Presidential Legitimacy: Birthers - Karma is a Bitch

[Stevenson]

So I see that none other than representative John Lewis is saying that Trump is not a legitimate president. Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument. Certainly 100% more valid than the never-real Birther BS.

More broadly, Trump is getting his comeuppance. His Birther issue has come home to roost. We will see how he likes having the legitimacy of his presidency questioned for the next four years. I doubt he handles it with the dignity of Obama.

Karma is a bitch.

.

 

[blue32]

Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument.

1. Russians did not help Trump. If they did, prove it, but the President already said they did not.
2. Popular vote has never mattered in a Presidential election in the USA since the inception.
3. FBI did not help Trump, they were doing their job and likely forced to by the DOJ AG's meeting with Bill Clinton.

Also, finally, for everyone continuing to cry...

 

[Denny Crane]

Not a valid argument, but karma is a bitch.

Guess who's going to be sworn in on the 20th? The winner of the election. Period.

 

[magnifier661]

Hahaha like having a bunch of crybaby libs saying trump ain't legit means shit. Karma is a bitch. Karma=democrats

 

[crandc]

Here's what I seriously don't get. I have never in my life seen supporters of a winning candidate so bitter. Normally supporters of a winning candidate are happy, cautiously optimistic, something. All I am hearing from Trump supporters is things like "ha ha" and "libtards" and "liberal tears are like fine wine".

Is vengeance what drove you to support Trump? Against ill-defined "liberals", media, Hollywood, gays, "political correctness" that required you to act polite?
E.J. Dionne and Joy-Ann Reid wrote an op-ed where they said Obama supporters had been defined by hope while Trump supporters are defined by rage. True or not?

 

[magnifier661]

Here's what I seriously don't get. I have never in my life seen supporters of a winning candidate so bitter. Normally supporters of a winning candidate are happy, cautiously optimistic, something. All I am hearing from Trump supporters is things like "ha ha" and "libtards" and "liberal tears are like fine wine".

Is vengeance what drove you to support Trump? Against ill-defined "liberals", media, Hollywood, gays, "political correctness" that required you to act polite?
E.J. Dionne and Joy-Ann Reid wrote an op-ed where they said Obama supporters had been defined by hope while Trump supporters are defined by rage. True or not?

It's because you weren't on the losing end for 12 years. I remember Obama supporters being very bitter and confrontational with those that opposed.

Also, it doesn't help when the left and most trying to push an agenda that Trump's presidency is illegitimate.

Good news though. America will be Great again!

 

[donkiez]

Here's what I seriously don't get. I have never in my life seen supporters of a winning candidate so bitter. Normally supporters of a winning candidate are happy, cautiously optimistic, something. All I am hearing from Trump supporters is things like "ha ha" and "libtards" and "liberal tears are like fine wine".

Is vengeance what drove you to support Trump? Against ill-defined "liberals", media, Hollywood, gays, "political correctness" that required you to act polite?
E.J. Dionne and Joy-Ann Reid wrote an op-ed where they said Obama supporters had been defined by hope while Trump supporters are defined by rage. True or not?

Fascism is better than socialism apparently.

 

[blue32]

Fascism is better than socialism apparently.

Please tell me which version of fascism do you think is happening here.

Also let me give you two definitions, and you tell me which one is from which site, it's pretty telling.


fas·cism
ˈfaSHˌizəm/
noun
noun: fascism; noun: Fascism; plural noun: Fascisms

1. an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
   synonyms: authoritarianism, totalitarianism, dictatorship, despotism, autocracy;More
   Nazism, rightism;
   nationalism, xenophobia, racism, anti-Semitism;
   jingoism, isolationism;
   neofascism, neo-Nazism
   "a film depicting the rise of fascism in the 1930s"
   • (in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.

Definition of fascism

1. 1 often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
   
   
2. 2 : a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control <early instances of army fascism and brutality — J. W. Aldridge>
   

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Are we gonna call it Karma when the pubs use all the tactics the dems used the last 8 years?

 

[riverman]

Not a valid argument, but karma is a bitch

It's a statement no matter how much you want to make it an argument and it's a valid one according to millions and millions of people....like thousands of your own statements Denny....you should sometimes consider adding to a thread conversation instead of BAITING arguments...it's becoming your MO.......karma is a bitch. Stevenson makes a great point about the karma involved here....hopefully Trump will learn to govern with dignity....which so far, he sorely lacks

 

[riverman]

Trump's presidency is illegitimate

c'mon mags....the point is Trump did question over and over the legitimacy of Obama's right to be president...that's what karma really is.

 

[riverman]

like having a bunch of crybaby libs

time to get over this sort of na na nana na stuff mags......if you want to talk to adults and have a real conversation instead of heckling the half the country you're insulting over and over and over.....I don't see a lot of people who don't tow the conservative line really insulting opposing mindsets around here....if it ever stops we might actually come together as a country.....what you're doing is NOT making America great again....it's the wrong way to move forward with the "my dad can beat up your dad" schpiel....I'm an American....we need to start identifying as americans .....change starts with us...help the cause

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument. Certainly 100% more valid than the never-real Birther BS.

I'm confused--where is the legitimacy in the argument? How does any of that relate to the constitutional validity of Trump's election?

