a title. And Duncan was more a PF than a C; in 2/3 of Duncan's games Tiago Splitter started at C. The last full-time C who won a championship was Pau Gasol 13 years ago

after Pau Gasol, I'm looking at the C rotations of the champions:

Dallas - Tyson Chandler & Brendan Heywood
Miami - Joel Anthony & Ronny Turiaf
Miami - Joel Anthony & Chris Anderson
Spurs - Tiago Splitter and Aaron Baynes
Warriors - Andrew Bogut & Festus Ezeli
Cleveland - Timofey Mozgov & Anderson Varejao
Warriors - Zaza Pachulia & JaVale McGee
Warriors - Kevin Looney & JaVale McGee
Toronto - Marc Gasol & Serge Ibaka
Milwaukee - Brooke Lopez & Bobby Portis
Warriors - Kevon Looney & Nemanja Bjelica

I see a couple of traditional C's in their 30's (with larger contracts) who are only 4th or 5th options. And guys like Portis and Ibaka are C/PF combos. But for the most part, champion teams filled in the C rotations with a lot of MLE-level and vet minimum C's. To me. it sure seems it's hard to justify busting over the 20-25M threshold for any C rotation. Centers used to be the promised land but now they are just a mirage. That's why I've pushed back against those advocating trading for Ayton. I actually like Adebayo more than Ayton, but I think neither is really good value at 33M/year

I'm worried about Nurkic's injury history and I'm not really high on Eubanks. But I do think Portland is on the right track paying under 20M for those two

 

[DDolla]

Zach Collins with a fractured Fibula… damn

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Zach Collins with a fractured Fibula… damn

Non displaced and he is young. 2-4 weeks recovery time.

 

[wizenheimer]

Non displaced and he is young. 2-4 weeks recovery time.

he's Zach, so we've seen this movie before

2-4 months recovery time

 

[PDXFonz]

he's Zach, so we've seen this movie before

2-4 months recovery time

Zach Collins to star as Steve Austin in 2023 Remake?

I can’t wait until the first NBA Cyborg. It’s going to be Kawhi… Please let it be Kawhi.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Zach Collins to star as Steve Austin in 2023 Remake?

I can’t wait until the first NBA Cyborg. It’s going to be Kawhi… Please let it be Kawhi.

Are they paying him $6 million?

 

[SharpesTriumph]

The Mavs played the Jazz first round.

Narrowly skipped past PHX, which had NOP without Zion and newly acquired CJ in the first round.

Then got smashed by the Warriors.

I wish we could get draws like that in the playoffs.

Yeah I sure wish Stotts final year we could have played a team like Denver missing both starters in their backcourt.

Or the year the Blazers played the Clippers, when both Blake and CP3 were hurt.

Or when Dame beat the Thunder and Paul George was hurt.

Basically every team in the NBA gets easy matchups every year while the Blazers always play fully healthy powerhouse squads.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Why? I think he’d be great with a guy like Dame. Where he wouldn’t have to be the main guy. KAT would be an upgrade over Nurkic.

Offense would be fine, the issue is on the other end.

Dame teams already have defensive challenges to overcome; I don't believe you can pair him with one of the worst defensive bigs in the game successfully. Plus Simons is playing out of position most the game at SG.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

yeah, they signed him to that extension in July. It boggled my mind. And I was wrong about it being 55M/year; it's actually 56M/year....geeeeezuz

I have arrived at the point that I think it's nearly impossible to build a contender in the new NBA around a C. The championship sweet spot is in 2-way wings and 3-point shooting. That's the template that has to be stenciled across the payrolls if a team wants to contend...IMO, of course. Jokic and Embiid have been by far the best C's in the NBA now for 4-5 seasons. Top-10 MVP talents. yet between the two of them combined they have exactly 1 win in the conference finals, which is only one win more than Dame has.

sure, you could argue it's more due to roster construction than their talent. The problem is their salaries become the lodestone of the roster constructions and you still have to infill the supporting cast, and competition for those all-star wings is intense.

you have to go back to Tim Duncan 9 years ago to find a featured 'C' who led his team to a title. And Duncan was more a PF than a C; in 2/3 of Duncan's games Tiago Splitter started at C. The last full-time C who won a championship was Pau Gasol 13 years ago

after Pau Gasol, I'm looking at the C rotations of the champions:

Dallas - Tyson Chandler & Brendan Heywood
Miami - Joel Anthony & Ronny Turiaf
Miami - Joel Anthony & Chris Anderson
Spurs - Tiago Splitter and Aaron Baynes
Warriors - Andrew Bogut & Festus Ezeli
Cleveland - Timofey Mozgov & Anderson Varejao
Warriors - Zaza Pachulia & JaVale McGee
Warriors - Kevin Looney & JaVale McGee
Toronto - Marc Gasol & Serge Ibaka
Milwaukee - Brooke Lopez & Bobby Portis
Warriors - Kevon Looney & Nemanja Bjelica

I see a couple of traditional C's in their 30's (with larger contracts) who are only 4th or 5th options. And guys like Portis and Ibaka are C/PF combos. But for the most part, champion teams filled in the C rotations with a lot of MLE-level and vet minimum C's. To me. it sure seems it's hard to justify busting over the 20-25M threshold for any C rotation. Centers used to be the promised land but now they are just a mirage. That's why I've pushed back against those advocating trading for Ayton. I actually like Adebayo more than Ayton, but I think neither is really good value at 33M/year

I'm worried about Nurkic's injury history and I'm not really high on Eubanks. But I do think Portland is on the right track paying under 20M for those two

Agreed with much of this.

