OT LMAO Rockets, Bosh going back to Miami

[Pinwheel1]

I'd love for the Rockets to get Rondo. He's the opposite of what they need. Ballhandling abilities limited because of Harden. Can't shoot a lick from the 3 point line.

You could be right as Rondo tends to dominate the ball, but they play pretty well with Beverly, who is basically a poor mans Rondo. They do need his D and that is why I would prefer it not happen. Hopefully his personality would not mesh with Harden.....

 

[julius]

cap scape

Capspace helps Boston how?

 

[blue9]

Getting the ball out of Harden's hands and into Rondo's would be the best thing for HOU. Get Harden playing off-ball and Rondo will find him for open jumpers or cutting to the hoop for lay-ups. Rondo and Howard will make up for Harden's inability to defend.

 

[B-Roy]

Morey is delusional, just listened to an interview where he says history has shown that you need 3 elite players to win with very little exception. Bullshit. The elusive 3rd star is Houston's RLEC, it's mystical, magical, and it doesn't exist.

Of the last decade, only Miami, Boston and maybe the early Spurs titles had 3 elite stars. Obviously the Spurs are just good, no one is going to call Manu elite in their last title and if we're being perfectly honest, Duncan wasn't elite either.

The Lakers had Kobe/Gasol and Kobe/Shaq. The Mavericks only had Dirk. The Heat had Shaq/Wade. The Pistons had no elite players. The freaking 6 time champion Bulls only had two elite players (granted they had Jordan, maybe that counts for two?) Either way, I'm sure Morey is going to be chasing that third guy until Howard and Harden are old and decrepit.

 

[magnifier661]

Getting the ball out of Harden's hands and into Rondo's would be the best thing for HOU. Get Harden playing off-ball and Rondo will find him for open jumpers or cutting to the hoop for lay-ups. Rondo and Howard will make up for Harden's inability to defend.

Doing that will completely take Harden out of his game. Harden is much like Roy, where he needs the ball in his hands to be effective. The moment you start taking that away, he will be an average star.

 

[Natebishop3]

Morey is delusional, just listened to an interview where he says history has shown that you need 3 elite players to win with very little exception. Bullshit. The elusive 3rd star is Houston's RLEC, it's mystical, magical, and it doesn't exist.

Of the last decade, only Miami, Boston and maybe the early Spurs titles had 3 elite stars. Obviously the Spurs are just good, no one is going to call Manu elite in their last title and if we're being perfectly honest, Duncan wasn't elite either.

The Lakers had Kobe/Gasol and Kobe/Shaq. The Mavericks only had Dirk. The Heat had Shaq/Wade. The Pistons had no elite players. The freaking 6 time champion Bulls only had two elite players (granted they had Jordan, maybe that counts for two?) Either way, I'm sure Morey is going to be chasing that third guy until Howard and Harden are old and decrepit.

While I completely agree with you, didn't the Bulls have Rodman who is arguably the best rebounder ever?

 

[3RA1N1AC]

While I completely agree with you, didn't the Bulls have Rodman who is arguably the best rebounder ever?

they did for 3? of them

 

[Minstrel]

While I completely agree with you, didn't the Bulls have Rodman who is arguably the best rebounder ever?

And one of the best defenders ever. He's arguably a "third elite" player.

I think Morey is overstating it. The '80s were largely dominated by "three star" teams (in terms of championships). The '90s were largely dominated by the Bulls (who arguably had three stars for their second threepeat, but didn't for their first threepeat) and a little bit by the Rockets (who never approached three true stars). The 2000s were dominated by two-star teams in the Lakers and early Spurs and arguably a three star team in the late Spurs.

Overall, I'd say that if you have a top-ten player of all-time, you need only two stars. If you don't, you probably need three. The Rockets don't have anything close to a top-ten player of all-time, so I don't think Morey is delusional, but his argument (if all he said was "history shows you need three elite players") is incomplete.

 

[Strenuus]

Doing that will completely take Harden out of his game. Harden is much like Roy, where he needs the ball in his hands to be effective. The moment you start taking that away, he will be an average star.

What you meant to say was "He needs the ball to be in his hands to be effective at standing sideways and trying to create a phantom foul". That's his game.

