Quick: Olshey admits mistake by not acquiring any NBA players for bench

[BigGameDamian]

Hibbert might be a good center for our team but the Blazers would still be without a solid bench. Hopefully the Blazers can trade JJ for that promising SG they want. (Jeremy Lamb)

 

[Nikolokolus]

Regardless of the countless excuses u still always have a few quality bench players. That's a horrific job on the GM. I would fire him for that. Lillard was the obvious pick that even chad b could have made. Meyers looks average at best. As for hibbert everyone knew they would match.

So what has Neil done again except throwing our playoff chances and starters under a bus?

Do we really need to go digging up old draft threads. It certainly wasn't obvious around here.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Olshey drafted Lillard. It is that simple. What are you talking about?

Exactly. Olshey had been scouting all year for the Clippers, he was named the GM, hence the picks fall on him.

My question is this: if Lillard looked like a bust, would people be saying that Olshey didn't have authority to make the pick?

 

[Carlito]

What position did we need? Felton gone. Crawford gone. Nolan smith here.

That screams WE NEED A PG.

Lillard best PG in draft.

That's not hard math my friend.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Correction: best defensive big man who rebounds like a SF.

Correction to your correction. Hibbert has a TRB% of 16.2. That puts him 23rd in the league, which is basically middle of the pack for starting centers and power forwards. Not exceptional, but not as bad as you imply. The only SF with a TRB% over 14.0 is Shawn Marion at 15.2. LeBron James, who is an exceptional rebounder for a SF (although he's playing more PF this season) has a TRB% of 12.6. And for a little more perspective, Nicolas Batum, who is more typical of small forwards has a TRB% of 8.8.

Hibbert has a higher TRB% (16.2) than all of the following:

Marcin Gortat - 16.0
David Lee - 16.0
Joakim Noah - 15.9
Nikola Pekovic - 15.5
Blake Griffin - 15.3
Al Horford - 15.3
Serge Ibaka - 15.2
Brook Lopez - 14.9
Paul Millsap - 14.7
Chris Kaman - 14.4
Carl Landry - 14.4
Kevin Garnett - 14.2
Kendrick Perkins - 14.2

Still think Hibbert rebounds like a SF?

BNM

 

[Nikolokolus]

What position did we need? Felton gone. Crawford gone. Nolan smith here.

That screams WE NEED A PG.

Lillard best PG in draft.

That's not hard math my friend.

Well let's say Olshey had graded Lillard as a middle of the first round pick, wouldn't it make sense to trade back and get more assets and maybe pick up a point guard you think offers better value vs. blowing your sixth pick on a guy you don't think is that good?

Maybe this was just a case of need and value perfectly aligning, but at some point Olshey had to feel comfortable taking the kid and it's his pick. Just because he looks "obvious" with 20-20 hindsight, doesn't meant it looked that way at the time of the pick.

 

[julius]

Strawman. What does one have to do with the other????

BNM

giving credence to one player due to his teams record, but not the other?

 

[KeepOnRollin]

I keep seeing people say how bad Freeland is (and that was true early but not now) when he has arguably been better than Babbitt this year. I know they don't play the same position much (if at all) and that might show just how bad Babbitt is vs how good Freeland is but lets keep some perspective here. The whole bench stinks. Freeland is middle-of-the-road bad compared to our bench not near worst of the bunch.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I think Freeland has a chance to stick with some more seasoning, and the same goes for Leonard, but the rest of that bunch should probably invest their salary wisely.

 

[KeepOnRollin]

I think Freeland has a chance to stick with some more seasoning, and the same goes for Leonard, but the rest of that bunch should probably invest their salary wisely.

Agreed, the only other one I might put in that category is Claver but that is if he can learn to finish his drives on a consistent basis. He is willing so that is a start.

Edit: and I guess who knows about Barton...

 

[Nikolokolus]

Agreed, the only other one I might put in that category is Claver but that is if he can learn to finish his drives on a consistent basis. He is willing so that is a start.

Edit: and I guess who knows about Barton...

Yeah ... I guess? I'm a little more lenient on big men because I know it can take them awhile to adjust to the NBA. Barton is a second round pick so I don't expect much from him and for whatever reason when I watch Claver and I just don't see an NBA player. Who knows, maybe they all take a step forward next season, maybe none of them. We'll see.

