PG's this offseason

[Further]

With all the talk about Paul and Parker, I thought that we should look at PG's that we know are on the market. Word out of NO is that Paul is off the market but that Darren Collison can be had if able to take on additional contracts. To me, the Collison trade seems like the most plausible for getting a quality PG. But, I thought we should talk about all the PG options. We have Miller, Bayless and the rooks, so perhaps we don't even target a PG, but it's my feeling belief that Miller, although a good PG, is not a good fit. Below is a list of all the free agent PG's.

Aside fromthe Parker, Paul, Collison, and aside from free agents, am I missing any PG's that are on the marker, and what would it take to get them.


By the way, when I made this list I left all PG's no matter how crappy or criminal. It's just a list.
Boston
restricted- 0
unrestricted - Nate Robinson

Charlotte
restricted - 0
unrestricted - Raymond Felton

Chicago
restrictd - 0
unrestricted - Acie Law, Ronald Murray, Jannero Pargo

Houston
restructed - Kyle Lowry
unrestructed- 0

Indiana
restricted -0
unrestricted - Earl Watson

L.A. Clippers
restricted - Bobby Brown, Mardy Collins
unrestricted - Steve Blake

L.A. Lakers
restricted - Jordan Farmar
unrestricted - Shannon Brown (player option), Derek Fisher

Memphis
unrestricted - Jamaal Tinsley

Miami
restricted - 0
unrestricted - Rafer Alston, Carlos Arroyo

Milwaukee
unrestricted - Royal Ivey, Luke Ridnour

Nets
unrestricted - Chris Quinn

Knicks
restricted - Sergio
unrestricted - Chris Duhon,

Oklahoma City
unrestricted - Kevin Ollie

Orlando
unrestricted - Jason Williams

Philadelphia
unrestricted - Allan Iverson

Utah
restricted - Wes Matthews

Washington
restricted - Randy Foye
unrestricted - Earl Boykins, Javaris Crittenton, Shaun Livingston

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

That is not an appealing list at all.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Which one of those could precious Brandon play with?

 

[Idog1976]

With all the talk about Paul and Parker, I thought that we should look at PG's that we know are on the market. Word out of NO is that Paul is off the market but that Darren Collison can be had if able to take on additional contracts. To me, the Collison trade seems like the most plausible for getting a quality PG. But, I thought we should talk about all the PG options. We have Miller, Bayless and the rooks, so perhaps we don't even target a PG, but it's my feeling belief that Miller, although a good PG, is not a good fit. Below is a list of all the free agent PG's.

Aside fromthe Parker, Paul, Collison, and aside from free agents, am I missing any PG's that are on the marker, and what would it take to get them.


By the way, when I made this list I left all PG's no matter how crappy or criminal. It's just a list.
Boston
restricted- 0
unrestricted - Nate Robinson

Charlotte
restricted - 0
unrestricted - Raymond Felton

Chicago
restrictd - 0
unrestricted - Acie Law, Ronald Murray, Jannero Pargo

Houston
restructed - Kyle Lowry
unrestructed- 0

Indiana
restricted -0
unrestricted - Earl Watson

L.A. Clippers
restricted - Bobby Brown, Mardy Collins
unrestricted - Steve Blake

L.A. Lakers
restricted - Jordan Farmar
unrestricted - Shannon Brown (player option), Derek Fisher

Memphis
unrestricted - Jamaal Tinsley

Miami
restricted - 0
unrestricted - Rafer Alston, Carlos Arroyo

Milwaukee
unrestricted - Royal Ivey, Luke Ridnour

Nets
unrestricted - Chris Quinn

Knicks
restricted - Sergio
unrestricted - Chris Duhon,

Oklahoma City
unrestricted - Kevin Ollie

Orlando
unrestricted - Jason Williams

Philadelphia
unrestricted - Allan Iverson

Utah
restricted - Wes Matthews

Washington
restricted - Randy Foye
unrestricted - Earl Boykins, Javaris Crittenton, Shaun Livingston

So it's Collison or bust then. I mean damn Shannon brown is next best ugh!

 

[hasoos]

Last I looked Wes Mathews isn't a PG.

 

[Minstrel]

Which one of those could precious Brandon play with?

Any of them, since Roy is a really good player who can adapt to a wide variety of roles. Which of them would maximize his abilities? Probably a guard who can defend point guards, shoot the ball and at least every so often get to the hoop, collapse the defense and either finish or find a teammate.

I believe Bayless can do the first and third. The shooting, though, I'm becoming a little concerned about. Hopefully he gets back to being a competent shooter, as he was in college.

So I'm a little less sure than I used to be that Bayless can be the long-term starting guard alongside Roy, but I still think it's quite possible.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

It seems like we're stocking up at PG and SF all of a sudden.

