OT: Are the Timberwolves a disappointment?

[Denny Crane]

Good for you.

 

[Denny Crane]

Give the fact that Thibs is 8th on that list, exactly one win ahead of Nate McMillan, isn't really helping your case. Did the Blazers fire one of the best coaches in NBA history when they let Nate go?

BNM

He's 8th on the list in 5 seasons. He's first per 82 games.

Edit 2nd behind Bird.

 

[BonesJones]

I knew they wouldnt be as good as people thought they would be. Wiggins isn't much better than Rudy Gay. He can score but is below average at everything else. Lavine can score but is below everything at everything else. Dunn and Rubio are below average NBA PGs, and they have no bench at the wing spots.

 

[Boob-No-More]

He's 8th on the list in 5 seasons. He's first per 82 games.

Edit 2nd behind Bird.

And that's just since 1980. NBA history goes back to 1946-47. If you're going to claim something is one of the best in history, you need to include all of history.

Plus, it's kind of a made up metric to suit their agenda from the same people whose models gave Trump a 23% chance of winning the morning of the election. They are great at crunching numbers, but not always great at interpretting the results.

BNM

 

[MARIS61]

The Brush Puppies have surprised me by jumping out of the gate at a torrid 6-14 pace.

A full 2 games ahead of what I expected.

 

[riverman]

eye test.....Thibs is a great defensive coach...yeah Denny, he knows the game very well.....but even YOU dumped the Bulls....I always thought it was the front office but Thibs isn't a very diplomatic guy

 

[riverman]

He won at a higher rate than anyone in history over those 5 years

??

 

[Denny Crane]

And that's just since 1980. NBA history goes back to 1946-47. If you're going to claim something is one of the best in history, you need to include all of history.

Plus, it's kind of a made up metric to suit their agenda from the same people whose models gave Trump a 23% chance of winning the morning of the election. They are great at crunching numbers, but not always great at interpretting the results.

BNM

Those people got their start as sports sabermatricians. Their models are what they are.

In an injury plagued season for the team, the Bulls traded away 40 MPG Luol Deng, with the intent of tanking for a draft pick. 59 games later, the Bulls were in the playoffs with 48 wins, led by DJ Augustine. There was no healthy talent on the team aside from Carlos Boozer on his last legs, Taj Gibson, and Noah. He built an offense around Noah, who had 8 games of 10+ assists and finished with 5.4 APG.

That is Thibs designing a winning offense around the players he had to work with.

Previous seasons, the offense was geared around Rose, setting picks for him, etc.

Several midget PGs stepped in for Rose and had career seasons. Nate Robinson, John Lucas III, Aaron Brooks, and Augustine.

And like I said, given Pau and Noah, he designed a twin towers offense.

That's three very different offenses in 5 seasons. And in the last season, he was playing really old guys: Hinrich, Gasol, Dunleavy - and won. Second round, won 2 games against LeBron and the Cavs.

Rose was already good, but under Thibs won MVP. I am shocked that Noah stuck in the league, or at most be anything but a role player... he ended up being a two time all star under Thibs. Jimmy Butler was a #30 pick who grew to become an all star and in the conversation for best SG, and DPOY.

Sorry, but I disagree that he's not as good at offense as defense. Defense is what you do to win games when you're outmatched talentwise. If that's what he had to do he did it. And won.

Asked if he'd prefer a starter for his offense or defense, Thibs would say "offense."

He started and played Carlos Boozer, one of the worst defenders I ever saw. And won 60+ games back to back.

He's got the three kids in Minny scoring big. Once they buy in to trying on defense, that team is going to be way better than any of those Bulls teams.

 

[riverman]

He took a team that was gutted, as if to tank, and won 48 games and to the 2nd round.

Sounds like what Stotts did last year

 

[riverman]

Once they buy in to trying on defense, that team is going to be way better than any of those Bulls teams

I have no doubt about this...provided he pays attention to team culture...something he has lacked in the past....don't get me wrong...it was a smart hire my Minny ...we'll see what he does with it....Chicago fired him if I remember right

 

[Denny Crane]

eye test.....Thibs is a great defensive coach...yeah Denny, he knows the game very well.....but even YOU dumped the Bulls....I always thought it was the front office but Thibs isn't a very diplomatic guy

I dumped the Bulls because they dumped Thibs, among many other reasons. It was the last straw. They undercut him a lot, too. Never an in season trade to help improve the team's chances. Lots of leaks in the press to make him look bad.

