Roster Math and the Third Point Guard

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NetsDaily said:
The Nets have 16 players under contract–including Keith Van Horn, but want to add a third point guard and get down to 14 players by October 27, when final rosters are set. Getting down to 14 may be the last thing the team does as teams wait til the last minute to see what they can get for their excess pieces. In the meantime, expect the next priority to be that third point guard. We offer some possibilities.



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Gotta admit, I'm not all that ecstatic with the choices left of FA point guards. Will Conroy seems interesting, but I'm not too sure he'll cut it.

Trade's gotta be the way to go.

What do you guys think?
 
Do they know something we don't, or is this just a mistake?
Potential guests at the Phil Ford Golf Classic: Darrell Armstrong – NBA Chicago Bulls.
link
 
we traded rose for DA straight up!!!

ok, but really, I wouldn't mind keeping DA (first choice) , 2nd choice would be Livingston (not sure if he'll get starting jobs anywhere but I'm sure a team will take a risk...otherwise I think he'd be a nice backup) 3rd choice being Conroy.
 
we traded rose for DA straight up!!!

ok, but really, I wouldn't mind keeping DA (first choice) , 2nd choice would be Livingston (not sure if he'll get starting jobs anywhere but I'm sure a team will take a risk...otherwise I think he'd be a nice backup) 3rd choice being Conroy.
Livingston is an interesting option...he's still only 22. I'd assume he'd be a cheap, short term signing.

I mean, obviously he can't really be counted on for anything at this point, but if he could come back and be (somewhat) productive, that's another young piece on the team. It's a bit of a risk, but not a bad one for a rebuilding team to make.
 
Livingston is an interesting option...he's still only 22. I'd assume he'd be a cheap, short term signing.

I mean, obviously he can't really be counted on for anything at this point, but if he could come back and be (somewhat) productive, that's another young piece on the team. It's a bit of a risk, but not a bad one for a rebuilding team to make.
Yeah, it'd be nice for us...but I believe he's expecting to have a big role on a team. And a guaranteed contract, possibly multiple years.

But I think I'd take the risk with some of the remaining MLE. Doesn't like like there's too much of a chance our backcourt will be too crowded, anyways.
 
Yeah, it'd be nice for us...but I believe he's expecting to have a big role on a team. And a guaranteed contract, possibly multiple years.

But I think I'd take the risk with some of the remaining MLE. Doesn't like like there's too much of a chance our backcourt will be too crowded, anyways.
I'm sure he'd like that, but I don't think he's going to get that from anywhere (although, crazier things have happened).

I can't see many teams wanting to lock him up long term until they can get a better look at how he is now, and how his leg holds up. He was only cleared to play agian what, 2 months ago?
 
We are talking about a 3rd string pointguard, who will only play garbage minutes, or when Harris or/and Dooling are injured.

All those options are perfect, with Livingston being risky, because he might become a cancer, if he doesn't get playing time.

DA, Hunter are my favourites (i'd prefer a hard nosed real veteran), but i'm totally ok with Conroy too.
Cassell probably wouldn't come, and i'm not sure i'd want him either.

I hope we can make a 3 or 4 for 1 trade for a better starter at either C or SF.
Right now we have Boone and Simmons starting in those positions, and i'm ok if one of them starts, but the two are too much together imo.
we should not start 2 players who wouldn't start anywhere else in the league...
 
I would definitely go Livingston if he agrees to the role beforehand. Otherwise I agree he could become a cancer (Magloire). I was pissed we didnt sign Jaycee. I also dont want Keyon backing up the 2 with CDR on the team. Keep Dooling as the backup pg. This 3rd stringer wont play at all so no point wasting money on him.
 
None of these guys say "HAVE TO GET HIM". DA would be cool because he is a vet that plays D and doesnt mind riding the bench. Jones can play pressure D and can score. Livingston is probably the least interesting. Yeah he has potential play PG, but he was an OK scorer and defender. Conroy is OK.
 
I just hope the Nets make a good choice on who they choose. This isn't a throw away spot- we need someone who can help.
 
I was looking over some rosters and saw the Knicks only have one guy that can play center in Curry (Does Jerome James even come to the games?). So I was thinking what about a trade where the Knicks send over Malik Rose and Mardy Collins for Swift and Hassell?

Swift can play either back up center or pf and play along side either Curry, Randolph, or Lee. He can give them some rebounding and athleticism and his contract is expiring like Rose.

Knicks would have to take on the extra year of Hassell's contract but that doesn't interfere with cap space for 2010. Mardy Collins is contract filler to make the trade work but he can be the 3rd string PG for next season and the Nets don't have to pick up his team option after the season.

If they can't do anything more meaningful with Swifts contract before the seasons starts, then maybe the Knicks could use him and the Nets could save some money by packaging Hassell with Swift.
 
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I would definitely go Livingston if he agrees to the role beforehand. Otherwise I agree he could become a cancer (Magloire). I was pissed we didnt sign Jaycee. I also dont want Keyon backing up the 2 with CDR on the team. Keep Dooling as the backup pg. This 3rd stringer wont play at all so no point wasting money on him.

