OT Portland and surrounding area Homeless Situation

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BlazerBender said:
But its the vocal minority everyone is now bending over backwards for. And that is those who want it torn down. Even some in this forum think the only way for long lasting change is to tear it all down.
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If everyone was bending over backwards for them, would not everything be torn down already? They arent getting their way anymore than the other side. It's all sadly status quo my friend.

A minority may think that the only way to fix things is to tear it all down. A house can only be repaired so long, before it gets to the point, there is nothing left but to tear it down and rebuild. I'm not saying I'm for that, just saying I get the reasoning. I think that thought process is rash. I'm more of a do everything you can to save it first, tearing it all down is last resort kind of guy.
 
Chris Craig said:
I'm a self motivated person too, but maybe until you have been there at the bottom, on the streets with nothing, you can't understand it.

These people are in a place where that seems impossible and therefore it is futile to try.
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Maybe you missed it, but i have been there. On the streets and addicted. I pulled myself out because i didn't like the direction my life was going and that was when i was 20-21 years old.

So i believe i understand the situation and have a hard time understanding why others cant do the same i did. What i know is hard to understand, are those with less will power/ motivation to make the right decisions when down snd out.
I made poor decisions to get where i was, but once i realized i didn't want to be there? It wasn't hard for me to make different choices.

i used to smoke. Tried quitting several times, but couldn't. Until i realized i could sing but it was holding me back. That newfound realization, combined with my motivation to want to song, made the final attempt at quoting, much easier.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I didn't think you could
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Dont mistake the ability/ no ability with the lack of wanting to discuss politics with you.
You dont get to call other people names because they question some of your universal solutions and then continue to ask them to answer your questions.

Get real.
 
Chris Craig said:
If everyone was bending over backwards for them, would not everything be torn down already? They arent getting their way anymore than the other side. It's all sadly status quo my friend.

A minority may think that the only way to fix things is to tear it all down. A house can only be repaired so long, before it gets to the point, there is nothing left but to tear it down and rebuild. I'm not saying I'm for that, just saying I get the reasoning. I think that thought process is rash. I'm more of a do everything you can to save it first, tearing it all down is last resort kind of guy.
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Things take time. Its in progress and i didnt say it was all being torn down now, im saying thats what they want.
 
Government subsidized farm collectives to help rehabilitate or reintroduce people without ways and means into healthy productive lives..substance abuse rehabs for addicts and drunks and mental housing facilities for mentally disabled folks. 3 homeless issues to tackle...not all fit under one umbrella. OJT housing in other fields of work should also be optional...labor for housing...rehab for those not ready to take on work yet. During the great depression soup kitchens and work for room and board was happening...it's how our cobblestone streets got paved according to my father who stayed in one before the war and laid brick for food and shelter. Basically it's what Republicans have called for for years....work for welfare ..or what Dems have called for in social services for addictions and mental health problems. Social Democracy is the answer to Out of Control Capitalism ....Bernie is right about that. There should be tax incentives for big companies to implement some of these programs
 
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BlazerBender said:
Dont mistake the ability/ no ability with the lack of wanting to discuss politics with you.
You dont get to call other people names because they question some of your universal solutions and then continue to ask them to answer your questions.

Get real.
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Not sure what you're referring to. I don't call people names.

I was just curious if there were successful instances of cities or countries using the techniques you're advocating for and you can't seem to point to any.

No big deal.
 
BlazerBender said:
wow. So you wants tax payers to supplement the repairs required for when the homeless damage the homes gifted to them in the first place?

sigh…

Thoughts like that move me to my more conservative right. No way I am wanting/willing to pay for that.
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Phatguysrule said:
Tax payers would be saving money by doing so. Just like taxpayers in Finland are.

You apparently want tax payers to pay more for our current situation. Which is what the conservative right wants.

This supports the theory that the conservative right is ignorant and short sighted with regards to social policy.
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Phatguysrule said:
Not sure what you're referring to. I don't call people names.

I was just curious if there were successful instances of cities or countries using the techniques you're advocating for and you can't seem to point to any.

No big deal.
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Spin it however you want. You cant handle people disagreeing with you. Period.
Good luck.
 
BlazerBender said:
Spin it however you want. You cant handle people disagreeing with you. Period.
Good luck.
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I didn't see any names called there. But the conservative right is ignorant and short sighted with regards to social policy.

I'll stand by that, though I am sorry if that offends you. It's a statement of fact, very clearly.

With the exception of the actual top 1%, who aren't as ignorant and short sighted, they just don't care and are leading their poor ignorant and short sighted followers to support them by voting against their own best interest.

