Politics Should schools teach Critical Race Theory?

[barfo]

In theory that's nice, but that's not how it's playing out. Young people are tearing down statues of people like Lincoln.

So? Should statues, once erected, be eternal? Should people in the year 2525, if man is still alive, if woman can survive, visit the Lincoln Memorial?

barfo

 

[dviss1]

I'm sorry but no. I watched a great documentary on his life... It was incredible! Highly recommended.

 

[dviss1]

In theory that's nice, but that's not how it's playing out. Young people are tearing down statues of people like Lincoln.

Did you know there's a Jefferson Davis Park in Washington State?

Now why the FUCK would they name a park after that piece of shit Confederate who died before Washington (in the North) ever became a state?

Why do we erect monuments to terrorists who betrayed our government? It's bullshit. Tear them down and put them in a museum.

 

[Natebishop3]

Did you know there's a Jefferson Davis Park in Washington State?

Now why the FUCK would they name a park after that piece of shit Confederate who died before Washington (in the North) ever became a state?

Why do we erect monuments to terrorists who betrayed our government? It's bullshit. Tear them down and put them in a museum.

What does that have to do with what I posted?

 

[Chris Craig]

What does that have to do with what I posted?

He's telling you why people are tearing down statues

 

[Natebishop3]

He's telling you why people are tearing down statues

I know why people are tearing down statues. I didn't say anything about Confederate statues. I'm talking about Lincoln.

 

[Chris Craig]

I know why people are tearing down statues. I didn't say anything about Confederate statues. I'm talking about Lincoln.

And he also told you why Lincolns statue was getting torn down.

 

[Natebishop3]

And he also told you why Lincolns statue was getting torn down.

Ok? What does that have to do with him posting shit about confederate leaders?

 

[dviss1]

What does that have to do with what I posted?

Jesus man... It's Jefferson Davis Memorial park. Do you not know history?

You're up in arms about statues getting torn down and this is a park named after a Confederate leader YEARS before WA became a state...

Map of the confederate monuments that need to come down.

 

[dviss1]

I know why people are tearing down statues. I didn't say anything about Confederate statues. I'm talking about Lincoln.

You didn't read it did you....?

 

[dviss1]

I know why people are tearing down statues. I didn't say anything about Confederate statues. I'm talking about Lincoln.

You don't seem to have a clue of how HORRIBLE he was... If you don't know, your history was hidden from you so you could hold that belief about "The Great Emancipator"... Lincoln wanted us to go back to Africa... Also, Why the fuck do we think that the mysoginistic enslavers and their documents are infallible??


From Lincoln's Speech, Sept. 18, 1858.

"While I was at the hotel to-day, an elderly gentleman called upon me to know whether I was really in favor of producing a perfect equality between the negroes and white people. While I had not proposed to myself on this occasion to say much on that subject, yet as the question was asked me I thought I would occupy perhaps five minutes in saying something in regard to it. I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the black and white races -- that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making VOTERS or jurors of negroes, NOR OF QUALIFYING THEM HOLD OFFICE, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any of her man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."


Largest Mass Execution in US History: 150 Years Ago Today
Lincoln ordered the execution of thirty-eight Dakota Indians for rebellion—but never ordered the execution of Confederate officials or generals.

December 26, 1862: thirty-eight Dakota Indians were hanged in Mankato, Minnesota, in the largest mass execution in US history–on orders of President Abraham Lincoln. Their crime: killing 490 white settlers, including women and children, in the Santee Sioux uprising the previous August.

The execution took place on a giant square scaffold in the center of town, in front of an audience of hundreds of white people. The thirty-eight Dakota men “wailed and danced atop the gallows,” according to Robert K. Elder of The New York Times, “waiting for the trapdoors to drop beneath them.” A witness reported that, “as the last moment rapidly approached, they each called out their name and shouted in their native language: ‘I’m here! I’m here!’ ”

Lincoln’s treatment of defeated Indian rebels against the United States stood in sharp contrast to his treatment of Confederate rebels. He never ordered the executions of any Confederate officials or generals after the Civil War, even though they killed more than 400,000 Union soldiers. The only Confederate executed was the commander of Andersonville Prison—and for what we would call war crimes, not rebellion.
Minnesota was a new frontier state in 1862, where white settlers were pushing out the Dakota Indians—also called the Sioux. A series of broken peace treaties culminated in the failure of the United States that summer to deliver promised food and supplies to the Indians, partial payment for their giving up their lands to whites. One local trader, Andrew Myrick, said of the Indians’ plight, “If they are hungry, let them eat grass.”