They chased Phil Jackson out of town. They fired Skiles on Christmas Eve. They cut Corey Blount a day after he could sign with a team and make the playoff roster (someone would have grabbed him).

They passed on a draft day trade that would have been DWade. They passed on a Gasol for Deng trade (Gasol went to LA for 3 championships).

Never cared to try and win. Thibs tried 100% of the time. Wrong place to do that.

Edit: they fired Bill Cartwright in one of the most classless manners possible. He's one of the real good guys in this world.

 

[Denny Crane]

Sounds like what Stotts did last year

I like Stotts a lot.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Those people got their start as sports sabermatricians. Their models are what they are.

In an injury plagued season for the team, the Bulls traded away 40 MPG Luol Deng, with the intent of tanking for a draft pick. 59 games later, the Bulls were in the playoffs with 48 wins, led by DJ Augustine. There was no healthy talent on the team aside from Carlos Boozer on his last legs, Taj Gibson, and Noah. He built an offense around Noah, who had 8 games of 10+ assists and finished with 5.4 APG.

That is Thibs designing a winning offense around the players he had to work with.

Previous seasons, the offense was geared around Rose, setting picks for him, etc.

Several midget PGs stepped in for Rose and had career seasons. Nate Robinson, John Lucas III, Aaron Brooks, and Augustine.

And like I said, given Pau and Noah, he designed a twin towers offense.

That's three very different offenses in 5 seasons. And in the last season, he was playing really old guys: Hinrich, Gasol, Dunleavy - and won. Second round, won 2 games against LeBron and the Cavs.

Rose was already good, but under Thibs won MVP. I am shocked that Noah stuck in the league, or at most be anything but a role player... he ended up being a two time all star under Thibs. Jimmy Butler was a #30 pick who grew to become an all star and in the conversation for best SG, and DPOY.

Sorry, but I disagree that he's not as good at offense as defense. Defense is what you do to win games when you're outmatched talentwise. If that's what he had to do he did it. And won.

Asked if he'd prefer a starter for his offense or defense, Thibs would say "offense."

He started and played Carlos Boozer, one of the worst defenders I ever saw. And won 60+ games back to back.

He's got the three kids in Minny scoring big. Once they buy in to trying on defense, that team is going to be way better than any of those Bulls teams.

Not sure why you directed all that at me. I never made one single comment about Thibs as an offensive coach. All I pointed out was he tends to grate on his players after a while and that his first five seasons in CHI were not any kind of historic best.

BNM

 

[riverman]

Lots of leaks in the press to make him look bad

You like this sentence a whole lot......I read things that contend he had a major role is the deterioration of his relationship with the FO.....at some point, you go with the news reel....we can say every news story is a leak to make someone look bad but then sometimes, they actually do make themselves look bad..nothing gave me a reason to doubt it...

 

[Denny Crane]

Not sure why you directed all that at me. I never made one single comment about Thibs as an offensive coach. All I pointed out was he tends to grate on his players after a while and that his first five seasons in CHI were not any kind of historic best.

BNM

He grated on management, not the players.

If he lost them, they wouldn't have put out for him, especially the last season. There was a lot of talk about how Thibs might save his job if he beat the Cavs. Tho they won 2, the Cavs had LeBron, Irving, and Love to Butler and Pau.

 

[riverman]

I like Stotts a lot.

I like Thibs a lot.....what I want is a Stotts/Thibs coaching team....I just believe Thibs is better suited to the defensive coordinator job than the head coaching position.

 

[Denny Crane]

You like this sentence a whole lot......I read things that contend he had a major role is the deterioration of his relationship with the FO.....at some point, you go with the news reel....we can say every news story is a leak to make someone look bad but then sometimes, they actually do make themselves look bad..nothing gave me a reason to doubt it...

