Play Oden More

[Mediocre Man]

Dear Nate,

Try not to be such an assclown.

No excuse for this guy to be averaging less than 30 minutes. His fouls per minute would allow him to play around 32 without fouling out.

 

[B-Roy]

Dear Nate,

Try not to be such an assclown.

No excuse for this guy to be averaging less than 30 minutes. His fouls per minute would allow him to play around 32 without fouling out.

Well he ended with 24 mins and 5 fouls.

 

[dreamcloud]

^Still though, he wasn't in foul trouble in the 1st half at all or the 3rd quarter. He picked those up late in the 4th.. Absolute bullshit Nate, the game turned when Oden came back in 4th.

 

[The Sebastian Express]

Well he ended with 24 mins and 5 fouls.

5 is not 6, and as Minstrel once so graciously pointed out, it is not a prudent move for a coach to effectively foul out his player instead of forcing the referees to do it. There was no reason for Greg to come out at the 6 minute mark in the first with only one foul, and even more disturbing was his substitution of Joel for Greg at the 7:22 mark in the third.

 

[Chuck Taylor]

Well he ended with 24 mins and 5 fouls.

He got the 5th foul with 2 minutes left. Would the world end if he fouled out? I would rather get the max minutes out of him that I can, even if he fouls out. Hell, Nate didn't even have him in at the end anyway.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

I did like that he played most of the 4th quarter, though, and only went out when Nate put in another FT shooting guard. Sure, he could have played more in the 2nd and 3rd quarters, but maximizing his effort on the court like he does may take it out of him. You can't play 48 minutes like Greg plays. Getting it up to 30 will probably take till January.

 

[Minstrel]

5 is not 6, and as Minstrel once so graciously pointed out, it is not a prudent move for a coach to effectively foul out his player instead of forcing the referees to do it.

I'm happy that the grace came through. There's no good smiley for that.

And yeah, I'm a little surprised at how tentative McMillan is being with Oden's minutes. He acts like Oden will explode messily if he reaches a sixth foul, and it isn't worth the risk. If I were coach (yes, I'll forward my resume to Pritchard) I'd play him normally until/unless he reached 3 fouls in the first half, then play him normally in the second half until/unless he reached 5 fouls in the third quarter. And then play him normally in the fourth quarter/overtime until he fouls out or the game ends.

If Oden doesn't like fouling out or sitting down when he reaches 3 or 5 fouls, he has motivation to learn not to foul. But I think that concept is silly anyway...I think Oden is trying to avoid fouls as it is. I don't think he needs "foul quotas" to inform him that fouling isn't a good idea.

 

[KingSpeed]

^Still though, he wasn't in foul trouble in the 1st half at all or the 3rd quarter. He picked those up late in the 4th.. Absolute bullshit Nate, the game turned when Oden came back in 4th.

Nate wants Oden to be able to play loose in the second half (the more important half). If he lets Oden pick up his third in the first half, that means, in the 3rd quarter, if he picks up ONE, he has to sit down. But if he holds Oden back, Oden has more leeway. The goal is to have Oden playing without fear in the 4th. Larry Brown did this all the time with Smits and they got to the ECF twice in a row that way.

 

[KingSpeed]

I'm happy that the grace came through. There's no good smiley for that.

And yeah, I'm a little surprised at how tentative McMillan is being with Oden's minutes. He acts like Oden will explode messily if he reaches a sixth foul, and it isn't worth the risk. If I were coach (yes, I'll forward my resume to Pritchard) I'd play him normally until/unless he reached 3 fouls in the first half, then play him normally in the second half until/unless he reached 5 fouls in the third quarter. And then play him normally in the fourth quarter/overtime until he fouls out or the game ends.

If Oden doesn't like fouling out or sitting down when he reaches 3 or 5 fouls, he has motivation to learn not to foul. But I think that concept is silly anyway...I think Oden is trying to avoid fouls as it is. I don't think he needs "foul quotas" to inform him that fouling isn't a good idea.

I believe it is bad coaching to allow a player to pick up a 5th foul in the third quarter. Don't you want your guy to be able defend in the 4th quarter without worrying about being disqualified?

