Public Employees Protesting WI Governor

[maxiep]

Oh come on, that is obviously an opinion piece. You could find hundreds of blogs in which Republicans were praising Walker. The title of the article is Wisconsin Republicans Move State Toward Fascism for God's sakes.

If that was from lets say Yahoo or something, then it would be different. Or USA Today or something.

This is the America we live in. Everyone can see what they agree with and try to block out as best they can views that do not agree with theirs.

Can we all agree on the following things?

1. That elections in this country are--by and large--free and fair.
2. That elections can have consequences if your side loses.
3. That for all its failings, we agree that our government is a democratic republic.
4. That if you lose, you at least have the duty to show up.
5. That if you choose not to show up, you have no right to complain about the outcome.

Is any of the above unreasonable? If so, which parts to you find objectionable?

 

[maxiep]

Be proud, Democrats! I'm sure Limbaugh and Palin are to blame for this type of rhetoric.

http://www.620wtmj.com/news/local/117732923.html

I will wait with bated breath for those in the media and Democratic Party leaders to call out this "heated rhetoric".

 

[bluefrog]

I will wait with bated breath for those in the media and Democratic Party leaders to call out this "heated rhetoric".

For what?!?! An unsubstantiated probably fake email released by a small AM radio station. Why bother?

Conservatives are peeing their pants in excitement over this vote.

 

[bluefrog]

Tea Party Thugs are blocking WI Dems in their offices so they can't vote!

Whoops, I meant Union Thugs are blocking WI GOP Assembly members in their offices and are threatening violence if they go vote, according to media reports in WI.

So much for civility and the democratic process...

This is why I can't trust anything you post. I tried looking for these "media reports" and this is all I came up with:

By preventing people from entering the capitol building Thursday morning, the police also denied entry to legislators, including at least two Democratic Assembly members — David Cullen and Elizabeth Coggs.

Mr. Cullen was turned away even after displaying his Assembly identification.

LINK

You would be a much more convincing poster if you actually linked to posts like this.

 

[maxiep]

For what?!?! An unsubstantiated probably fake email released by a small AM radio station. Why bother?

Conservatives are peeing their pants in excitement over this vote.

An interesting response. The Tea Party is asked to condemn and apologize for everything that's on the other side of what the Democrats want. I guess what's good for goose isn't necessarily good for the gander.

Let's put it this way: If a supporter of Gov. Walker's position would have sent this e-mail to the Democratic senators who left the state, there wouldn't be a media outlet that wouldn't demand that the Republicans denounce the e-mail and the message. You know I'm right.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Let's put it this way: If a supporter of Gov. Walker's position would have sent this e-mail to the Democratic senators who left the state, there wouldn't be a media outlet that wouldn't demand that the Republicans denounce the e-mail and the message. You know I'm right.

And why do you think that is?

 

[PapaG]

This is why I can't trust anything you post. I tried looking for these "media reports" and this is all I came up with:

LINK

You would be a much more convincing poster if you actually linked to posts like this.

Awww, did I post something that you disagree with? The "small AM radio station" is WMTJ, with a 50,000 watt signal and it also happens to be the flagship and home town radio station for the Milwaukee Bucks.

Dispute that report. The DOJ is now admitting to investigating the "probably fake" emails.

You would be a much more convincing poster if you actually researched things on your own.

A 50k-watt station is "a small am" station. What a dopey thing to post.

 

[PapaG]

bluefrog, there are people and assembly members in the buildings. It was on lockdown, meaning nobody could get in or out of it.

As I said, research things for yourself, and don't rely on half the story.

 

[PapaG]

We're streaking the Quad!!!!!

WooHooo!!

Where's the keg, dude!

[video=youtube;7Hh24bXBBsk]

 

[bluefrog]

bluefrog, there are people and assembly members in the buildings. It was on lockdown, meaning nobody could get in or out of it.

WRONG! You said "...Union Thugs are blocking WI GOP Assembly members in their offices and are threatening violence if they go vote, according to media reports in WI." I found that DEMOCRATIC law makers were blocked and didn't find any evidence of you wrote. Are you just making this stuff up?

