Shooting at Umpqua Community College: 10 dead

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We banned drugs. How did that work out for us?
It's not about banning guns. It's about making sure there are background checks. It's too easy for anyone to get a gun now and that's not safe. Did you listen to the President's speech? He was very clear. No one wants to ban guns but there are laws that can be made that will greatly reduce gun violence. And most gun owners AGREE with the President. It's the people in Congress who are out of touch.
 
Keep talking about politics. I spent my day texting friends and family. I wanted to make sure they were okay. I had a friend that died today, and I am crying while I write this. But please keep on arguing about shit. ......
Sorry man. These shootings are happening over and over and over. It is stupid to not want to fix it. Other countries have shown how to cut down on gun violence. We need to follow their suit.
 
It would certainly be better to just pretend there is no possible solution and that we just have to live with this type of violence, rather than debate the alternatives.

barfo
Don't you think it would have been better if he came out and say "My thoughts and prayers go out to all the victims and their families from this gruesome act of terror." The end...
 
Keep talking about politics. I spent my day texting friends and family. I wanted to make sure they were okay. I had a friend that died today, and I am crying while I write this. But please keep on arguing about shit. ......
Sorry for your loss bro...
 
Sorry man. These shootings are happening over and over and over. It is stupid to not want to fix it. Other countries have shown how to cut down on gun violence. We need to follow their suit.
You mean like in Switzerland where 1 out of every 2 citizen owns a gun and they have the lowest gun violence in the world?
 
Keep talking about politics. I spent my day texting friends and family. I wanted to make sure they were okay. I had a friend that died today, and I am crying while I write this. But please keep on arguing about shit. ......

I'm truly sorry for your loss.
 
It's not about banning guns. It's about making sure there are background checks. It's too easy for anyone to get a gun now and that's not safe. Did you listen to the President's speech? He was very clear. No one wants to ban guns but there are laws that can be made that will greatly reduce gun violence. And most gun owners AGREE with the President. It's the people in Congress who are out of touch.
You aren't understanding from my post. It would be illegal for X individual to get a gun from a background check. That individual could still purchase a gun illegally.

Or let's put it another way. Pharma drugs like vicodine are heavily regulated, yet they are sold in the streets illegally. We can't stop that either.
 
You mean like in Switzerland where 1 out of every 2 citizen owns a gun and they have the lowest gun violence in the world?

Why not tell the more accurate and complete story about this?

Gun politics in Switzerland are unique in Europe. The vast majority of men between the ages of 20 and 30 are conscripted into the militia and undergo military training, including weapons training. The personal weapons of the militia are kept at home as part of the military obligations. However, it is generally not permitted to keep army-issued ammunition, but compatible ammunition purchased for privately owned guns is permitted. At the end of military service period the previously used gun can be converted to a privately owned gun after a weapon acquisition permit has been granted (fully automatic weapons will be rebuilt into semi-automatic ones). Switzerland thus has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world.


Buying guns
In order to purchase most weapons, the purchaser must obtain a weapon acquisition permit (Art. 8 WG). Swiss citizens over the age of 18 who are not psychiatrically disqualified nor identified as posing security problems, and who have a clean criminal record can request such a permit. Foreigners with the following citizenship are explicitly excluded from the right to possess weapons: Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kosovo, Macedonia, Turkey, Sri Lanka, Algeria and Albania (Art. 12, WV). The following information must be provided to the cantonal weapon bureau together with the weapon application form:

  • valid official identification or passport copy
  • residence address
  • criminal record copy not older than 3 months
For each transfer of a weapon or an essential weapon component without weapons acquisition permit (Art. 10 WG), a written contract must be concluded. Each Party shall keep them at least ten years. The contract must include the following information (Art. 11 WG):

  • Family name, first name, birth date, residence address and signature of the person who sells the weapon or essential weapon component
  • Family name, first name, birth date, residence address and signature of the person who purchases the weapon or an essential weapon component
  • Kind of weapon, manufacturer or producer, label, caliber, weapon number, and date and place of transfer;
  • Type and number of official identification of the person who acquires the weapon or the essential weapon component
  • and an indication of the processing of personal data in connection with the contract in accordance with the privacy policy of the Federation or the cantons, if firearms are transmitted.
This information must be sent within 30 days to the cantonal weapon registration bureau, where the weapon holders are registered (Art. 9 WG).

