Politics Oregon assault weapons ban petitioners turn in signatures

[CupWizier]

Do you know what the odds are that you'll ever be shot, let alone by an AR-15? You people need to focus your energy elsewhere. I swear to god, if they actually reported on every single car accident that happened every day nobody would want to drive. You are significantly more likely to be in a car wreck. I have been in four separate car wrecks, none of which were my fault, in my lifetime. I have never been shot or shot at. Not once. I have been around a lot of guns in my lifetime. Never seen someone shot, never felt the urge to shoot at another human being. There are hundreds of millions of guns in this country, and yet the number of people who are shot every year is a fraction of a percent. The number of people who are killed by drunk drivers or just plain negligence is staggering. You guys are fixated on the wrong thing.

If the possibility is so remote then why are those type of weapons a necessity? There are plenty of other options. Your argument seems to support that these type of weapons aren't necessary as the gun advocates that say they need them for protection (which by your words aren't necessary) then why not try restrictions on what can be sold and purchased? Plenty of options for those that want to hunt or feel they need protection.

 

[riverman]

You guys are fixated on the wrong thing.

It's pretty far from fixation.....it's addressing something...personally I never drive on holidays or in heavy traffic...I have no need to so I minimize my risk...I've been hit by a drunk driver on interstate 80 outside Sacramento on Christmas eve....I've also had 3 guns held to my head in Denver for the 14 dollars in my wallet...all 3 kids who robbed me were caught...all were under 16 years old...gun violence here is beyond acceptable and gun laws work in other countries to maximize safety of society....my point about gun control is that guns just plain don't make people safe...in too many cases they end up in the hands of folks experiencing rage or suicidal thoughts. This conversation needs to be aired out with the long term goal of a peaceful society to enjoy.

 

[MarAzul]

I have read the proposed bill.

This is entirely too far reaching and vague by design.

By definition any rifle with a clip falls under the preview of this proposed action.

So, my little .22 cal target toy suddenly becomes an "assault" rifle. I would have to register it with the state, turn it over to a registered gun dealer or render it inoperable.

If I am able to retain the rifle, I must prove to the satisfaction or a state inspector, the it is in a safe , locked storage on my own property. If the inspector deems my facility to be lacking, they can refuse to allow me to retain the rifle, and arguably allowed to confiscate at that time (if the allotted time has expired).

Pretty simple guys, if you do not like guns, do not own one. Just leave my stuff alone.

Well this is clearly on of those issue where we know the SCoUS would strike it down as a clear case of infringement. Take years though before it would be settled
So those that go for this disingenuous tactics of obviously ignoring the Constitution, are people you know you can not trust. Or respected for that matter.
It is simply out of bounds and they know it, but do not care.

 

[riverman]

So those that go for this disingenuous tactics of obviously ignoring the Constitution, are people you know you can not trust. Or respect for that matter.

A disrespectful post about respect? Belongs in the oxymoron thread! You're saying anyone from overseas that cannot speak English or read it cannot be trusted? I doubt even Canadians spend much time contemplating our Constitution Marz

 

[MarAzul]

Yes I prefer a weapon that a single shot will usually do for many uses. The 270 Winchester Model 70 and the 308 Savage lever action are couple of my favorites
along with a sweet little Browning knock off of the old model 92 Winchester, except it shoots the .357 rounds instead of 32-20. But these are not good enough for all uses.

1. When I was running my ranch in NE Oregon, I took it on to encourage geese to nest there. The first year I had one pair that did indeed raise a batch of goslings.
I raise the capacity of the pond to about 5 feet deeper and that resulted in a bit more area, moving the edge right over close to a grain field on either side of the pond.
The Cattails had to readjust to the new, but they did quickly.

Well anyway those Geese and their young returned the next spring and they all setup camp. I had 5 nesting pair that summer. They had grain right there and were doing well.
I kept a close eye on them as the Coyotes were too. Then the dang Coyotes got one young one. Dammit!
The next evening I set up watch over the Grain field from a hill side about 300 yards off. Sure enough, the pack of Coyotes game sneaking in from the far side maybe 550 yards off,
working their way very stealthy toward the feeding young. The Ganders were on Duty but they could not see the Pack sneaking through the Wheat.

The geese were maybe 275 yards from me, so I let the coyotes come to just over 300 as I judged it. Then I opened up, rapid fire with a 30 round magazine in the Ranch Rifle.
Dropped Two of the seven before they knew what the fuck was up, then they turned tail. On their way out, I dropped one more.
I did not see the coyotes in the area again that year. Not sure how many geese I had practicing flight training that fall but it was sort of cool to watch then get ready to migrate.
I was damned pleased.