As I said, research things for yourself, and don't rely on half the story.

I don't get what you mean. I did research. I googled what you posted, posted what I found here and provided a link for your reference. Is that not research?

Besides research is time consuming (I spent about 15 minutes trying to confirm what you posted), if people provided links it would make for a much better debate. This way you are free to scrutinize the source but otherwise it's just hearsay. I could pull shit out of my ass and say "research things for yourself"

 

[bluefrog]

Double post

 

[PapaG]

WRONG! You said "...Union Thugs are blocking WI GOP Assembly members in their offices and are threatening violence if they go vote, according to media reports in WI." I found that DEMOCRATIC law makers were blocked and didn't find any evidence of you wrote. Are you just making this stuff up?

No, I'm not making it up. It was reported this morning on the radio.

I don't get what you mean. I did research. I googled what you posted, posted what I found here and provided a link for your reference. Is that not research?

Besides research is time consuming (I spent about 15 minutes trying to confirm what you posted), if people provided links it would make for a much better debate. This way you are free to scrutinize the source but otherwise it's just hearsay. I could pull shit out of my ass and say "research things for yourself"

Or, you could automatically disregard news reported by a "small" 50,000 watt flagship station out of Milwaukee, WI. And I'm the one who isn't a convincing poster?

 

[MrJayremmie]

PapaG, you take internet posting way too seriously.

 

[PapaG]

PapaG, you take internet posting way too seriously.

Huh? I probably have more fun than anybody on this board. Aren't you the one locked in some "I'm right, you're wrong" debate with maxiep right now?

Are you projecting on me?

 

[bluefrog]

No, I'm not making it up. It was reported this morning on the radio.

I'll have to take your word on this one. I haven't seen this reported on any of the major news sources.

Or, you could automatically disregard news reported by a "small" 50,000 watt flagship station out of Milwaukee, WI. And I'm the one who isn't a convincing poster?

My point was that there's no reason for media and Democrats to address the email. If it is legitimate, why haven't the national news outlets picked up on this story?

 

[PapaG]

I'll have to take your word on this one. I haven't seen this reported on any of the major news sources.

My point was that there's no reason for media and Democrats to address the email. If it is legitimate, why haven't the national news outlets picked up on this story?

Are you really that naive?

Anyhow, Yahoo! has a link to it. Are they national enough for you?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailycaller...nstatesenatorsreceivechillingemaildeaththreat

Fox is also reporting it, but it can't be true, because they are FauxNews.

 

[maxiep]

And why do you think that is?

Because there's a left-leaning bias in most mainstream media outlets. But in this case, even FOX would denounce it if it came from a Walker supporter. Instead, we'll see it either blown off or explained away by the major networks, the major newspapers and two of the three cable networks.

What your reasoning for the double standard?

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Because there's a left-leaning bias in most mainstream media outlets. But in this case, even FOX would denounce it if it came from a Walker supporter. Instead, we'll see it either blown off or explained away by the major networks, the major newspapers and two of the three cable networks.

What your reasoning for the double standard?

I would say that since the right has a history of gun advocacy (along with recent war mongering), the general sentiment is that anything violence oriented coming from their side (even the fringe) is in need of explanation and redaction. I'm not trying to justify that position, but I think that's where the mindset is right now.

I did a little experiment. I read that e-mail under the mindset that it was sent to a democrat and I got the feeling that it was from some kind of well organized tea-party militia. Then I read it under the mindset that it was sent to a republican and I got the feeling that it was a fake from some 4chan asshole. I'm not prepared to say that this mindset is the result of a left-leaning bias in the mainstream media, mainly because I don't consume mainstream media in any sense. Hell, I get my news from this message board. What I will say is that there is definitely an extant point of view that the right has a history of violence and that is rooted in some fact. Whether or not the media propagates that viewpoint explicitly or implicitly I can't say.

 

[bluefrog]

Are you really that naive?

Why is that naive?

Anyhow, Yahoo! has a link to it. Are they national enough for you?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailycaller...nstatesenatorsreceivechillingemaildeaththreat

Fox is also reporting it, but it can't be true, because they are FauxNews.

Thanks for the link.