The Dakota leader Little Crow then led his “enraged and starving” tribe in a series of attacks on frontier settlements. The “US-Dakota War” didn’t last long: After six weeks, Henry Hastings Sibley, first governor of Minnesota and a leader of the state militia, captured 2,000 Dakota, and a military court sentenced 303 to death.

Lincoln, however, was “never an Indian hater,” Eric Foner writes in his Pulitzer Prize–winning book The Fiery Trial: Abraham Lincoln and American Slavery. He did not agree with General John Pope, sent to put down a Sioux uprising in southern Minnesota, who said “It is my purpose utterly to exterminate the Sioux if I have the power to do so.” Lincoln “carefully reviewed the trial records,” Foner reports, and found a lack of evidence at most of the tribunals. He commuted the sentences of 265 of the Indians—a politically unpopular move. But, he said, “I could not afford to hang men for votes.”

The 265 Dakota Indians whose lives Lincoln spared were either fully pardoned or died in prison. Lincoln and Congress subsequently removed the Sioux and Winnebago—who had nothing to do with the uprising—from all of their lands in Minnesota.

Mankato today is a city of 37,000 south of Minneapolis, notable for its state university campus, which has 15,000 students. In Mankato, which has heretofore neglected its bloody past, a new historical marker is being erected at the site of the scaffold, at a place now called Reconciliation Park. The marker, a fiberglass scroll, displays the names of the thirty-eight Dakota who were executed.

The Minnesota History Center in St. Paul is currently featuring an exhibit titled “Minnesota Tragedy: The U.S.-Dakota War of 1862.” “You can’t turn your head from what is not pretty in history,” said Stephen Elliott, who became the director of the Minnesota Historical Society last May after twenty-eight years at Colonial Williamsburg. He told the Minneapolis Star Tribune, “Whatever we do, it’s not going to somehow heal things or settle it.” The impressive state-of-the-art exhibit includes the views of both white settlers and Indians, voices from the past as well as the present. “Visitors are encouraged to make up their own minds about what happened and why,” the official guide declares. The website and online video are particularly impressive.

 

[Natebishop3]

You didn't read it did you....?

Did he do bad shit? I'm sure he did. There's not a single President in the history of this country who didn't do some bad shit. Not one.

Would this country still be 50 states without Lincoln? Would slavery in the south have extended for decades longer without him?

 

[Chris Craig]

Jesus man... It's Jefferson Davis Memorial park. Do you not know history?

You're up in arms about statues getting torn down and this is a park named after a Confederate leader YEARS before WA became a state...

Map of the confederate monuments that need to come down.

Damn!

Can't even see the south

Surprised there are so many west of Texas and in the North. South Dakota doesn't surprise me.

Oregon? I guess it's in the conservative part of the state so that makes some sense.

 

[Natebishop3]

Ok? This doesn't explain why you felt the need to tell me about some confederates. I didn't say anything about confederates.

It's like I'm saying that I don't understand why some people don't like Coke and you're telling me Pepsi is shit. I didn't say anything about Pepsi.

 

[dviss1]

Did he do bad shit? I'm sure he did. There's not a single President in the history of this country who didn't do some bad shit. Not one.

Would this country still be 50 states without Lincoln? Would slavery in the south have extended for decades longer without him?

THIS PLACE SHOULDN'T BE A COUNTRY. WE LIVE ON TURLE ISLAND! JESUS THESE FUCKING COLONIZERS ARE KILLING ME...

From Lincoln's Speech, Sept. 18, 1858.

"While I was at the hotel to-day, an elderly gentleman called upon me to know whether I was really in favor of producing a perfect equality between the negroes and white people. While I had not proposed to myself on this occasion to say much on that subject, yet as the question was asked me I thought I would occupy perhaps five minutes in saying something in regard to it. I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the black and white races -- that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making VOTERS or jurors of negroes, NOR OF QUALIFYING THEM HOLD OFFICE, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any of her man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."

 

[dviss1]

Ok? This doesn't explain why you felt the need to tell me about some confederates. I didn't say anything about confederates.

It's like I'm saying that I don't understand why some people don't like Coke and you're telling me Pepsi is shit. I didn't say anything about Pepsi.

You always deflect. You completely glossed over my Lincoln post and started bitching about confederates.

 

[Natebishop3]

Jesus man... It's Jefferson Davis Memorial park. Do you not know history?

You're up in arms about statues getting torn down and this is a park named after a Confederate leader YEARS before WA became a state...

Map of the confederate monuments that need to come down.

What the fuck? I'm up in arms about statues being torn down? Get the fuck outta here. I talked about ONE statue and it was about Lincoln. Stop putting words in my mouth.