Yes, a whole bunch returned and we did the same drill on the next batch of Coyotes next season and the next. We lived there seven years before we then moved to Bandon.
Probably had over 200 pairs of nesting geese calling that ranch home. I don't think I could have done it without that Mini14 Ranch Rifle.
It works about like an AR-15, might not be quite as bad looking, but still...

2. Now I could tell you another story of why you need some serious fire power on a boat too. But I will leave that story for another day.
I will just say the threat of being well armed is usually enough to win the day. It will be the shits when the bad guys know we legally, cannot be well armed.

 

[riverman]

308 Savage lever action are couple of my favorites

This was my favorite rifle ...my father had one I borrowed in my hunting days

 

[MarAzul]

A disrespectful post about respect? Belongs in the oxymoron thread! You're saying anyone from overseas that cannot speak English or read it cannot be trusted? I doubt even Canadians spend much time contemplating our Constitution Marz

Bull! When you put forth what you want as law, and you know does not comply with the Constitution, you disrespect it and all those that do cherish the rule of law.

 

[MarAzul]

This was my favorite rifle ...my father had one I borrowed in my hunting days

I bought it new 62 years ago, before I was 21 years old. Nice rifle, but I do like the 250/3000 and the 300 a bit better. Both adequate for deer,
which I never hunt these days.

 

[MarAzul]

I see my choice is not in the poll.
I think it would be an honor to challenge this law up through the Supreme Court.

 

[Natebishop3]

If the possibility is so remote then why are those type of weapons a necessity? There are plenty of other options. Your argument seems to support that these type of weapons aren't necessary as the gun advocates that say they need them for protection (which by your words aren't necessary) then why not try restrictions on what can be sold and purchased? Plenty of options for those that want to hunt or feel they need protection.

Because the kind of protection that they provide is not from an intruder, or a rapist, but from the government..... which was the entire point of the second amendment in the first place.

 

[Natebishop3]

It's pretty far from fixation.....it's addressing something...personally I never drive on holidays or in heavy traffic...I have no need to so I minimize my risk...I've been hit by a drunk driver on interstate 80 outside Sacramento on Christmas eve....I've also had 3 guns held to my head in Denver for the 14 dollars in my wallet...all 3 kids who robbed me were caught...all were under 16 years old...gun violence here is beyond acceptable and gun laws work in other countries to maximize safety of society....my point about gun control is that guns just plain don't make people safe...in too many cases they end up in the hands of folks experiencing rage or suicidal thoughts. This conversation needs to be aired out with the long term goal of a peaceful society to enjoy.

How many of those were rifles? How many of those were "assault rifles?"

 

[MarAzul]

Because the kind of protection that they provide is not from an intruder, or a rapist, but from the government..... which was the entire point of the second amendment in the first place.

Actually, the treat of having some fire power on board is the reason for not having piracy preying on boats in US waters. Where as in much of the disarmed world,
thugs at sea prey on the disarmed in their waters. Not the US or Canada for that matter. Mexico to our south is another story all together, every since they began not allowing weapons on board.

 

[MarAzul]

Ha! Come to thing of it, much of the State has already passed local laws directing the Sheriffs to ignore gun laws passed in Salem that do not comply with the Constitution. So this law may be meaningless but for Portland.

 

[Natebishop3]

Actually, the treat of having some fire power on board is the reason for not having piracy preying on boats in US waters. Where as in much of the disarmed world,
thugs at sea prey on the disarmed in their waters. Not the US or Canada for that matter. Mexico to our south is another story all together, every since they began not allowing weapons on board.

This is just the universal rule.

An unarmed populace is easy pickens.

 

[CupWizier]

Because the kind of protection that they provide is not from an intruder, or a rapist, but from the government..... which was the entire point of the second amendment in the first place.

Lol, so we need to arm yurself from the government? That is ridiculous. We are well past the 1700's

 

[Natebishop3]

Lol, so we need to arm yurself from the government? That is ridiculous. We are well past the 1700's

Yes. Completely ridiculous that an armed public is a deterrent from tyranny.

What I find interesting is that you're so willing to give your blind faith to a government that has shown repeated disregard for our rights, our privacy, and the constitution in the past (almost) 20 years. Probably longer, but the creation of the patriot act among many other blatant trespasses against our personal freedom has really stepped it up since 9/11.