 

[magnifier661]

What you meant to say was "He needs the ball to be in his hands to be effective at standing sideways and trying to create a phantom foul". That's his game.

Whatever the case, if he's not getting to the foul line, he will be effective. He can't draw fouls playing like Reggie Miller. That's not his style.

 

[Natebishop3]

And one of the best defenders ever. He's arguably a "third elite" player.

I think Morey is overstating it. The '80s were largely dominated by "three star" teams (in terms of championships). The '90s were largely dominated by the Bulls (who arguably had three stars for their second threepeat, but didn't for their first threepeat) and a little bit by the Rockets (who never approached three true stars). The 2000s were dominated by two-star teams in the Lakers and early Spurs and arguably a three star team in the late Spurs.

Overall, I'd say that if you have a top-ten player of all-time, you need only two stars. If you don't, you probably need three. The Rockets don't have anything close to a top-ten player of all-time, so I don't think Morey is delusional, but his argument (if all he said was "history shows you need three elite players") is incomplete.

I think that's the key. You have to have at least one top tier talent to win a championship. Someone who is bound for the Hall of Fame. You can surround him with lower-tier All-Star type players, but you have to have that one really great player. There has been one exception, the Detroit Pistons, but that's really it.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Doing that will completely take Harden out of his game. Harden is much like Roy, where he needs the ball in his hands to be effective. The moment you start taking that away, he will be an average star.

He played great for OKC and they had Westbrook and Durant dominating the ball. He would still get plenty of touches with Rondo. Plus if you leave Rondo open he will attack the basket which will benefit Howard.

 

[blue9]

He played great for OKC and they had Westbrook and Durant dominating the ball. He would still get plenty of touches with Rondo. Plus if you leave Rondo open he will attack the basket which will benefit Howard.

Yup. It's not about what's best for Harden, it's about what's best for the TEAM. Harden dominating the ball is not what's best for HOU, much like Roy dominating the ball was not always the best for our team. If a SG can't play off-ball, fuck 'em.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

pushing beverly aside for rondo makes some sense, but not a lot.

they need a pf

 

[magnifier661]

He played great for OKC and they had Westbrook and Durant dominating the ball. He would still get plenty of touches with Rondo. Plus if you leave Rondo open he will attack the basket which will benefit Howard.

Bro, Harden would be the ISO guy almost all the time. You don't remember?

 

[Natebishop3]

pushing beverly aside for rondo makes some sense, but not a lot.

they need a pf

Yes, and they have cap space!!11!11111!!!!

 

[Wizard Mentor]

I don't think you need 3 stars. Basically, if you have 2 pretty boys then you need an elite rebounder/defender. No matter how good your guys are, you need to rebound the ball. That's why LBJ just mentioned Anderson Verejao by name when talking about his new team. The bulls had Horace Grant, then Dennis Rodman - not a coincidence.

And one of the best defenders ever. He's arguably a "third elite" player.

I think Morey is overstating it. The '80s were largely dominated by "three star" teams (in terms of championships). The '90s were largely dominated by the Bulls (who arguably had three stars for their second threepeat, but didn't for their first threepeat) and a little bit by the Rockets (who never approached three true stars). The 2000s were dominated by two-star teams in the Lakers and early Spurs and arguably a three star team in the late Spurs.

Overall, I'd say that if you have a top-ten player of all-time, you need only two stars. If you don't, you probably need three. The Rockets don't have anything close to a top-ten player of all-time, so I don't think Morey is delusional, but his argument (if all he said was "history shows you need three elite players") is incomplete.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

Yes, and they have cap space!!11!11111!!!!

i could see if they had like 30 million so they could eat gwall or kevin martin in addition to love or rondo...but no.

 

[Natebishop3]

God I hate the Rockets... they've seriously passed the Lakers and Knicks as that annoying team that thinks they can get anyone for next to nothing.

http://dimemag.com/2014/07/report-rockets-will-go-rondo-love/

 

[B-Roy]

I think that's the key. You have to have at least one top tier talent to win a championship. Someone who is bound for the Hall of Fame. You can surround him with lower-tier All-Star type players, but you have to have that one really great player. There has been one exception, the Detroit Pistons, but that's really it.