I'm convinced it's a real email that was sent by some dumbass. The Dems and media folk need to denounce it's message. There are a lot of heated emotions involved with people and their livelihoods and there's potential for people to loose control

 

[bluefrog]

damn double post (major network issues)

 

[maxiep]

I would say that since the right has a history of gun advocacy (along with recent war mongering), the general sentiment is that anything violence oriented coming from their side (even the fringe) is in need of explanation and redaction. I'm not trying to justify that position, but I think that's where the mindset is right now.

I did a little experiment. I read that e-mail under the mindset that it was sent to a democrat and I got the feeling that it was from some kind of well organized tea-party militia. Then I read it under the mindset that it was sent to a republican and I got the feeling that it was a fake from some 4chan asshole. I'm not prepared to say that this mindset is the result of a left-leaning bias in the mainstream media, mainly because I don't consume mainstream media in any sense. Hell, I get my news from this message board. What I will say is that there is definitely an extant point of view that the right has a history of violence and that is rooted in some fact. Whether or not the media propagates that viewpoint explicitly or implicitly I can't say.

I see where you're coming from. My only comment would be that you shouldn't conflate people who identify with the Tea Party with the anti-government, survivalist, Tim McVeigh nutjobs. The vast, vast, vast majority of people that never cared about politics who finally reached a breaking point with the spending. They don't want no government, they want a smaller government that lives within its means. Sure there are some people in the Tea Party that express their love for the 2nd Amendment, but there hasn't been any Tea Party sponsored violence that I can recall, while I can point to several instances of pro-union people getting quite violent.

 

[Denny Crane]

[video=youtube;su4PwZCWUdg]

 

[bluefrog]

[video=youtube;su4PwZCWUdg]

Now that's how you make propaganda!

 

[Paxil]

Now that is funny. =) I do hear all the time that teachers make too much etc... but seriously... I have two friends who are teachers... and they don't make shit. For having a Master's, it has to be one of the lowest paying jobs you could have.

 

[maxiep]

Now that is funny. =) I do hear all the time that teachers make too much etc... but seriously... I have two friends who are teachers... and they don't make shit. For having a Master's, it has to be one of the lowest paying jobs you could have.

First, if there's a bigger joke than a Masters of Teaching, I don't know what is.

Second, they have a choice of employement. If they don't like the prevailing wages, they're free to find another job.

 

[Denny Crane]

You have to tax 20 guys making $50K at 10% just to pay one government worker making $100K.

Yikes.

 

[Minstrel]

You have to tax 20 guys making $50K at 10% just to pay one government worker making $100K.

Yikes.

Are you counting in the taxes that the government employee pays? It's a breakdown of logic to set up government workers as a separate group from the tax-paying citizenry. As a society, we determine what we want to employ government to do and as a society we pay the money it takes for that employment. Government workers are part of that society, as easy a rhetorical device as it is to pretend that they are separate from it.

 

[Denny Crane]

Are you counting in the taxes that the government employee pays? It's a breakdown of logic to set up government workers as a separate group from the tax-paying citizenry. As a society, we determine what we want to employ government to do and as a society we pay the money it takes for that employment. Government workers are part of that society, as easy a rhetorical device as it is to pretend that they are separate from it.

OK, fine. You have to tax 18 guys making $50K to pay the govt. worker his $90K, and another 2 guys to pay the govt. worker's taxes. And the govt. gets to double dip (tax the same money twice).

 

[Minstrel]

OK, fine. You have to tax 18 guys making $50K to pay the govt. worker his $90K, and another 2 guys to pay the govt. worker's taxes.

In what way is the government worker's taxes being paid by other tax payers?

Let's continue to work with your "logic": How many Americans does it take to pay the salary of a $168,000/year general? And how many more tax payers does it require to pay the general's taxes? Why do we allow generals to leech off of American citizens?

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

First, if there's a bigger joke than a Masters of Teaching, I don't know what is.

Second, they have a choice of employement. If they don't like the prevailing wages, they're free to find another job.

Do you have an MA in teaching? Have you taught extensively? In my experience it is much harder than it looks. There is a ton of pedagogy that you need to learn.