I don't even own an AR-15 at this point, but our founding fathers understood the necessity of an armed public to prevent outright tyrannical control from a government. That's why they put the second amendment into the constitution in the first place.

 

[Further]

Do you know what the odds are that you'll ever be shot, let alone by an AR-15? You people need to focus your energy elsewhere. I swear to god, if they actually reported on every single car accident that happened every day nobody would want to drive. You are significantly more likely to be in a car wreck. I have been in four separate car wrecks, none of which were my fault, in my lifetime. I have never been shot or shot at. Not once. I have been around a lot of guns in my lifetime. Never seen someone shot, never felt the urge to shoot at another human being. There are hundreds of millions of guns in this country, and yet the number of people who are shot every year is a fraction of a percent. The number of people who are killed by drunk drivers or just plain negligence is staggering. You guys are fixated on the wrong thing.

I had a gun pulled on me from a road rage incident- I drove away so fast I don’t know if it was just a threat or had intent.

 

[CupWizier]

Yes. Completely ridiculous that an armed public is a deterrent from tyranny.

What I find interesting is that you're so willing to give your blind faith to a government that has shown repeated disregard for our rights, our privacy, and the constitution in the past (almost) 20 years. Probably longer, but the creation of the patriot act among many other blatant trespasses against our personal freedom has really stepped it up since 9/11.

I don't even own an AR-15 at this point, but our founding fathers understood the necessity of an armed public to prevent outright tyrannical control from a government. That's why they put the second amendment into the constitution in the first place.

Now you are making shit up.

 

[Natebishop3]

Now you are making shot up.

Interesting..... which part? Do you want me to start linking you articles about what the NSA has been up to since 9/11?

Or maybe just the complete disregard for public opinion about something like Net Neutrality?

Or maybe you saw how members of the Turkish security force assaulted US citizens not even a year ago on US soil and our government did nothing to protect us?

 

[Mote]

Yes. Completely ridiculous that an armed public is a deterrent from tyranny.

What I find interesting is that you're so willing to give your blind faith to a government that has shown repeated disregard for our rights, our privacy, and the constitution in the past (almost) 20 years. Probably longer, but the creation of the patriot act among many other blatant trespasses against our personal freedom has really stepped it up since 9/11.

I don't even own an AR-15 at this point, but our founding fathers understood the necessity of an armed public to prevent outright tyrannical control from a government. That's why they put the second amendment into the constitution in the first place.

We have a winner! That we are even having a discussion regarding the intents of our 2nd Amendment is indicative of the abject failure in historical education brought to us by the NEA and other leftist educators.

 

[Natebishop3]

We have a winner! That we are even having a discussion regarding the intents of our 2nd Amendment is indicative of the abject failure in historical education brought to us by the NEA and other leftist educators.

It just amazes me how so many liberals can talk about how the government has failed us on education or healthcare, and they see the corruption going on with other parts of the government, and they talk about police violence and brutality, and they complain about defense spending........ but they see no reason to arm ourselves in case the government ever tries to go full 1984.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

It just amazes me how so many liberals can talk about how the government has failed us on education or healthcare, and they see the corruption going on with other parts of the government, and they talk about police violence and brutality, and they complain about defense spending........ but they see no reason to arm ourselves in case the government ever tries to go full 1984.

They don't like Putin and his puppet Trump but wanna give up the guns....hmmm, interesting.

I don't want to own any guns but I have a friend who is his own militia. Shit hits the fan and we're working together. He would need man power to protect his big Mexican family and I need guns and bullets to protect my wife.

Win win.

 

[DaLincolnJones]

When I got back from the war I was not old enough to buy a beer in San Diego..had to go to Mexico to drink...and the last thing I wanted to do was purchase a weapon....I didn't see it as a huge infringement on my age....if it keeps a high school kid from easily purchasing one...I think it needs to be looked at from the greater good perspective...and I don't include manually chambered hunting rifles or shotguns in the conversation....also when I returned from the war I don't recall any mass shootings stateside in schools, churches, movie theaters or concerts....times they are a changin'

I had to give this some thought. When I had completed my four active, I was obviously over 21, so it would have never occurred to me. I chose at that time not to have any guns, it was a conscious decision at the time.
Now that I have matured and do own some stuff, also my choice, the right to own them is highly valued and appreciated.

You see, we both made choices based upon our individual experiences. Oddly enough, we did the same at the time. Where you and I abstained, the next ten guys might choose to do differently. To me, they earned that right.