It's a sad state of affairs.
 
riverman said:
Government subsidized farm collectives to help rehabilitate or reintroduce people without ways and means into healthy productive lives..substance abuse rehabs for addicts and drunks and mental housing facilities for mentally disabled folks. 3 homeless issues to tackle...not all fit under one umbrella. OJT housing in other fields of work should also be optional...labor for housing...rehab for those not ready to take on work yet. During the great depression soup kitchens and work for room and board was happening...it's how our cobblestone streets got paved according to my father who stayed in one before the war and laid brick for food and shelter. Basically it's what Republicans have called for for years....work for welfare ..or what Dems have called for in social services for addictions and mental health problems. Social Democracy is the answer to Out of Control Capitalism ....Bernie is right about that. There should be tax incentives for big companies to implement some of these programs
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There you go making sense again....
 
BlazerBender said:
Maybe you missed it, but i have been there. On the streets and addicted. I pulled myself out because i didn't like the direction my life was going and that was when i was 20-21 years old.

So i believe i understand the situation and have a hard time understanding why others cant do the same i did. What i know is hard to understand, are those with less will power/ motivation to make the right decisions when down snd out.
I made poor decisions to get where i was, but once i realized i didn't want to be there? It wasn't hard for me to make different choices.

i used to smoke. Tried quitting several times, but couldn't. Until i realized i could sing but it was holding me back. That newfound realization, combined with my motivation to want to song, made the final attempt at quoting, much easier.
Click to expand...

I did miss that.

Not everyone is like you or me. Not everyone has the will power to pull themselves out of it. For some people it just comes easier to be able to do that.

Some people are too stuck in the dysfunction to be able to see a way out. Some are addicts and or not sober and can't think clearly enough to find the value in themselves to get up and get themselves off the street. Some are deeply mentally ill and can't think at all for themselves.

Others are old and tired and set in their ways. Many are scared, they don't know what the hell to do to get off that street and be able to stay off.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I didn't see any names called there. But the conservative right is ignorant and short sighted with regards to social policy.

I'll stand by that, though I am sorry if that offends you. It's a statement of fact, very clearly.

With the exception of the actual top 1%, who aren't as ignorant and short sighted, they just don't care and are leading their poor ignorant and short sighted followers to support them by voting against their own best interest.

It's a sad state of affairs.
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Lol. So would you consider name calling tough love? Think you posted something about that.

hypocrisy knows no bounds…
And passive aggressive statements like “im sorry that offends you” get you know where. You must come to the realization that you are not aiding in trying to change my mind to your beliefs with your communication style. It does the opposite.
Also thanks for clarifying your inability to differentiate fact from opinion. It solidifies even further, that its a waste of time talking politics with you.
 
Chris Craig said:
I did miss that.

Not everyone is like you or me. Not everyone has the will power to pull themselves out of it. For some people it just comes easier to be able to do that.

Some people are too stuck in the dysfunction to be able to see a way out. Some are addicts and or not sober and can't think clearly enough to find the value in themselves to get up and get themselves off the street. Some are deeply mentally ill and can't think at all for themselves.

Others are old and tired and set in their ways. Many are scared, they don't know what the hell to do to get off that street and be able to stay off.
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And im all for go ing aid to those to steer them in the right direction. Ive never said otherwise. My point has always been the ones who actively defy the system and push against it.
Ive said many times im referring to repeat offenders and those who want to tear it all down. Not those who arent sure how to help themselves become a productive member of society, but want to.
You are jumping on board another poster which isn't able to dicsuss things snd keeps pushing universal answers and insults those who disagree and think the problem is much more complex than one answer to fit all.
This all came about because another poster couldn't handle opposing opinions to their proposal and decided to take it downhill with insults and then play the typical passive aggressive game he does.
Im sorry you feel that way
im sorry that offends you crap.

Respect is a two way street.
I know you know this, but the poster you are following(not the literal sense) doesn't.

If one cant show respect for others’ opinions regardless if they agree or not, regarding governmental policies, one shouldn't be discussing politics cause one is just a polidick.
A polidick is Someone who constantly yells louder, that they have the right answers, and belittles anyone who disagrees, and will not shut up about it. A polidick.
Got one here.
 
BlazerBender said:
Things take time. Its in progress and i didnt say it was all being torn down now, im saying thats what they want.
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It's probably never going to be all torn down, ever one way or the other.

The majority doesn't want that. So, it won't happen.