 

[Carlito]

Only keepers are Meyers and Freeland. That's being generous.

There's a 1000 better Barton's out there u can put on ur bench.

Nolan Smith couldn't play in YMCA leagues.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I think he might've said he was in favor of him, but that's awful lot of clout in less than a month.

I think you may be confusing the 2012 draft with previous years where we either had a lame duck GM, no GM or an interim GM. In 2012 we actually had a real, honest-to-god GM whose future employment depended on a successful draft. Do you really think Olshey is dumb enough to risk his job based on what Chad Buchanan (who brought us Nolan Smith over Kenneth Faried, among other colossal draft day fuck ups) and the rest of the Blazers "brain trust" had to say?

We gripe about LaMarcus' rebound #'s, this guys is worse.

No he's not. Hibbert has a TRB% of 16.2. LaMarcus has a TRB% of 13.3.

why do teams want benches if it's not apparently important?

Another strawman. I never said a bench isn't important. Even if your starters all play 40 MPG (none of ours do) and none of your starters ever miss a game (other than Lillard, all of ours have), you still need a bench to keep you in the game until your starters return. Unfortunately, we don't have that. So, in an effort to win as many games as possible, Stotts relies on our starters more than average. But, since none of our starters seem to be suffering any ill effects, I don't see why you think he's burning them out.

really, you don't see a connection between players playing huge minutes and burning out? Or that having bench players helps keep starters going?

Depends on the player. Ever since his second season, Aldridge has played big minutes. He played MORE minutes under Nate when we had a MUCH better bench. So, how is Stotts burning him out by playing him less minutes than Nate did? Batum and Lillard are both young and playing big minutes is actually HELPING them, both short term and long term. They are developing faster by playing more.

And a HUGE reason why Kobe is playing so many minutes is BECAUSE their teams bench sucks shit.

Which is why I said, "I'd be much more worried about the 34-year old Kobe Bryant, in his 17th NBA season averaging more MPG than the 27-year old LaMarcus Aldridge in his 7th season." Yet, 34-year old Kobe is leading the league in scoring. Not exactly what I'd call burned out. Again, it depends on the player.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

giving credence to one player due to his teams record, but not the other?

They both make their teams better. Would the Blazers be 20-20 without Aldridge? No. Would the Pacers be 25-16 without Hibbert? No.

I don't see any inconsistency in my position.

The real question is, would the Blazers be better with Hibbert than they are without him. There is no way to know for sure, but given how weak our interior defense is, and what a good interior defender Hibbert is, I contend our record would be better than 20-20 if we had Hibbert as our starting center.

BNM

 

[BBert]

I know we tend to think basketball players should play balls out every moment they are on the court, but we know that's not reality. I think it's not so much the minutes our starters play, which don't look too bad, but the fact that our bench performs so badly, that our starters are desperately playing balls out to keep even or catch up so often. The bench puts a lot of pressure on them and I do think it wears them out. Still, I think Olshey knew how bad our bench was and that developing the starters and playing for the lottery was the plan. Of course, he didn't tell me that so I'm basically speculating out my ear.

 

[KingSpeed]

Olshey's PR job at the moment is to placate the masses until the off season when he can look for ways to improve the team beyond a few meaningless immediate wins. We fans want to win every game. His job is to make good long-term (which in the NBA is what 4 years?) decisions for the health of the franchise.

To put it in a way you guys might understand: Most fans would spend every dime they have today on the lap dance in front of them. I wiser man would forego a lap dance today, and save up for a happy ending tomorrow.

And I am quite happy how last year's draft turned out.

We can't wait four years with Aldridge in his prime NOW. We have to be significantly improved next year and a serious contender in two years.

 

[Nikolokolus]

We can't wait four years with Aldridge in his prime NOW. We have to be significantly improved next year and a serious contender in two years.

No arguing with that.

 

[BBert]

We can't wait four years with Aldridge in his prime NOW. We have to be significantly improved next year and a serious contender in two years.

I can live with that.

I just don't think getting a slightly less suckish bench right now and getting bounced in the first round, and losing this year's lotto pick, gets us closer to that timeline. If (big if) we can have a successful off-season, there will also be plenty of better bench players available than what we have now, and I actually think your timeline is very realistic. This year though, even if we make it, we will be pathetic playoff fodder.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I can live with that.