Miller - PG
Bayless - PG/SG
Johnson - PG/SG
Williams - PG/SG

Batum - SF
Babbitt - SF/PF
Cunningham - SF/PF
Claver - SF/PF (MB said there is a real chance he plays here this season)
Rudy - SG/SF

Setting up for a trade, perhaps?

 

[maxiep]

It seems like we're stocking up at PG and SF all of a sudden.

Miller - PG
Bayless - PG/SG
Johnson - PG/SG
Williams - PG/SG

Batum - SF
Babbitt - SF/PF
Cunningham - SF/PF
Claver - SF/PF (MB said there is a real chance he plays here this season)
Rudy - SG/SF

Setting up for a trade, perhaps?

That was my thought.

 

[RoyToy]

Miller/Bayless/Johnson
Roy/Rudy/Williams
Batum/Babbitt/Cunningham
Aldridge/Pendergraph/Claver
Oden/Camby

Doesn't look too terribly unbalanced. A lot of those guys are tweeners. I suppose you could still use a true backup 4.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Miller/Bayless/Johnson
Roy/Rudy/Williams
Batum/Babbitt/Cunningham
Aldridge/Pendergraph/Claver
Oden/Camby

Doesn't look too terribly unbalanced. A lot of those guys are tweeners. I suppose you could still use a true backup 4.

Assuming we won't go through the season unscathed , does it scare you that this is esentially the same line up we had last year? Given the track record of Oden and Roy, it's hard for me to be excited about the same basic team that lost 2 years in a row in the first round.

 

[Minstrel]

Assuming we won't go through the season unscathed , does it scare you that this is esentially the same line up we had last year? Given the track record of Oden and Roy, it's hard for me to be excited about the same basic team that lost 2 years in a row in the first round.

If you expect the same health results, then sure. But if you expect Oden to be injured every season from now on, the team might as well cut him.

I don't expect that kind of injury problem going forward. I think Oden may well suffer more injuries in his career, but not nearly as devastating in terms of games missed and not every season. I'm excited because there's a way Portland could be elite next season: good health. That trumps the vast majority of teams who have no real avenue to being elite next season. Sure, it would be better to be LA, who should be elite with little risk...but almost no team is in that situation.

 

[maxiep]

Assuming we won't go through the season unscathed , does it scare you that this is esentially the same line up we had last year? Given the track record of Oden and Roy, it's hard for me to be excited about the same basic team that lost 2 years in a row in the first round.

I don't think that's fair. Houston was literally THE WORST matchup we could have had. They taught us a lesson in playoff basketball. With the Suns, we were simply too depleted to compete over a seven game series. A healthy SA team got swept by that team.

If we're healthy, I think this group as currently constructed can compete for the Western Conference Title.

 

[Idog1976]

I don't think that's fair. Houston was literally THE WORST matchup we could have had. They taught us a lesson in playoff basketball. With the Suns, we were simply too depleted to compete over a seven game series. A healthy SA team got swept by that team.

If we're healthy, I think this group as currently constructed can compete for the Western Conference Title.

Health of Oden and Roy is everything for this team. Assuming the health of Oden and Roy (yes I know big assumption) then getting a PG like Collison makes us THE threat to LA in the West. The East is what truly terrifies me.

We need to go balls out for Collison. Oh if only we have moved in draft to get him last year...oh well.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I don't think that's fair. Houston was literally THE WORST matchup we could have had. They taught us a lesson in playoff basketball. With the Suns, we were simply too depleted to compete over a seven game series. A healthy SA team got swept by that team.

If we're healthy, I think this group as currently constructed can compete for the Western Conference Title.

Why?

Again, I'm just curious.

What has Portland done to make you think that? Is it because the organization says how great everyone is? The team just isn't constructed very well....and that's not a slam on KP. I think you have a coach that really likes the pace we are at. I know he screams run, but 9 years of coaching says differently. Miller and Roy are not a good fit. Batum is an athletic freak who's job is to spot up in the corner. Aldridge can't figure out that when he posts and demands the ball, we are a better team. Greg, as much as I love the guy, can't seem to stay healthy. And when he did, he didn't mesh well with Roy either. Bayless, Rudy, Babbitt, Cunningham, Williams and Johnson are all better suited to get up and down the floor. It's just not a good mix of good players.

 

[maxiep]

Why?

Again, I'm just curious.