Rockets are/were close with what they had. You have to look at what is available in the current pool of players. Right now, there's only two generational talents (in their primes) in the entire league: LeBron and Durant. Houston might have had a shot at LeBron, but lets be serious, they weren't really in contention for his services. Still, Houston has the next best thing: two top 10 players. They have both the best shooting guard and the best center in the league, who are both close to generational players. Serious contention should have been possible if they surrounded their stars with the right players and the right coaching.

 

[Natebishop3]

Rockets are/were close with what they had. You have to look at what is available in the current pool of players. Right now, there's only two generational talents (in their primes) in the entire league: LeBron and Durant. Houston might have had a shot at LeBron, but lets be serious, they weren't really in contention for his services. Still, Houston has the next best thing: two top 10 players. They have both the best shooting guard and the best center in the league, who are both close to generational players. Serious contention should have been possible if they surrounded their stars with the right players and the right coaching.

I think you could make a case that Chris Paul is a generational player, but I feel like he's lost a little bit of his game since going to LAC. Dude was amazing with the Hornets.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Bro, Harden would be the ISO guy almost all the time. You don't remember?

Yeah but that was my point. With OKC they had Westbrook and they had Durant and Harden still had opportunities to be the ISO guy for a team who won the western conference. (The only time they won the western conference)

At the same time Westbrook and Durant also had plenty of opportunities to go ISO. Now I admit a PG like Lin probably sounds better for Harden on paper since he could spread the floor, but Rondo does so many other things well that I still think they would be better off. Plus he would be guarding Lillard.......and that would suck.

 

[B-Roy]

Yeah but that was my point. With OKC they had Westbrook and they had Durant and Harden still had opportunities to be the ISO guy for a team who won the western conference. (The only time they won the western conference)

At the same time Westbrook and Durant also had plenty of opportunities to go ISO. Now I admit a PG like Lin probably sounds better for Harden on paper since he could spread the floor, but Rondo does so many other things well that I still think they would be better off. Plus he would be guarding Lillard.......and that would suck.

Rockets would have to change their system though. Or at least tweak it significantly. Leave a real stretch 4 on the court at all times. Not saying they couldn't do that....but McHale.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

Yeah but that was my point. With OKC they had Westbrook and they had Durant and Harden still had opportunities to be the ISO guy for a team who won the western conference. (The only time they won the western conference)

At the same time Westbrook and Durant also had plenty of opportunities to go ISO. Now I admit a PG like Lin probably sounds better for Harden on paper since he could spread the floor, but Rondo does so many other things well that I still think they would be better off. Plus he would be guarding Lillard.......and that would suck.

doesnt beverly kind of approximate what that would look like? aka a 1st round exit?

 

[Minstrel]

I think you could make a case that Chris Paul is a generational player, but I feel like he's lost a little bit of his game since going to LAC. Dude was amazing with the Hornets.

I don't think he's lost much, if any, of his game and I agree that Paul is a generational talent.

 

[Natebishop3]

I don't think he's lost much, if any, of his game and I agree that Paul is a generational talent.

The only reason why I bring it up is because he was, at one time, a legit quadruple-double threat. I'm not sure if he can really do that anymore. He doesn't get as many steals, which I would attribute to his aging knees.

 

[Minstrel]

The only reason why I bring it up is because he was, at one time, a legit quadruple-double threat. I'm not sure if he can really do that anymore. He doesn't get as many steals, which I would attribute to his aging knees.

His knees might make him a bit less springy on defense, that's true. I'd attribute him not putting up monster stat lines anymore to playing with better talent now.

 

[blue32]

Fuck the rockettes.
So glad they are also fucking themselves.

Ariza..... LOL

 

[Natebishop3]

His knees might make him a bit less springy on defense, that's true. I'd attribute him not putting up monster stat lines anymore to playing with better talent now.

That's definitely possible. Either way, I think he's the best point guard of this generation. He took the torch from the Kidd's, Payton's, etc.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Rockets would have to change their system though. Or at least tweak it significantly. Leave a real stretch 4 on the court at all times. Not saying they couldn't do that....but McHale.

They should be doing that regardless. I know Dwight has always referred that. At least he said it when he played in LA.