Some weapons do not need a weapon acquisition permit (Art. 10 WG):

  • Single-shot and multi-barreled hunting rifles and replicas of single-shot muzzle
  • By the Federal Council designated hand bolt-action rifles, which are commonly used in off-duty and sporting gunnery recognized by the military law of 3 February 1952 and shooting clubs for hunting purposes in Switzerland
  • Single-shot rabbit slayer;
  • Compressed air and CO2 weapons that develop a muzzle energy of at least 7.5 joules, or may be confused because of their appearance with real firearms
Buying Ammunition


Ready ammunition of the Swiss Army. Soldiers equipped with the Sig 550 assault rifle used to be issued 50 rounds of ammunition in a sealed can, to be opened only upon alert and for use while en route to join their unit. This practice was stopped in 2007.[9]
In order to purchase Ammunition the buyer must follows the same legal rules like for buying guns. The buyer can only buy munition for guns he/she is legally owning and must provide the following information to the seller (Art. 15, 16 WG; Art 24 WV):[7][8]

  • valid official identification or passport (and must be older than 18 who are not psychiatric-ally disqualified nor identified as posing security problems, and must not be a citizen of the following countries (Art. 12 WV): Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kosovo, Macedonia, Turkey, Sri Lanka, Algeria and Albania)
  • residence address
  • criminal record copy not older than 3 months
  • weapon acquisition permit not older than 2 years, or a weapon carrying permit not older than 5 years
This also applies for weapons which do not require a weapon acquisition permit (see above, excluding the weapon acquisition permit, of course).

This information must be sent within 30 days to the cantonal weapon registration bureau, where the weapon holder is registered.

The same applies to black powder and modern black powder substitutes for use in firing historical rifles.



A Swiss 100 gram black powder container.
The possession of the following munition is generally prohibited:

  • Ammunition with armor piercing bullets
  • Ammunition with projectiles containing an explosive or incendiary device
  • Ammunition with one or more floors to the release of substances which damage the health of people in the long run
  • Ammunition, missiles and missile launchers for military explosive
  • Ammunition with projectiles for transmitting electric shocks
  • Ammunition for handguns with deformation effect
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland
 
Why not tell the more accurate and complete story about this?

Gun politics in Switzerland are unique in Europe. The vast majority of men between the ages of 20 and 30 are conscripted into the militia and undergo military training, including weapons training. The personal weapons of the militia are kept at home as part of the military obligations. However, it is generally not permitted to keep army-issued ammunition, but compatible ammunition purchased for privately owned guns is permitted. At the end of military service period the previously used gun can be converted to a privately owned gun after a weapon acquisition permit has been granted (fully automatic weapons will be rebuilt into semi-automatic ones). Switzerland thus has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world.


Buying guns
In order to purchase most weapons, the purchaser must obtain a weapon acquisition permit (Art. 8 WG). Swiss citizens over the age of 18 who are not psychiatrically disqualified nor identified as posing security problems, and who have a clean criminal record can request such a permit. Foreigners with the following citizenship are explicitly excluded from the right to possess weapons: Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kosovo, Macedonia, Turkey, Sri Lanka, Algeria and Albania (Art. 12, WV). The following information must be provided to the cantonal weapon bureau together with the weapon application form:

  • valid official identification or passport copy
  • residence address
  • criminal record copy not older than 3 months
For each transfer of a weapon or an essential weapon component without weapons acquisition permit (Art. 10 WG), a written contract must be concluded. Each Party shall keep them at least ten years. The contract must include the following information (Art. 11 WG):

  • Family name, first name, birth date, residence address and signature of the person who sells the weapon or essential weapon component
  • Family name, first name, birth date, residence address and signature of the person who purchases the weapon or an essential weapon component
  • Kind of weapon, manufacturer or producer, label, caliber, weapon number, and date and place of transfer;
  • Type and number of official identification of the person who acquires the weapon or the essential weapon component
  • and an indication of the processing of personal data in connection with the contract in accordance with the privacy policy of the Federation or the cantons, if firearms are transmitted.
This information must be sent within 30 days to the cantonal weapon registration bureau, where the weapon holders are registered (Art. 9 WG).

Some weapons do not need a weapon acquisition permit (Art. 10 WG):

  • Single-shot and multi-barreled hunting rifles and replicas of single-shot muzzle
  • By the Federal Council designated hand bolt-action rifles, which are commonly used in off-duty and sporting gunnery recognized by the military law of 3 February 1952 and shooting clubs for hunting purposes in Switzerland
  • Single-shot rabbit slayer;
  • Compressed air and CO2 weapons that develop a muzzle energy of at least 7.5 joules, or may be confused because of their appearance with real firearms
Buying Ammunition