What has Portland done to make you think that? Is it because the organization says how great everyone is? The team just isn't constructed very well....and that's not a slam on KP. I think you have a coach that really likes the pace we are at. I know he screams run, but 9 years of coaching says differently. Miller and Roy are not a good fit. Batum is an athletic freak who's job is to spot up in the corner. Aldridge can't figure out that when he posts and demands the ball, we are a better team. Greg, as much as I love the guy, can't seem to stay healthy. And when he did, he didn't mesh well with Roy either. Bayless, Rudy, Babbitt, Cunningham, Williams and Johnson are all better suited to get up and down the floor. It's just not a good mix of good players.

Because we haven't yet seen Greg Oden at 100%. If these injuries would be like Bynum's--where they're the same injury again and again--I'd fall into the "chronically injured" camp. However, these have been more bad luck than anything else.

Because we haven't yet seen this team really gel around a Roy, LMA, Oden troika. Last year it was just starting when GO went down. It's a tough adjustment for Roy to make, but I'm confident in his ability to adjust once he realized how a dominant low post player makes his life easier.

Because our players are still relatively young and are at the ages where they still improve in the offseason.

Because as good as Oden/Joel was in terms of rebounding %, Oden/Camby is even better.

Because Brandon Roy is still underrated, even after all the accolades.

Because this team was decimated by injuries and still won 50 games. I can't think of another team in the league that could have lost that much production and still made the playoffs.

Because I believe last year's injury bug was an aberration. We may have bumps and bruises during the year, but it won't be like last year.

Because I look at the "Team of The Future" in OKC who had perfect luck last year, and see that we beat them 3-1 with essentially one hand tied behind our back.

Because I look at the Western Conference and think we can beat anyone.

 

[Idog1976]

Because we haven't yet seen Greg Oden at 100%. If these injuries would be like Bynum's--where they're the same injury again and again--I'd fall into the "chronically injured" camp. However, these have been more bad luck than anything else.

Because we haven't yet seen this team really gel around a Roy, LMA, Oden troika. Last year it was just starting when GO went down. It's a tough adjustment for Roy to make, but I'm confident in his ability to adjust once he realized how a dominant low post player makes his life easier.

Because our players are still relatively young and are at the ages where they still improve in the offseason.

Because as good as Oden/Joel was in terms of rebounding %, Oden/Camby is even better.

Because Brandon Roy is still underrated, even after all the accolades.

Because this team was decimated by injuries and still won 50 games. I can't think of another team in the league that could have lost that much production and still made the playoffs.

Because I believe last year's injury bug was an aberration. We may have bumps and bruises during the year, but it won't be like last year.

Because I look at the "Team of The Future" in OKC who had perfect luck last year, and see that we beat them 3-1 with essentially one hand tied behind our back.

Because I look at the Western Conference and think we can beat anyone.

Fuckin A! Repped and Quoted for TRUTH!

The two biggest problems this team has is health and coaching in that order.

The first has to get better and I agree with Maxiep above Oden's injuries have been MADDENINGLY bad luck related, there is nowhere to go but up IMO especially for Oden. To be honest and many will think I'm batshit insane for saying this, but I'm far more worried about Roy's health over the next 5 to 7 years then Oden's. I think our window is next year and at most would last 7 years, I'm thinking maybe we only got 4 or so more good years out of Roy. Let's all pray Oden and Roy are healthy for a few seasons together. I actually think Oden being healthy will improve Brandon's health. Brandon won't have to carry the team as much once he and Oden feel each other out. They are too good not to figure it out especially Roy. If Oden is healthier we blow out more teams and Roy doesn't have to score as much = less wear on Roy.

The second gets better little by little. Nate isn't the quickest study, but he has gotten better over the years. His biggest weakness is personnel management and substitutions. He's certainly no offensive wizard and this team would do well to hire a real CONFIDENT and firm X's and O's guy as the offensive coordinator like a reverse Thibedeau. Nate is quite good at defensive strategies that was especially apparent this year with basically awful staff due to injuries. He also can seem to design plays IN THE MOMENT (rather then different offensive sets being practiced) and scores a ton out of a timeout, more then most coaches in the league. Nate often earns my ire, but if you think the GM talent pool is shallow, holy fuck look at the coaches available! Forget PJ, if leaves LA it's to go to LeBron otherwise he's hangin it up.

 

[Further]

Several differences I see.

This is assuming no big trades.
Batum has another year under him and he will be healthy (hopefully) going into the season. This alone I expect adds 3-5 wins.

Roy and Miller may not be a great match, but they were meshing much much better towards the end of last season then at the beginning, and that should also result in more wins. Also, Miller will be the Starting PG from day one instead of Blake.