I do think its fine to build a team around certain allstars such as Jokic and Embiid. Anthony Davis won a title too often playing center. But those are MVP level players; not borderline allstars like KAT with major defensive challenges and a decade of bad habits.

I still question if the Blazers would've been better having Nurk walk and getting a MLE or heck even a few vet minimum guys at that spot. Then put that money over the next few year to forwards. Centers just don't make much of a difference unless its an allstar; and even with an allstar nothing is guaranteed.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Are they paying him $6 million?

Inflation; he's the seven-point-three-five-million-dollar man.

 

[illmatic99]

Zach Collins with a fractured Fibula… damn

i feel so bad for him

he was playing really well to start the season too.

 

[BankTeller]

Agreed with much of this.

I do think its fine to build a team around certain allstars such as Jokic and Embiid. Anthony Davis won a title too often playing center. But those are MVP level players; not borderline allstars like KAT with major defensive challenges and a decade of bad habits.

I still question if the Blazers would've been better having Nurk walk and getting a MLE or heck even a few vet minimum guys at that spot. Then put that money over the next few year to forwards. Centers just don't make much of a difference unless its an allstar; and even with an allstar nothing is guaranteed.

Yeah I’m starting to think we should just find a big in the draft or wait for a young big we like to become available.

 

[PDXFonz]

Get Myles Turner some legos and recruit him to rip city LOL

 

[KSF-ERIC]

So are the Jazz for real or what

If Markkanen keeps playing like an All Star and they keep Conley and Clarkson, yes.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

Mavs are dog water

Luka is overrated, yes, I said it…

Dude IS NOT a winner

I’m sure some are going to say it’s his team and not him. Swap Dame with Doncic and the Mavs are better, Blazers are worse.

Luka led his team to the WCF at age 23. He is a top 2 MVP candidate this season. Dame’s 32 and hasn’t been any further than Luka. I like both players.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

Fair and valid points. But…

The 2019-20 and 2021-22 seasons have been the weakest postseasons in a while. Biggest window we’ve seen in perhaps 20 years.
.

And we didn’t win a series.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

The Mavs played the Jazz first round.

Narrowly skipped past PHX, which had NOP without Zion and newly acquired CJ in the first round.

Then got smashed by the Warriors.

I wish we could get draws like that in the playoffs.

They didn’t narrowly skip past Phoenix. They bludgeoned ‘em by 40 in Phoenix! But the 2019 Blazers did VERY narrowly skip past Denver. Luka has had a much better career than Dame and that’s fine.

 

[Strenuus]

Blazers were 2-2 without Lillard. Mavs would be one of the worst teams in the NBA without Luka.

You could make an argument that Lillard in many ways is better than Luka, and yes you could argue Lillard ultimately contributes more to winning. Others could make many arguments the other direction.

Ultimately their both clear elite stars in this game. Personally I'd put Luka a bit above Dame mostly just for his physical size, as well as his youth which gives him more potential to improve. I don't believe Luka can really be overrated when he's a clear top5 player in this league.

If your saying Luka is not a winner then surely Dame isn't either. Luka at 23 carried his teams to the WCF last year winning a game. 32 year old Lillard never has.

I mean, we have been to the WCF with dame. I'm not arguing about anything else, but we have been to a WCF with Dame.

 

[Cugel]

Lakers working out Tony MF'ing Snell

 

[SharpesTriumph]

I mean, we have been to the WCF with dame. I'm not arguing about anything else, but we have been to a WCF with Dame.

Yes Dame's been to the WCF and I didn't say otherwise. But Dame has never won a game in the WCF as Luka has.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Lakers working out Tony MF'ing Snell

Stat Monster Snell!

 

[wizenheimer]

Yes Dame's been to the WCF and I didn't say otherwise. But Dame has never won a game in the WCF as Luka has.

Dame's team was 0-4, Luka's was 1-4. Do you really think that's any kind of a meaningful gauge?...because I sure don't

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Dame's team was 0-4, Luka's was 1-4. Do you really think that's any kind of a meaningful gauge?...because I sure don't

I never said that.

I said Luka won 1 WCF game that Dame has not. It's a simple fact, any extrapolation or additional meaning is not my comment but your interpretation.

These posts all started with a poster saying that Luka is overated, not a winner, and clearly inferior to Dame. My point was Luka has won more than Dame over much fewer seasons, so if he is not a winner than Dame probably isn't either.