OT: Evan Turner

[PapaG]

I'm doing the rare internet message board mea culpa and admit I was wrong on Evan Turner.

I thought that he would be a very good NBA player right out of the box, and he is not. Whether that is due to playing with an overrated "star" like Iggy, I don't know, but a great rookie should be able to be better than an 8.7 PER, regardless of playing with a 16.4 PER "star" who is at the same position.

I was wrong. Ed O., among a few others, were correct.

 

[Nikolokolus]

It might be just a shade premature to write him completely off.

 

[PapaG]

It might be just a shade premature to write him completely off.

I thought he was going to be like Brandon Roy. So far, he's more like Mike Dunleavy Jr., except with a much lower rookie PER.

 

[Nikolokolus]

*shrug*

 

[huevonkiller]

Has he been hurt? If he tries real hard he could get to Mario Chalmers off-peak level. Lol, just kidding. Who knows what happens to this dude.

 

[Hey]

He has an occasional great game.

 

[huevonkiller]

Well, I wish him well at least.

 

[Natebishop3]

Buy low, sell high. I'd make an offer...

 

[Nikolokolus]

Buy low, sell high. I'd make an offer...

Like what?

 

[Minstrel]

Buy low, sell high. I'd make an offer...

You sound like quite the market maven.

 

[Natebishop3]

You sound like quite the market maven.

Hours and hours at the auction house have made me into a real picker.

 

[Natebishop3]

Like what?

I would do this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2fo7m8h

and then this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2cjh5fp

We sent out
Joel Przybilla
Greg Oden
Nic Batum
Marcus Camby
Andre Miller
Rudy Fernandez

We get
Devin Harris
Derrick Favors
Elton Brand
Kris Humphries
Evan Turner

Our lineup is
Devin Harris/Patty Mills/Johnson
Evan Turner/Brandon Roy
Wes Matthews/Dante Cunningham/Babbitt
LaMarcus Aldridge/Derrick Favors/Kris Humphries
Elton Brand/Sean Marks

Our young core to build around is Favors, Aldridge, Matthews, and Turner. That's not bad at all. Harris is still pretty young too. Yeah, we give up Oden, but we get some pretty solid young pieces for the future. This is blow it up mode. I'd assume we also get a decent draft pick.

 

[LameR]

I would do this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2fo7m8h

and then this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2cjh5fp

We sent out
Joel Przybilla
Greg Oden
Nic Batum
Marcus Camby
Andre Miller
Rudy Fernandez

We get
Devin Harris
Derrick Favors
Elton Brand
Kris Humphries
Evan Turner

Our lineup is
Devin Harris/Patty Mills/Johnson
Evan Turner/Brandon Roy
Wes Matthews/Dante Cunningham/Babbitt
LaMarcus Aldridge/Derrick Favors/Kris Humphries
Elton Brand/Sean Marks

Our young core to build around is Favors, Aldridge, Matthews, and Turner. That's not bad at all. Harris is still pretty young too. Yeah, we give up Oden, but we get some pretty solid young pieces for the future. This is blow it up mode. I'd assume we also get a decent draft pick.

LOL. Why would the Nuggets EVER do that? They trade Melo to NJ and don't get Harris OR Favors!?

 

[Natebishop3]

LOL. Why would the Nuggets EVER do that? They trade Melo to NJ and don't get Harris OR Favors!?

LOL. I don't know, why? ZOMG

They supposedly covet Batum. The rumors supposedly had us getting Harris, maybe we could get Favors as well if it gets closer to the trade deadline. But hey, I'm glad I gave you a laugh.

 

[hasoos]

I'll throw this out there for discussion. One reason he is struggling right now is Philadelphia is a team that has personnel that a mix of guys that are good in half court and guys that are good in an up tempo game. As Doug Collins said earlier this season, some of their pieces don't "fit". Turner and Brand are optimized for half court. The rest of the team is optimized for up tempo. What you get is a mismatched team that struggles for identity. Whenever they go into offense, Turner plays more like Roy, but without the passing ability. So he often gets himself in trouble. They moved Brand to center in order to try and make him fit better with up tempo. He still often looks like he just doesn't fit there, because he isn't suited for the up and down game.

So that being said, I think Turner would do a hell of a lot better on a low tempo team that runs a lot of half court sets. I wouldn't be surprised if Philly moved him for a SG that fits their system.

 

[Ed O]

Turner doesn't do anything particularly well. He is a good rebounder, but rebounding from a shooting guard is not that valuable.

He's not terribly athletic, he's not a good shooter, he's not particularly quick.

I just didn't think he was nearly the prospect that Wall was. And so far I look like I'm right.

I didn't anticipate him to be an all-out stinker, though, like he has been so far this season. I'd anticipate him improving--even though he's not particularly young for a rookie--and I would definitely like (depending on the acquisition cost, of course) to see him as a Blazer.