Hopefully Roy and Oden stay mostly healthy. This is the big key. If they do, along with Batum, then this team will succeed. And I don't agree that Roy and Oden did not play well together. When you take into account that Oden was concentrating on D and Roy on O, I think they meshed decently. Nate had said that he was not looking for Oden on O much. If Oden stays healthy, then by the end of the season, perhaps this will change and Oden will start to develop a more consistent offensive game and some plays will be run for him. He is so freakishly strong with speed that if he gets comfortable on O I think great things will happen. But this can only happen if Oden finds himself able to play consistently and not get injured.

 

[Minstrel]

What has Portland done to make you think that? Is it because the organization says how great everyone is?

No, it's because Roy, Oden, Aldridge, Miller and Batum have all played well or very well when healthy. And Bayless, while still not yet at "good player" level, improved tremendously from year 1 to year 2. None of this requires listening to anyone in the organization.

Health is a legitimate concern. I don't think talent is.

 

[maxiep]

Several differences I see.

This is assuming no big trades.
Batum has another year under him and he will be healthy (hopefully) going into the season. This alone I expect adds 3-5 wins.

Roy and Miller may not be a great match, but they were meshing much much better towards the end of last season then at the beginning, and that should also result in more wins. Also, Miller will be the Starting PG from day one instead of Blake.

Hopefully Roy and Oden stay mostly healthy. This is the big key. If they do, along with Batum, then this team will succeed. And I don't agree that Roy and Oden did not play well together. When you take into account that Oden was concentrating on D and Roy on O, I think they meshed decently. Nate had said that he was not looking for Oden on O much. If Oden stays healthy, then by the end of the season, perhaps this will change and Oden will start to develop a more consistent offensive game and some plays will be run for him. He is so freakishly strong with speed that if he gets comfortable on O I think great things will happen. But this can only happen if Oden finds himself able to play consistently and not get injured.

It should also be noted that Dre is one of the best into-the-post passers in the league. Once he develops chemistry with GO, we should expect 2-4 alley oops a game. That being said, I think Miller will be wearing another uniform come November.

 

[Idog1976]

Several differences I see.

This is assuming no big trades.
Batum has another year under him and he will be healthy (hopefully) going into the season. This alone I expect adds 3-5 wins.

Roy and Miller may not be a great match, but they were meshing much much better towards the end of last season then at the beginning, and that should also result in more wins. Also, Miller will be the Starting PG from day one instead of Blake.

Hopefully Roy and Oden stay mostly healthy. This is the big key. If they do, along with Batum, then this team will succeed. And I don't agree that Roy and Oden did not play well together. When you take into account that Oden was concentrating on D and Roy on O, I think they meshed decently. Nate had said that he was not looking for Oden on O much. If Oden stays healthy, then by the end of the season, perhaps this will change and Oden will start to develop a more consistent offensive game and some plays will be run for him. He is so freakishly strong with speed that if he gets comfortable on O I think great things will happen. But this can only happen if Oden finds himself able to play consistently and not get injured.

Oden will become the 1st option on offense if he ever gets a few healthy seasons under his belt. Mark my words in three years time if Oden is healthy for the vast majority of all three, he will be the number one option.

Then Oden will pass to either Aldridge at the high post or cutting or to Roy to create.

I honestly think Roy could be the second option on the team. If you can't pound the ball in to Oden you have Roy create.

Before he went down Oden was basically unstoppable on offense for most teams and the only defense was flopping. Seriously, he looked like circa 1997 Shaq-lite. His offensive game is so primitive currently and it was hideously effective. He lead FG% quite often until the injury, not for the team FOR THE LEAGUE.

Oden's health is what everyone is so fixated (with good reason) on they can't see the gargantuan talent we have on our hands. He has two enemies, his health and his confidence. One will instill the other, and when that happens there will be lots more ODEN IS A BEAST posts I promise.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Back to the original topic...

I would like to once again bang the Ray Felton drum. I still think the guy's very talented, has shown that he can shoot the ball, is a solid defender, and would mesh well with Roy (for those who are concerned about that sort of thing). I doubt he'd want to take MLE to come here, but if he would, I'd be quite happy.

 

[Luther]

Felton for the MLE would be incredible. We would have the flexibility to package Andre/Joel for a very nice player if that happened. This off season is going to be realllly interesting.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

So it's Collison or bust then. I mean damn Shannon brown is next best ugh!

I disagree that Brown is the next best.. Just because he was on the Lakers and got a lot of press doesn't mean he is that good. In my opinion, he hasn't shown that he has any point guard skills. He hasn't shown an ability to handle the ball especially well, or create for himself or others.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I don't see any free agent point guard coming here, it's gotta be in a trade.

 

[BGrantFan]

Offensively, I'd love to see Luke Ridnour off the bench. The problem is that I've seen enough of inadequate defenders at the PG position (Blake, Sergio, Miller), so that rules out me wanting Ridnour.