As far as bolt action, or pump shot guns, you have to be kidding, I pity the idiot that would face a competent marksman with a Garand or a properly outfitted Mossberg

so while you ignore those now, those to whom you listen to would gladly include the both

 

[DaLincolnJones]

and how do you know that? Sitting back and doing nothing certainly hasn't changed it has it? They aren't proposing taking guns they are proposing certain guns. Let's give it a try as it seems to have helped in other countries. Will it end gun violence? No, but if it reduces it then it is a win for everyone. Gun owners still get to keep legal guns.

Pretty simple. Look at the states and cities that have highly restrictive gun laws, ie Chicago or Maryland or Detroit. Not working out so well, is it.

 

[riverman]

Bull! When you put forth what you want as law, and you know does not comply with the Constitution, you disrespect it and all those that do cherish the rule of law.

my post had nothing to do with nationalism....yours said you don't respect a lot of people ...swoosh..right over the noggin..not all forum members here are Yanks

 

[Lanny]

and how do you know that? Sitting back and doing nothing certainly hasn't changed it has it? They aren't proposing taking guns they are proposing certain guns. Let's give it a try as it seems to have helped in other countries. Will it end gun violence? No, but if it reduces it then it is a win for everyone. Gun owners still get to keep legal guns.

Isn't the goal supposed to be saving lives, especially the lives of our children?

 

[Lanny]

Because the kind of protection that they provide is not from an intruder, or a rapist, but from the government..... which was the entire point of the second amendment in the first place.

In my opinion, the purpose of the Second Amendment was to control the slaves. In a biography of Alexander Hamilton that I read, they discussed how every man was required to own a firearm and drill with the local militia for the sole purpose of preventing any uprising by the slaves who outnumbered the whites in some areas. Hence the remark in the Amendment about a well regulated militia.

Slavery was legal when the Constitution and the Bill of Rights bacame the law of the land.

Without the stain that was slavery, I see no need for the Second Amendment since the only well regulated militia would be the National Guard.

There could still be reasonable provision for those with a legitimate need for firearm protection, hunting and target shooting, even protecting your home.

 

[DaLincolnJones]

In my opinion, the purpose of the Second Amendment was to control the slaves. In a biography of Alexander Hamilton that I read, they discussed how every man was required to own a firearm and drill with the local militia for the sole purpose of preventing any uprising by the slaves who outnumbered the whites in some areas. Hence the remark in the Amendment about a well regulated militia.

Slavery was legal when the Constitution and the Bill of Rights bacame the law of the land.

Without the stain that was slavery, I see no need for the Second Amendment since the only well regulated militia would be the National Guard.

There could still be reasonable provision for those with a legitimate need for firearm protection, hunting and target shooting, even protecting your home.

Wow, Lanny. that is contrived. You really should write fiction as professional.

The fact is that we had no professional army (full time). Then as it is now, every man 18 to 45 is subject to being called up to serve in the militia. The intent is to protect the sovereignty of the United States from all enemies foreign and domestic.

 

[Natebishop3]

In my opinion, the purpose of the Second Amendment was to control the slaves

Why?

They had just gotten out of a war with a tyrannical empire that tried to disarm them. They put a number of safeguards into the constitution to protect the people from that kind of government taking over again. Example - they prevented the government from establishing a state religion like the Church of England.

They specifically say that the 2nd amendment is about maintaining a free state. It didn't have anything to do with slavery.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Very simple. Nothing to do with hunting or protecting your home from an intruder. Entirely about maintaining a free country.

 

[barfo]

Do you know what the odds are that you'll ever be shot, let alone by an AR-15? You people need to focus your energy elsewhere. I swear to god, if they actually reported on every single car accident that happened every day nobody would want to drive. You are significantly more likely to be in a car wreck. I have been in four separate car wrecks, none of which were my fault, in my lifetime. I have never been shot or shot at. Not once. I have been around a lot of guns in my lifetime. Never seen someone shot, never felt the urge to shoot at another human being. There are hundreds of millions of guns in this country, and yet the number of people who are shot every year is a fraction of a percent. The number of people who are killed by drunk drivers or just plain negligence is staggering. You guys are fixated on the wrong thing.

So, MS researchers are fixated on the wrong thing because cancer kills more people?

It's ok if not everyone fixates on the same thing. We've actually made progress on auto safety, and there are indeed people fixated on that.

We've made no apparent progress on gun safety.

I've been in more auto accidents (2) than shot at (1). I would prefer not to repeat either experience.

barfo