 

[KingSpeed]

The other thing too is.... Joel is good. Joel has earned the minutes he's getting with stellar play.

 

[magnifier661]

The other thing too is.... Joel is good. Joel has earned the minutes he's getting with stellar play.

Oden needs minutes. At least 30 a game. Regardless of how good Pryzbilla is playing. Oden needs to build his conditioning on the floor. He needs to learn to reserve his energy when he's on the floor.

 

[1 Eye Jack]

Joel was getting abused by Lopez tonight.

 

[magnifier661]

Joel was getting abused by Lopez tonight.

Also, I saw a lot of Aldridge on Lopez. I didn't know what to think about that. Lopez is a big, and pretty damn strong. Not saying Aldridge is some weakling, but he's giving up a lot of strength to defend against him.

Regardless, I gotta give credit where credit is do. Lopez payed great tonight.

 

[Luther]

I agree with the majority here. Greg is obviously getting better with every minute he is on the floor..He isn't learning anything from the bench. When I saw him concede a layup tonight I realized how far he has come. That may seem obvious to us as fans but when you're a 7 footer and great at blocking shots it has to be tough to let any basket go uncontested.

 

[KingSpeed]

Joel was getting abused by Lopez tonight.

Joel led our team with 10 rebounds in 18 minutes!

 

[Natebishop3]

I don't care if Joel is good, Greg is putting up All-Starish numbers right now. We need to ride that wave.

 

[yakbladder]

5 is not 6, and as Minstrel once so graciously pointed out, it is not a prudent move for a coach to effectively foul out his player instead of forcing the referees to do it. There was no reason for Greg to come out at the 6 minute mark in the first with only one foul, and even more disturbing was his substitution of Joel for Greg at the 7:22 mark in the third.

What if Greg is/does get winded? What should Nate do then?

Let the big guy learn to play until he collapses? Maybe just let him play until he can't move? What if he breaks a leg? Let the big guy learn to play with pain? Perhaps if Oden has five guys assaulting him with crowbars Nate should leave him so the big guy can learn karate?

I can just hear the gnashing of teeth and retching on the board now as the other half of the fanbase blames Nate for destroying the center of a lifetime.

 

[magnifier661]

Joel led our team with 10 rebounds in 18 minutes!

Come on King, you know we can't look at the box score and say that's what happened. Lopez played out of his mind tonight, kinda abused everyone actually. Didn't do too well against Oden, which makes me proud.

 

[Natebishop3]

What if Greg is/does get winded? What should Nate do then?

Let the big guy learn to play until he collapses? Maybe just let him play until he can't move? What if he breaks a leg? Let the big guy learn to play with pain? Perhaps if Oden has five guys assaulting him with crowbars Nate should leave him so the big guy can learn karate?

I can just hear the gnashing of teeth and retching on the board now as the other half of the fanbase blames Nate for destroying the center of a lifetime.

Do you think he was winded after only having played 12 minutes, with 7 minutes to go in the third?

 

[yakbladder]

I don't care if Joel is good, Greg is putting up All-Starish numbers right now. We need to ride that wave.

I agree that Oden needs more minutes.

I do not agree on letting him play more than 35-40 tops. You want him fresh at the end of the season and you want to keep Joel fresh so he can help out if anything were to happen to Oden. Plus you just can't ride a big guy 45 minutes a night. His lungs won't take it.

 

[yakbladder]

Do you think he was winded after only having played 12 minutes, with 7 minutes to go in the third?

I'm just using that as an example to the leave him in until he gets 6 remark.

 

[magnifier661]

What if Greg is/does get winded? What should Nate do then?

Let the big guy learn to play until he collapses? Maybe just let him play until he can't move? What if he breaks a leg? Let the big guy learn to play with pain? Perhaps if Oden has five guys assaulting him with crowbars Nate should leave him so the big guy can learn karate?

I can just hear the gnashing of teeth and retching on the board now as the other half of the fanbase blames Nate for destroying the center of a lifetime.

There needs to be a goal brother. Give a couple minutes more here, couple more there, then set a personal goal to get him to 100% playing shape to play 30-35 minutes a game by Feb. Nothing wrong with that, and it's not trying to play him until he collapses.