Ed O.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I would do this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2fo7m8h

and then this
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2cjh5fp

We sent out
Joel Przybilla
Greg Oden
Nic Batum
Marcus Camby
Andre Miller
Rudy Fernandez

We get
Devin Harris
Derrick Favors
Elton Brand
Kris Humphries
Evan Turner

Our lineup is
Devin Harris/Patty Mills/Johnson
Evan Turner/Brandon Roy
Wes Matthews/Dante Cunningham/Babbitt
LaMarcus Aldridge/Derrick Favors/Kris Humphries
Elton Brand/Sean Marks

Our young core to build around is Favors, Aldridge, Matthews, and Turner. That's not bad at all. Harris is still pretty young too. Yeah, we give up Oden, but we get some pretty solid young pieces for the future. This is blow it up mode. I'd assume we also get a decent draft pick.

It seems pretty bloody unlikely, but I kind of like where it leaves us. Certainly deeper in the front-court, healthier and a point guard with a reasonably high skill level for at least a few years. Turner is almost an afterthought in the deal for me, but I'd be willing to take a chance on him turning into a half-way decent wing.

 

[hasoos]

Turner doesn't do anything particularly well. He is a good rebounder, but rebounding from a shooting guard is not that valuable.

He's not terribly athletic, he's not a good shooter, he's not particularly quick.

I just didn't think he was nearly the prospect that Wall was. And so far I look like I'm right.

I didn't anticipate him to be an all-out stinker, though, like he has been so far this season. I'd anticipate him improving--even though he's not particularly young for a rookie--and I would definitely like (depending on the acquisition cost, of course) to see him as a Blazer.

Ed O.

I would have still took Cousins at 2, even if he is kind of a fuckhead.

 

[Minstrel]

I would have still took Cousins at 2, even if he is kind of a fuckhead.

Same here. I thought Wall was clearly the best prospect going into the draft and Cousins had the next highest ceiling (though, of course, a lot of risk...but if you're drafting #2, you'd better go for the greatest star potential, not safest floor).

 

[Ed O]

I would have still took Cousins at 2, even if he is kind of a fuckhead.

I think I would have gone with Turner at #2 because I have serious doubts whether Cousins will ever put it together.

I definitely would have taken Cousins at #3, though.

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

I think I would have gone with Turner at #2 because I have serious doubts whether Cousins will ever put it together.

I definitely would have taken Cousins at #3, though.

Ed O.

The crazy thing about last summer's draft is that the rookies are just so bad. Wall is putting up a 16.8 PER, which is OK, but outside of that, the rest of the lottery picks are at 14.4 (Cousins) or under, with many in single digits.

Just a terrible, terrible draft in terms of on-court production.

 

[MickZagger]

It took Kobe 4 years to get his PER above 20. Dwyane Wade's rookie PER was 17.6

Its no secret that last years draft class was one of the worst in a few years.

 

[PapaG]

It took Kobe 4 years to get his PER above 20. Dwyane Wade's rookie PER was 17.6

Its no secret that last years draft class was one of the worst in a few years.

It was a secret to me, until I looked up the actual stats.

 

[Minstrel]

The crazy thing about last summer's draft is that the rookies are just so bad. Wall is putting up a 16.8 PER, which is OK, but outside of that, the rest of the lottery picks are at 14.4 (Cousins) or under, with many in single digits.

Just a terrible, terrible draft in terms of on-court production.

It's a pretty young draft. The highest talent guys were largely seen to be Wall, Turner, Cousins and Favors, in no particular order. Among them, only Evan Turner was 20 or older at the time of the draft. So, I think it's unsurprising that they're not terribly productive as rookies. They're largely rawer high risk/high reward prospects than the Elton Brand or Brandon Roy types of picks.

 

[PapaG]

It's a pretty young draft. The highest talent guys were largely seen to be Wall, Turner, Cousins and Favors, in no particular order. Among them, only Evan Turner was 20 or older at the time of the draft. So, I think it's unsurprising that they're not terribly productive as rookies. They're largely rawer high risk/high reward prospects than the Elton Brand or Brandon Roy types of picks.

Wesley Johnson was almost 23 when he was drafted. 2 out of the top 4 picks were over 21 when drafted, and both of those players have a PER of under 10.3.



It's a bad rookie draft class, old and young players included.

 

[Minstrel]

It's a bad rookie draft class, old and young players included.

It's a bad first year of production, certainly. If several of them become stars or superstars in 3-4 years, I wouldn't agree that it's a bad draft class.

 

[Denny Crane]

I thought Turner was a tough pick for Philly. He's basically projected to be the same player as Iggy, and there isn't a real good fit to have 2x Iggy types on the same team or on the court together.

What is surprising is how bad his December was.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I'm not one to write off Turner yet. He does need to find his shot, though, if he's not going to run or get to the hoop

His fortes were in the transition game, in running the P&R, court vision and being able to guard 3 positions. Don't know why it hasn't translated yet, but those are skills that should be working in the NBA. And why I still think he'd be pretty amazing on our team.