Ready ammunition of the Swiss Army. Soldiers equipped with the Sig 550 assault rifle used to be issued 50 rounds of ammunition in a sealed can, to be opened only upon alert and for use while en route to join their unit. This practice was stopped in 2007.[9]
In order to purchase Ammunition the buyer must follows the same legal rules like for buying guns. The buyer can only buy munition for guns he/she is legally owning and must provide the following information to the seller (Art. 15, 16 WG; Art 24 WV):[7][8]

  • valid official identification or passport (and must be older than 18 who are not psychiatric-ally disqualified nor identified as posing security problems, and must not be a citizen of the following countries (Art. 12 WV): Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Kosovo, Macedonia, Turkey, Sri Lanka, Algeria and Albania)
  • residence address
  • criminal record copy not older than 3 months
  • weapon acquisition permit not older than 2 years, or a weapon carrying permit not older than 5 years
This also applies for weapons which do not require a weapon acquisition permit (see above, excluding the weapon acquisition permit, of course).

This information must be sent within 30 days to the cantonal weapon registration bureau, where the weapon holder is registered.

The same applies to black powder and modern black powder substitutes for use in firing historical rifles.



A Swiss 100 gram black powder container.
The possession of the following munition is generally prohibited:

  • Ammunition with armor piercing bullets
  • Ammunition with projectiles containing an explosive or incendiary device
  • Ammunition with one or more floors to the release of substances which damage the health of people in the long run
  • Ammunition, missiles and missile launchers for military explosive
  • Ammunition with projectiles for transmitting electric shocks
  • Ammunition for handguns with deformation effect
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland
Because I like my answer better.

It's not as good as having dead oceans and melting ice bergs, but having a gun in 1 out of every 2 citizens has the safest country in the world. Amirite????
 
Because I like my answer better.

It's not as good as having dead oceans and melting ice bergs, but having a gun in 1 out of every 2 citizens has the safest country in the world. Amirite????
You mean that country with a population of 2?
 
Because I like my answer better.

It's not as good as having dead oceans and melting ice bergs, but having a gun in 1 out of every 2 citizens has the safest country in the world. Amirite????

But there is much more to it than just the simplicity and vagueness of the statistic that you stated.

Mandatory military service.

Mandatory military weapons training.

National registration of weapons and weapons owners.

National registration of ammunition and ammunition purchasers.

Look at the control. Much much much stricter than here. The safety is in the training and control of the weapons. Not the amount of guns. Surely you understand that right? Using Switzerland as an example only shows what increased control can do, not what increased gun ownership can do.
 
I wish guns were gone just for the simple fact that I could take whatever I wanted from 99.99 percent of the rest of you.

The tiny percentage I couldn't beat up I could run over with my car if I had to.
 
But there is much more to it than just the simplicity and vagueness of the statistic that you stat.

Mandatory military service.

Mandatory military weapons training.

National registration of weapons and weapons owners.

National registration of ammunition and ammunition purchasers.

Look at the control. Much much much stricter than here. The safety is in the training and control of the weapons. Not the amount of guns. Surely you understand that right? Using Switzerland as an example only shows what increased control can do, not what increased gun ownership can do.
This...I think the registration of ammunition is huge and would have a big impact on control..training goes without saying..I think limiting round capacity should seriously be looked at as well for the private owner.
 
But there is much more to it than just the simplicity and vagueness of the statistic that you stat.

Mandatory military service.

Mandatory military weapons training.

National registration of weapons and weapons owners.

National registration of ammunition and ammunition purchasers.

Look at the control. Much much much stricter than here. The safety is in the training and control of the weapons. Not the amount of guns. Surely you understand that right? Using Switzerland as an example only shows what increased control can do, not what increased gun ownership can do.
You keep neglecting how they pick immigrants from certain countries to exclude. We could exclude people we choose as well. Random people to exclude, going from least offensive to most.

1. People in prison, not ex convicts...current convicts.
2. Ex convicts.
3. People on crazy pills
4. Little people (just to keep people from getting shot in the dick)
5. Potheads
6. Meth heads
7. Mags
8. Immigrants


I stopped at immigrants because it just gets more offensive.

Seriously the point I am making is that according to your post they don't allow people from certain countries to own guns, where would we draw the line?

I wouldn't let any Serbians own guns here but that is just because I wouldn't let any Serbians come here in the first place. Yes, that makes me a monster.

I would only let Norwegian women come here, maybe a few others but only women.
 
You keep neglecting how they pick immigrants from certain countries to exclude. We could exclude people we choose as well. Random people to exclude, going from least offensive to most.

1. People in prison, not ex convicts...current convicts.
2. Ex convicts.
3. People on crazy pills
4. Little people (just to keep people from getting shot in the dick)
5. Potheads
6. Meth heads
7. Mags
8. Immigrants


I stopped at immigrants because it just gets more offensive.