 

[Natebishop3]

I'm just using that as an example to the leave him in until he gets 6 remark.

It's not so much that which irritates me, it's the dumb "6 minute mark" rule that Nate has for him. Right now Nate has the following rules:

1) If Oden commits more than one foul per quarter, he sits the rest of the first half.

2) Regardless of foul trouble or play, Oden comes out with six minutes to go in the first and third quarters.

One thing that drives me up the wall about Nate is that he refuses to go away from his subbing patterns, regardless of whether a guy is hot or not. It's just bad coaching.

 

[Sedatedfork]

What if Greg is/does get winded? What should Nate do then?

Let the big guy learn to play until he collapses? Maybe just let him play until he can't move? What if he breaks a leg? Let the big guy learn to play with pain? Perhaps if Oden has five guys assaulting him with crowbars Nate should leave him so the big guy can learn karate?

I can just hear the gnashing of teeth and retching on the board now as the other half of the fanbase blames Nate for destroying the center of a lifetime.

In defense of Nate, he thinks that as Greg gets tired he is more likely to pick up ticky tack fouls. So I don't really have a problem taking him out at the 6 minute mark. It would be nice to get him back at the start of the 2nd or the 10 minute mark if he is not in foul trouble. I am okay with baby steps. As his conditioning improves he will get more minutes.

 

[KingSpeed]

it'sGOtime said it in the other thread; I'd rather see Oden play the 4th quarter with only 3 fouls; that allows him to play completely uninhibited in the most important quarter.

 

[Natebishop3]

it'sGOtime said it in the other thread; I'd rather see Oden play the 4th quarter with only 3 fouls; that allows him to play completely uninhibited in the most important quarter.

It's the most important quarter if it's still a close game. What if it's a blowout for either team? I would rather see Greg in the game, influencing the outcome and helping us build a lead.

 

[KingSpeed]

One thing that drives me up the wall about Nate is that he refuses to go away from his subbing patterns, regardless of whether a guy is hot or not. It's just bad coaching.

bad coaching? both centers are playing well and we're 10-2 in the last 12 games; bad coaching?

Also- Kenny Smith said something a few weeks ago. He said that there are a lot of players in the league who can only contribute so much a game no matter how many minutes they play. You can't double Oden's minutes and expect him to double his contribution. Look at the one game this season where Oden played 30+ minutes. He had 11 points, 7 rebounds, & 1 block. That sort of throws out the whole validity of the per36 stat, doesn't it?

 

[Natebishop3]

bad coaching? both centers are playing well and we're 10-2 in the last 12 games; bad coaching?

Also- Kenny Smith said something a few weeks ago. He said that there are a lot of players in the league who can only contribute so much a game no matter how many minutes they play. You can't double Oden's minutes and expect him to double his contribution. Look at the one game this season where Oden played 30+ minutes. He had 11 points, 7 rebounds, & 1 block. That sort of throws out the whole validity of the per36 stat.

Who said I was only talking about Greg and Joel? He's done it with Rudy. He's done it with Aldridge. He's done it with Miller. And yes, he's done it with Greg. If a guy hits three or four shots in a row, and he's clearly feeling it, why bench him? Let the guy ride it out. When he cools off, that's when you make a change.

 

[KingSpeed]

It's the most important quarter if it's still a close game. What if it's a blowout for either team? I would rather see Greg in the game, influencing the outcome and helping us build a lead.

We won. We're winning almost every game. Only 2 losses in the last 12 games. Oden played a season high 34 minutes in one of the losses.

 

[KingSpeed]

Who said I was only talking about Greg and Joel? He's done it with Rudy. He's done it with Aldridge. He's done it with Miller. And yes, he's done it with Greg. If a guy hits three or four shots in a row, and he's clearly feeling it, why bench him? Let the guy ride it out. When he cools off, that's when you make a change.

Nate's the master of knowing when a player has hit his stride and given what he can give. I'd rather not wait for a player to start chucking up three bricks to take him out. In those three bricks, you've given the lead back to the opposition.