Magloire wasn't a cancer. He actually acted very professionally as a Net..
 
Magloire wasn't a cancer. He actually acted very professionally as a Net..

Nor is Livingston. He is very professional and has worked very hard in his rehab...there is a video of him doing repetitive tasks to get back into shape. No matter who he plays with (unless it's the Knicks), you have to wish him well. His love of the game is unquestioned.
 
Livingston is an interesting option...he's still only 22. I'd assume he'd be a cheap, short term signing.

I mean, obviously he can't really be counted on for anything at this point, but if he could come back and be (somewhat) productive, that's another young piece on the team. It's a bit of a risk, but not a bad one for a rebuilding team to make.

I thought I read Livingston wanted to go to a team where'd he'd get playing time and be paid well.

A D-league star, or veteran (but not too old) is the way to go for a third-string PG I think. Someone who will prize every minute he gets on the court and cheer his ass off when he's on the bench. I think Will Conroy would be fine.
 
Livingston would be a good option as the 3rd PG, but given the young team, it's worth having DA back another season. I mean he won't rock the boat. Also VC could play some PG in a pinch, gives CDR more floor burn too. Unless Frank has ideas of playing Dooling at 2 some minutes, I'd rather pass on the 3rd PG and buy one when the need arises.
 
Livingston would be a good option as the 3rd PG, but given the young team, it's worth having DA back another season. I mean he won't rock the boat. Also VC could play some PG in a pinch, gives CDR more floor burn too. Unless Frank has ideas of playing Dooling at 2 some minutes, I'd rather pass on the 3rd PG and buy one when the need arises.

VC is a SG/SF. Lets not get too comfortable with this VC at PG stuff. VC needs to Score for us to win. Yeah if he is doubled he must find the open man but lets move away from this stuff. We need a third string PG or combo guard. Period. Is hodges still up in the air?
 
I know we don't want to say VC's a PG option but he's the best play maker on the team period. He's in the same situation as JJ is in Atlanta and LeBron in Cleveland. They may not be point guards but they are the guys who needs to make the decisions on their squads. There is no question we need Vince to score we also need him to get everyone else of the floor their shots as well so yes we do need to consider him a PG. There is no question Dooling and Harris will help take some of the pressure off Vince but both of those guys are better at attacking and getting their own based off of the attention VC commands defensively. Those 3 guys are gonna play a majority of the minutes and give us two ball handlers at all times, add Hayes and CDR to the backcourt mix i'm having trouble seeing where another PG is gonna get any play outside of an injury.
 
I know we don't want to say VC's a PG option but he's the best play maker on the team period. He's in the same situation as JJ is in Atlanta and LeBron in Cleveland. They may not be point guards but they are the guys who needs to make the decisions on their squads. There is no question we need Vince to score we also need him to get everyone else of the floor their shots as well so yes we do need to consider him a PG. There is no question Dooling and Harris will help take some of the pressure off Vince but both of those guys are better at attacking and getting their own based off of the attention VC commands defensively. Those 3 guys are gonna play a majority of the minutes and give us two ball handlers at all times, add Hayes and CDR to the backcourt mix i'm having trouble seeing where another PG is gonna get any play outside of an injury.
That's the reason I wouldn't mind seeing Conroy make the team. If he never gets on the court I don't think he would mind.
 
I know we don't want to say VC's a PG option but he's the best play maker on the team period. He's in the same situation as JJ is in Atlanta and LeBron in Cleveland. They may not be point guards but they are the guys who needs to make the decisions on their squads. There is no question we need Vince to score we also need him to get everyone else of the floor their shots as well so yes we do need to consider him a PG. There is no question Dooling and Harris will help take some of the pressure off Vince but both of those guys are better at attacking and getting their own based off of the attention VC commands defensively. Those 3 guys are gonna play a majority of the minutes and give us two ball handlers at all times, add Hayes and CDR to the backcourt mix i'm having trouble seeing where another PG is gonna get any play outside of an injury.

I never agreed with this concept. This will only make him more lenient to not step up where he is needed most, scoring. I also blame Frank for this. I never liked the idea of VC walking the ball up the court. PG brings ball up, VC should be moving to get to an open area to do what he is suppose to. Get the ball make something happen. If you get doubled give the ball up. That top of the key fake like the defender hit you so you can go way out of the play stuff is tired and a waste of the shot clock. I want to see VC ask for the ball when he is in one of his comfort spots or open or when he has a mismatch.

As far as Lebron and Kobe not needing a PG, Please those guys are always saying that they want to play with a true PG. They know it would make it easier for them. All they would have to do is concentrate on scoring and defending. JJ wont have to do that anymore he has Bibby. It is only an idiot like Frank that takes the ball out of the hands of a HOF PG. Instead of motivating VC to get F'en open.
 
As far as Lebron and Kobe not needing a PG, Please those guys are always saying that they want to play with a true PG. They know it would make it easier for them. All they would have to do is concentrate on scoring and defending. JJ wont have to do that anymore he has Bibby. It is only an idiot like Frank that takes the ball out of the hands of a HOF PG. Instead of motivating VC to get F'en open.