Seriously the point I am making is that according to your post they don't allow people from certain countries to own guns, where would we draw the line?

I wouldn't let any Serbians own guns here but that is just because I wouldn't let any Serbians come here in the first place. Yes, that makes me a monster.

I would only let Norwegian women come here, maybe a few others but only women.

I didn't neglect anything. I included that information. I didn't point it out to Mags because it had no bearing on the point he was erroneously trying to make.

As far as your list goes why do you want to prevent everyone on RipCityTwo from owning a gun?
 
I know a guy who hasn't had his own car on the road since 2010 give or take and has made his poor wife drive him to work every day. He also had a 401k check of some sort in the years after that he used on an AR15. I think that was what it was, it was badass looking.

His car is still not fixed, but he got a cool gun.

I'd take his away on principle.
 
He also didn't think Howard Stern's smallest penis contest was either funny or sad. I felt bad for showing it to him after I saw his reaction. Especially considering I prefaced it with how I'd jump off a building if I were one of the contestants.
 
Don't you think it would have been better if he came out and say "My thoughts and prayers go out to all the victims and their families from this gruesome act of terror." The end...

No. He's not the Queen of England. It's his job to deal with shit, not just to go to funerals and wave in parades.

barfo
 
And yet 'crazy people' have no problem getting their hands on guns.

That's the problem. It's too easy to get a gun.


Regardless of law unfortunately, the crazies will get them any other way. Black marker, stealing, etc.

Hell and if not guns, a pressure cooker, or a knife, etc, etc, etc.

The problem is the mental health crisis facing the nation. Not the tools.
 
So let's talk about Chris Mintz, shall we?

Chris Mintz, an army veteran, now here is a hero who ran towards the shooter, rather than away like human instinct teaches us to do. He was shot 3 times trying to block a door the shooter was trying to get in, and then two more times as he was laying on the ground. A nurse happened to be there as well, and as she held his hand, all Chris Mintz kept saying was that it was his son's 6th birthday.

Thankfully, Chris Mintz survived the 5 bullets and is expected to live, although he will need to learn to walk again.

Let's get off the gun talk, and talk about Chris Mintz, and the heroism he showed yesterday
 
No. He's not the Queen of England. It's his job to deal with shit, not just to go to funerals and wave in parades.

barfo
That's a cool story bro, but his true actions conflict with his message. Arming ISIS who has been responsible for thousands of innocent deaths.
 
So let's talk about Chris Mintz, shall we?

Chris Mintz, an army veteran, now here is a hero who ran towards the shooter, rather than away like human instinct teaches us to do. He was shot 3 times trying to block a door the shooter was trying to get in, and then two more times as he was laying on the ground. A nurse happened to be there as well, and as she held his hand, all Chris Mintz kept saying was that it was his son's 6th birthday.

Thankfully, Chris Mintz survived the 5 bullets and is expected to live, although he will need to learn to walk again.

Let's get off the gun talk, and talk about Chris Mintz, and the heroism he showed yesterday
Just read that story! He is a true hero! I bet he saved a lot of lives with his act of heroism.
 
It's not about banning guns. It's about making sure there are background checks. It's too easy for anyone to get a gun now and that's not safe. Did you listen to the President's speech? He was very clear. No one wants to ban guns but there are laws that can be made that will greatly reduce gun violence. And most gun owners AGREE with the President. It's the people in Congress who are out of touch.

D'oh.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/12/21/1172661/-How-to-Ban-Guns-A-step-by-step-long-term-process#

How to Ban Guns: A step by step, long term process
 
I think people who don't own guns don't understand that there already IS background checks. Hell, Oregon just passed a new law requiring that everyone has to pass background checks on private sales as well. So at this point, they have background checks in gun stores. They have background checks at gun shows. They have background checks on private sales.

Explain to me what other background checks are left to cover?
 
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I think people who own guns don't understand that there already IS background checks. Hell, Oregon just passed a new law requiring that everyone has to pass background checks on private sales as well. So at this point, they have background checks in gun stores. They have background checks at gun shows. They have background checks on private sales.

Explain to me what other background checks are left to cover?
This is what I'm saying as well. So what if a federal legislation on background and mental health checks happen and violence is still a major problem. What do we do next? More legislation after legislation and civil liberties being compromised until one day we realize no citizen can obtain guns legally. Then what?

As I've said before, illegal drugs are still being sold, even when the government spends hundreds of millions of dollars to enforce the war on drugs. The criminals will still be able to obtain guns. Look at Mexico. They have a gun ban and the only ones with guns are the cartels and other violent criminals.

Maybe instead of punishing those that obey the laws, we should find positive solutions.
 

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