 

[blue32]

time to get over this sort of na na nana na stuff mags......if you want to talk to adults and have a real conversation instead of heckling the half the country you're insulting over and over and over.....I don't see a lot of people who don't tow the conservative line really insulting opposing mindsets around here....if it ever stops we might actually come together as a country.....what you're doing is NOT making America great again....it's the wrong way to move forward with the "my dad can beat up your dad" schpiel....I'm an American....we need to start identifying as americans .....change starts with us...help the cause

How can you have conversations with people like this:

 

[riverman]

constitutional validity

I didn't get that implication from his post at all...I thought he was pretty clear and he has a valid point that it's Trump's karma to be questioned ..and our right as citizens to be as skeptical as we want about this election. It's really not unusual for this to happen ...be grateful we're allowed to question our leaders.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

So I see that none other than representative John Lewis is saying that Trump is not a legitimate president. Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument. Certainly 100% more valid than the never-real Birther BS.

More broadly, Trump is getting his comeuppance. His Birther issue has come home to roost. We will see how he likes having the legitimacy of his presidency questioned for the next four years. I doubt he handles it with the dignity of Obama.

Karma is a bitch.

.

The popular vote isn't how we elect our President.

If the Russians really swayed our election, it is actionable and people on their side have to die. Its nothing more than progovernment propoganda.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I didn't get that implication from his post at all...I thought he was pretty clear and he has a valid point that it's Trump's karma to be questioned ..and our right as citizens to be as skeptical as we want about this election. It's really not unusual for this to happen ...be grateful we're allowed to question our leaders.
View attachment 11901

Go back and read the original post (I'll re-quote it here):

• So I see that none other than representative John Lewis is saying that Trump is not a legitimate president.
• Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument.
• Certainly 100% more valid than the never-real Birther BS.

The OP was saying that there's a valid argument that Trump's presidency is not legitimate. Again, the question is, how do the italicized items in blue support the bolded claims in red?

 

[riverman]

I'm confused--where is the legitimacy in the argument

the legitimacy is that a huge portion of the population has all these concerns....and it's a good thing to have them..how we question them is a matter of whether or not we use the tools of democracy to challenge these questions. In my book....that's always valid....I went to war under a president I really disagreed with, but I went and did my job....I still questioned his integrity everyday...he got impeached after a very long political career. That's why questions like these get raised...

 

[riverman]

Go back and read the original post (I'll re-quote it here):

• So I see that none other than representative John Lewis is saying that Trump is not a legitimate president.
• Between help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes, it is a valid argument.
• Certainly 100% more valid than the never-real Birther BS.

The OP was saying that there's a valid argument that Trump's presidency is not legitimate. Again, the question is, how do the italicized items in blue support the bolded claims in red?

John Lewis did say that.....many people have these concerns and having those concerns is valid....whether they are right or wrong...I have those questions too although I see Trump as the president....I want to know he's NOT a Manchurian candidate or Richard Nixon clone....it's not like it's not demonstrable....3 guys I really loved were assassinated in this country.....it's still a valid question who killed them..no matter what political persuasion they are. After John, Bobby and Martin were killed....my generation questions a lot of things in govt

 

[PtldPlatypus]

the legitimacy is that a huge portion of the population has all these concerns....and it's a good thing to have them..how we question them is a matter of whether or not we use the tools of democracy to challenge these questions. In my book....that's always valid....I went to war under a president I really disagreed with, but I went and did my job....I still questioned his integrity everyday...he got impeached after a very long political career. That's why questions like these get raised...

I like you riverman, but you're once again changing the argument. The OP said nothing about questioning how well he'll execute the office of President; it questioned whether or not he actually has the right to assume the office in the first place.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

 

[Denny Crane]

It's because you weren't on the losing end for 12 years. I remember Obama supporters being very bitter and confrontational with those that opposed.

Also, it doesn't help when the left and most trying to push an agenda that Trump's presidency is illegitimate.

Good news though. America will be Great again!

They wanted retribution against Bush. They were terribly disappointed when Obama said he wouldn't prosecute his predecessor.

Sore winners, sore losers. Sore all the time. May as well be sore losers. The sore winner thing wasn't so great.

 

[riverman]

The popular vote isn't how we elect our President.

explain why we have one then.....right....you can't

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

explain why we have one then.....right....you can't

We keep different stats on all kinds of things.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

explain why we have one then.....right....you can't

The nationwide popular vote is an irrelevant figure cobbled together from the individual statewide popular votes. The statewide popular votes are how we elect our president.

It's not that complicated.

 

[oldfisherman]

The president won by plying voters with booze.
Candidates that serve up the most booze win the elections.

http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/wa.../08/george-washington-plied-voters-with-booze

 

[riverman]

I like you riverman, but you're once again changing the argument. The OP said nothing about questioning how well he'll execute the office of President; it questioned whether or not he actually has the right to assume the office in the first place.

I have that question too...why wouldn't we all want to know......I wish we knew more about both candidates a year and a half ago before the campaign...transparency doesn't end on Jan 20th or over the next four years if we're really going to drain a swamp

 

[riverman]

The nationwide popular vote is an irrelevant figure cobbled together from the individual statewide popular votes. The statewide popular votes are how we elect our president.

It's not that complicated.

I think we all understand that....doesn't mean we have to agree with it or think it should remain the way we do things...I'm not really against it but support the right to be against it.

 

[Denny Crane]

We will see the constitution in action. Whether John Lewis shows up or not, Trump is going to be sworn in on the 20th.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I have that question too...why wouldn't we all want to know...

Great. So for the third time, I ask how do help from Russians, and the FBI, and losing the popular vote by more than 3 million votes (as listed in the OP) relate to whether or not Trump has the right to take office?