Oh yes, as evident of their great use of Jason Kidd during the Olympics.

With guys like Lebron, Kobe, JJ, Hedo, etc; there is not much of a need for a natural PG on the floor.
 
I never agreed with this concept. This will only make him more lenient to not step up where he is needed most, scoring. I also blame Frank for this. I never liked the idea of VC walking the ball up the court. PG brings ball up, VC should be moving to get to an open area to do what he is suppose to. Get the ball make something happen. If you get doubled give the ball up. That top of the key fake like the defender hit you so you can go way out of the play stuff is tired and a waste of the shot clock. I want to see VC ask for the ball when he is in one of his comfort spots or open or when he has a mismatch.

As far as Lebron and Kobe not needing a PG, Please those guys are always saying that they want to play with a true PG. They know it would make it easier for them. All they would have to do is concentrate on scoring and defending. JJ wont have to do that anymore he has Bibby. It is only an idiot like Frank that takes the ball out of the hands of a HOF PG. Instead of motivating VC to get F'en open.
You're mixing up Vince with Rip Hamilton. Working off the ball the majority of the time is just not his game.
 
Oh yes, as evident of their great use of Jason Kidd during the Olympics.

With guys like Lebron, Kobe, JJ, Hedo, etc; there is not much of a need for a natural PG on the floor.

Did you just compare the Redeem team to a regular NBA team?

My comment is just based on the comments made by some of these players. Lebron and kobe were upset Kidd was never traded to their team. If Kidd was getting paid less and the Lakers and the Cavs could have gotten him, dont you think they would have?
 
You're mixing up Vince with Rip Hamilton. Working off the ball the majority of the time is just not his game.


No I am not. Rip is the extreme of what I am saying. I am up court without the ball and getting open. Not standing on a wing and waiting for the ball so you can get an iso.
 
Did you just compare the Redeem team to a regular NBA team?

My comment is just based on the comments made by some of these players. Lebron and kobe were upset Kidd was never traded to their team. If Kidd was getting paid less and the Lakers and the Cavs could have gotten him, dont you think they would have?

Not at all. I'm saying that even though all these players are talking about how they want to play with a great natural PG, in Kidd, when they actually did have him on their team...they didn't use him much at all. Think about it.
 
I never agreed with this concept. This will only make him more lenient to not step up where he is needed most, scoring. I also blame Frank for this. I never liked the idea of VC walking the ball up the court. PG brings ball up, VC should be moving to get to an open area to do what he is suppose to. Get the ball make something happen. If you get doubled give the ball up. That top of the key fake like the defender hit you so you can go way out of the play stuff is tired and a waste of the shot clock. I want to see VC ask for the ball when he is in one of his comfort spots or open or when he has a mismatch.

As far as Lebron and Kobe not needing a PG, Please those guys are always saying that they want to play with a true PG. They know it would make it easier for them. All they would have to do is concentrate on scoring and defending. JJ wont have to do that anymore he has Bibby. It is only an idiot like Frank that takes the ball out of the hands of a HOF PG. Instead of motivating VC to get F'en open.

I'm fine if that's the way you see it but the only thing that combats your argument is just how well VC played after the all star break doing the very thing I said we'd ask him to be doing this year. There will be times where Harris and Dooling are setting up VC in his sweet spot but honestly that kinda off the ball movement and ditching/posting his defender is as much work if not more than giving Vince the ball and asking him to make the right play. We're going to be counting on him for heavy minutes as is so there is a balancing act.

When you have stars like a LeBron, JJ, VC, Wade, Kobe, etc. they need to be the decision makers. It's just the way the league has shifted, especially as the rules allow players with their versatility the upper hand on the offensive end. VC and Devin's ability to create their own shots and get into the lane are pretty much what our offense is going to depend/thrive on. I personally want the ball in their hands at all times.

As far as your Bibby reference, just look back to the series against the Celtics. They could not get the ball in JJ's hands fast enough because Bibby is slowly becoming Mike James from Toronto a few seasons ago. That's all in all not an entirely bad thing as JJ and Josh are the setup men and with Al down low, all Mike really has to do is hit open shots and bring the ball up. He's not a setup man anymore, he's a draw and kick player that's slowly becoming a spot up shooter.

Would every team like CP3, Deron, Steve? Sure, but getting back to the topic at hand we're not gonna find a guy like that at this time of year, nor do we have the pieces to acquire one.

Netted's Will Conroy idea isn't too shabby. He'd save us the extra cash we'd have to pay a more experienced guy like Andre Barrett and Will wouldn't kill us if we needed fill in duty. I still personally like the Livingston idea, getting him back and NBA ready this season to reap the benefits the next but admittedly that's a longshot. He does want a nice secure contract, you can't blame him there, and it's hard to imagine Kiki and Rod taking that gamble.
 
As much as I like the idea of bringing in livingston, we really don't need him. We just traded for dooling's new contact. Dooling does play the 2 but looking at our roster many guys like Hayes, simmons are interchangeable at the 2/3 sports. Resigning DA is the best option, he brings vet leadership, he knows the system and he gets one more year being a player-coach.
 
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