Sure, in a way, you have to tear down ignorance and hate to create progress. To keep progress, it has to be continuously fought for.

People are angry. Decades of progress are being dismantled. Things were headed the right direction and then Trump became president. He brought with him a resurgence of a hateful and disgusting ideology that has started a crusade against Americans of non Christian religions, African Americans, the LGBTQ community.

It has to be fought against. I don't agree with people rioting, or causing damage, or stealing. I understand why it has happened though.
 
Someone talking calmly about how they support a dehumanizing policy is not inherently respectful, and is not more worthy of respect because it's calm.
 
Everything Beagle said:
Someone talking calmly about how they support a dehumanizing policy is not inherently respectful, and is not more worthy of respect because it's calm.
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who is talking about supporting a dehumanizing policy and respecting it?

Dont play the passive aggressive game others do here. Or, as you put it.,. Get out of my thread!!!
Lol.
 
BlazerBender said:
And im all for go ing aid to those to steer them in the right direction. Ive never said otherwise. My point has always been the ones who actively defy the system and push against it.
Ive said many times im referring to repeat offenders and those who want to tear it all down. Not those who arent sure how to help themselves become a productive member of society, but want to.
You are jumping on board another poster which isn't able to dicsuss things snd keeps pushing universal answers and insults those who disagree and think the problem is much more complex than one answer to fit all.
This all came about because another poster couldn't handle opposing opinions to their proposal and decided to take it downhill with insults and then play the typical passive aggressive game he does.
Im sorry you feel that way
im sorry that offends you crap.

Respect is a two way street.
I know you know this, but the poster you are following(not the literal sense) doesn't.

If one cant show respect for others’ opinions regardless if they agree or not, regarding governmental policies, one shouldn't be discussing politics cause one is just a polidick.
A polidick is Someone who constantly yells louder, that they have the right answers, and belittles anyone who disagrees, and will not shut up about it. A polidick.
Got one here.
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I think most homeless people don't want to tear it all down. Some may be spiteful and hold that sentiment. Most just want to live.

I'm not jumping on board with anybody. I'm just sharing my own thoughts.

I agree with some of what he said and some of what you said. I disagree with some of what he said, and some of what you said.

That's the good thing about this country is we can all have our thoughts and express them.

The two of you can't seem to have a conversation, so I'd just not try to have it. Sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.
 
Chris Craig said:
I think most homeless people don't want to tear it all down. Some may be spiteful and hold that sentiment. Most just want to live.

I'm not jumping on board with anybody. I'm just sharing my own thoughts.

I agree with some of what he said and done of what you said. I disagree with some of what he said, and what you said.

That's the good thing about this country is we can all have our thoughts and express them.

The two of you can't seem to have a conversation, so I'd just not try to have it. Sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.
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Just want to be clear here. If you disagree with some of what he said, per him, and another, that makes you short sighted, ignorant and supporting policies that dehumanize humans.
This is a fact. I just read it.
:)
 
Everything Beagle said:
Someone talking calmly about how they support a dehumanizing policy is not inherently respectful, and is not more worthy of respect because it's calm.
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Which policy are you referring too?
 
Chris Craig said:
I think most homeless people don't want to tear it all down. Some may be spiteful and hold that sentiment. Most just want to live.

I'm not jumping on board with anybody. I'm just sharing my own thoughts.

I agree with some of what he said and done of what you said. I disagree with some of what he said, and what you said.

That's the good thing about this country is we can all have our thoughts and express them.

The two of you can't seem to have a conversation, so I'd just not try to have it. Sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.
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I agree, but I'm not the one saying i will respond to everything and blah blah blah like someone else is. Ive actively told him i don't want to discuss politics with him. But he keeps coming back with passive aggressive behavior. Possibly trying to stir up drama?
Anyhow haters gonna hate.
Im all for discussing opposing opinions to try to better the situation about homeless. I'm not for hearing someone's proposal and being belittled because i might not agree with all of it.
Just ridiculous to think anyone would be cool with that.
 
Whats worse. The guy who questions things to dissect and clarify, or those who think they are always right and cant handle being questioned without resorting to belittling, name calling and passive aggressive behavior?
 
BlazerBender said:
Just want to be clear here. If you disagree with some of what he said, per him, and another, that makes you short sighted, ignorant and supporting policies that dehumanize humans.
This is a fact. I just read it.
:)
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Hah

No, it means I'm open minded.

I can be ok with the things he says that I don't agree with. I'm not going to take it personally.

I agree with some of the things you have shared and disagree with others.

Human problems need human solutions.
 
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