 

[Natebishop3]

You always deflect. You completely glossed over my Lincoln post and started bitching about confederates.

I didn't bitch about confederates. I bitched about you. What the fuck am I deflecting? You're bringing up shit that I never talked about.

 

[dviss1]

What the fuck? I'm up in arms about statues being torn down? Get the fuck outta here. I talked about ONE statue and it was about Lincoln. Stop putting words in my mouth.

This is what you do, deflect, deflect deflect are you gonna read the Lincoln post or what?

 

[Natebishop3]

This is what you do, deflect, deflect deflect are you gonna read the Lincoln post or what?

You didn't answer my question. Would there have been slavery for decades more if not for Lincoln?

 

[dviss1]

You didn't answer my question. Would there have been slavery for decades more if not for Lincoln?

I did answer it. I said there shouldn't have been slavery in the first place. These colonizers came here and stole this place. Killed 80-100MM indigenous but you say dumb shit like "no one is indigenous"...

I'm done bro. I'm just done...

 

[Natebishop3]

I did answer it. I said there shouldn't have been slavery in the first place. These colonizers came here and stole this place. Killed 80-100MM indigenous but you say dumb shit like "no one is indigenous"...

I'm done bro. I'm just done...

That's not a fucking answer. They did come here. There was slavery. Lincoln was President. You didn't answer the question. If anyone is deflecting it's you.

 

[Phatguysrule]

I did answer it. I said there shouldn't have been slavery in the first place. These colonizers came here and stole this place. Killed 80-100MM indigenous but you say dumb shit like "no one is indigenous"...

I'm done bro. I'm just done...

However, there was slavery here before Europeans ever got here...among those 80-100 million natives.

 

[dviss1]

However, there was slavery here before Europeans ever got here...among those 80-100 million natives.

JUST STOP. PLEASE STOP....

I absolutely hate it when white people do this shit. You don't know what was going on here before they came. Are we truly going to accept the colonizer's story of what Indigenous folk were doing before they arrived?? This is a deflection from owning what white people did.

And fix that, there were WAY more than 80-100 million Indigenous folks here. That was how many white people killed.

Also, I hope you don't still subscribe to the made up narrative that all black people were brought in chains (NO there were African pre-Columbian explorers).

Or that our ancestors had slavery in Africa and sold us to whites.

This is all bullshit. Complete bullshit. All used to deflect against what white people did. And you know what? It's shameful.

WE ALL have access to the same ability to search for this info instead of swallowing colonizer speak...

 

[Natebishop3]

I absolutely hate it when white people do this shit.

White people don't exist.

 

[Phatguysrule]

JUST STOP. PLEASE STOP....

I absolutely hate it when white people do this shit. You don't know what was going on here before they came. Are we truly going to accept the colonizer's story of what Indigenous folk were doing before they arrived?? This is a deflection from owning what white people did.

And fix that, there were WAY more than 80-100 million Indigenous folks here. That was how many white people killed.

Also, I hope you don't still subscribe to the made up narrative that all black people were brought in chains (NO there were African pre-Columbian explorers).

Or that our ancestors had slavery in Africa and sold us to whites.

This is all bullshit. Complete bullshit. All used to deflect against what white people did. And you know what? It's shameful.

WE ALL have access to the same ability to search for this info instead of swallowing colonizer speak...

There was slavery at some point everywhere there have been competing tribes.

The odds that there was no slavery among the thousands of different tribes in pre-colonial North America are about as close to zero as you can get.

Slavery was how things got done before industrialization. It's shitty. But it's a fact.

Hell there is still slavery in Africa (and other places) today.

Claiming that there was none in the past is just fantasy.

 

[Natebishop3]

Or that our ancestors had slavery in Africa and sold us to whites.

LOL what continent is Egypt in? Are you seriously going to claim that there wasn't slavery in Africa before white people arrived down there?

 

[Natebishop3]

There was slavery at some point everywhere there have been competing tribes.

The odds that there was no slavery among the thousands of different tribes in pre-colonial North America are about as close to zero as you can get.

Slavery was how things got done before industrialization. It's shitty. But it's a fact.

Hell there is still slavery in Africa (and other places) today.

Claiming that there was none in the past is just fantasy.

He will now cite to you a bunch of shit that has nothing to do with what you said.

 

[Lanny]

Yes but I'm not really old.

Oh yeah, let me be your scapegoat just because I'm a few decades older than you.

 

[Lanny]

This is just ridiculous.
Who would say no to teaching history? Isn't that what history classes are supposed to do?