I just don't think getting a slightly less suckish bench right now and getting bounced in the first round, and losing this year's lotto pick, gets us closer to that timeline. If (big if) we can have a successful off-season, there will also be plenty of better bench players available than what we have now, and I actually think your timeline is very realistic. This year though, even if we make it, we will be pathetic playoff fodder.

Agreed, unless a deadline deal that makes us a contender now, and doesn't mortgage the future comes along (and let's face it, that's not gonna happen). I'm fine with staying pat until the summer when we will have lots of cap space and perhaps another lottery pick. Who knows, with all that cap space, in addition to free agent signings, we also have the possibility of working a sign-and-trade, or an unbalanced trade, or maybe moving up in the draft by taking back a decent player with a big contract. Think about it, if a team wants to dump salary, they may be willing to swap draft picks to get rid of a productive, but overpaid player in exchange for some cap/luxury tax relief. Given the amount of cap space we will have, and the amount of money Paul Allen has, that may be a good move. Worst case, we get a guy who is overpaid for a year or two, but instantly makes our bench better - and a high lottery pick.

And besides, we may very well squeak into the playoffs as the 8th seed without making any moves. I actually see this as a win:win situation. If we make the playoffs, great. Even if we get swept in the first round, it's a good learning experience for our young players. All young players have first time playoff butterflies. Might as well get them out of the way now and not wait until we actually have the talent to win a first round series. Plus, I think making the playoffs keeps LaMarcus Aldridge happy for another year. If we miss the playoffs, we get a lottery pick, which depending on the pick (and if we trade up) may give us another starter, or at least strengthen our bench. Either way, we go into the summer of 2013 in much better shape than the summer of 2012.

BNM

 

[Mediocre Man]

Do you just ignore all the other stats?

Not at all, but that stat speaks volume about the impact for each

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Not at all, but that stat speaks volume about the impact for each

If you take all of the stats into consideration, the upgrade from Hickson to Pekovic is not a big one, let alone huge. Especially when you consider that Pekovic is 3 years older and will have to be paid more than Hickson.

 

[magnifier661]

he's not worth an almost max salary at 10 points and 8 rebounds a game.

I don't know man. I think he would be perfect. I think hickson has advantage because of all the attention Aldridge gets down low. Also; we are terrible on the defensive end. And even though hibbert is only giving them 10-8; he's still much better defensively 2.9 blocks; and stopping the other teams center.

Also hibbert actually has a low post game and sets great picks. Those picks would help Lillard do so much more.

 

[BBert]

Hibbert: I wanted him then. I want him now. I rarely get what I want.

 

[Nikolokolus]

The only real disaster moves I can imagine this year would be adding just enough bench fodder with bad contracts to get us to an 8th seed, or just missing the playoffs with a 13th or 14th draft spot. If this current squad can get into the playoffs and take some lumps and they keep their salary flexibility I don't think that's as favorable as getting a top ten pick, but I can live with it.

That said, I don't really think this team looks very playoff worthy. I suspect we'll see the Lakers barely get in, Houston probably has a shot if they can turn around their current slide and Utah could get in too.

 

[WillG]

Recall reading that Lillard was an Olshey pick.

Found the article:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...ian-lillard-portland-trail-blazers/index.html

 

[magnifier661]

The only real disaster moves I can imagine this year would be adding just enough bench fodder with bad contracts to get us to an 8th seed, or just missing the playoffs with a 13th or 14th draft spot. If this current squad can get into the playoffs and take some lumps and they keep their salary flexibility I don't think that's as favorable as getting a top ten pick, but I can live with it.

That said, I don't really think this team looks very playoff worthy. I suspect we'll see the Lakers barely get in, Houston probably has a shot if they can turn around their current slide and Utah could get in too.

You have somewhat of a point; but these heavy minutes can be hard on the players we really want to keep. We need help to take some of the heavy minutes away from our starters. We could see injuries due to fatigue.

 

[MickZagger]

Not giving Olshey credit for drafting Lillard is stupid if you ask me.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Is this (literally) the worst bench in NBA history?

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Not giving Olshey credit for drafting Lillard is stupid if you ask me.

If Lillard had sucked Olshey would be taking the blame for drafting him.

 

[magnifier661]

Is this (literally) the worst bench in NBA history?

I wouldn't doubt it. Aren't we averaging only 10ppg? Our starters need to score at least 85 points in order to win games. If two have an off night; we are dead.