I gave you the newsreel. Jackson, Cartwright, Skiles, Del Negro, and Thibs.

The only constant is the dysfunctional ownership and management.

 

[Denny Crane]

I like Thibs a lot.....what I want is a Stotts/Thibs coaching team....I just believe Thibs is better suited to the defensive coordinator job than the head coaching position.

Thibs isn't going to take an assistant job. He's an elite head coach. Stotts wouldn't at this point, either.

 

[riverman]

Thibs isn't going to take an assistant job. He's an elite head coach. Stotts wouldn't at this point, either.

I know...but if they did....that's the best coaching team you could buy not named Pop

 

[riverman]

The only constant is the dysfunctional ownership and management.

I've never been a Bulls fan....I know they have a reputation of being cheap....but the Lakers have fired probably more coaches recently and the Kings....what I didn't like was Thibs reaction to the whole situation...team and front office...thought he handled it badly

 

[Denny Crane]

I've never been a Bulls fan....I know they have a reputation of being cheap....but the Lakers have fired probably more coaches recently and the Kings....what I didn't like was Thibs reaction to the whole situation...team and front office...thought he handled it badly

Thibs took the high road. The owner made a statement critical of Thibs.

I'm not mad about coaches getting fired, in general.

How does PJax not die of old age on the Bulls sideline? Firing the coach on Christmas Eve? That's downright mean. I wanted Skiles gone, but not like that. HE is the coach that loses his team after 4 years. He's perfect for college coaching.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

A lot of people thought they'd challenge for a playoff spot. For all the criticism of the Blazers, the Wolves are 10 times worse. Thoughts? KAT and Wiggins overrated?

Wiggins and Lavine yes, KAT no.

Maybe they're too young a team for Thibs?

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Thibs should (probably is) try to get Deng off the Lakers.

 

[KingSpeed]

I dumped the Bulls because they dumped Thibs, among many other reasons. It was the last straw. They undercut him a lot, too. Never an in season trade to help improve the team's chances. Lots of leaks in the press to make him look bad.

They chased Phil Jackson out of town. They fired Skiles on Christmas Eve. They cut Corey Blount a day after he could sign with a team and make the playoff roster (someone would have grabbed him).

They passed on a draft day trade that would have been DWade. They passed on a Gasol for Deng trade (Gasol went to LA for 3 championships).

Never cared to try and win. Thibs tried 100% of the time. Wrong place to do that.

Edit: they fired Bill Cartwright in one of the most classless manners possible. He's one of the real good guys in this world.

Gasol only won 2 championships

 

[Denny Crane]

Gasol only won 2 championships

Whatever

The Bulls didn't make the trade. When asked about it, $billionaire owner Jerry Reinsdorf said (rough quote), "If you trade for a player like that, you have to build a team of good players around him."

It is so excellent to be a fan of a team with an owner like PA.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Given their youth, their upside, their coach and their points differential I would expect that they will only get better as the season progresses.

I wouldn't be disappointed if I were a T-Pups fan.

 

[BlazerBeav]

I can't even imagine being a T-Pups fan. They haven't made the playoffs since 2004 - and haven't even come close for most of those years. Add on to that, the idea of living in Minneapolis. *Shudder*

 

[Pinwheel1]

The TWolves are sitting pretty. They eventually will get that last piece. But right now they need that quick scoring PG who can take over late in games. One who is deadly from deep as well.

 

[chzbrgr]

Let it bake these guys are like us last year they know they got THE guy in KAT just need some of that cast to start being more consistent and they could go on a little run like we did last year. Its a long season and they are YOUNG.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

The TWolves are sitting pretty. They eventually will get that last piece. But right now they need that quick scoring PG who can take over late in games. One who is deadly from deep as well.

Time isn't necessarily on the side of any team. Wiggins and Levine are UFAs after 2017-18. If they suck this year, and again next, they might leave. If they do, that's when KAT decided whether to sign an extension. If he doesn't, he is a UFA the following year.

Of course, the opposite could happen. They could suck this year, strike Lottery Gold AGAIN, and become a perennial playoff team.

We'll see.