Simons is a nightmare

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THE HCP said:
Go back and read all the posts about getting rid of him and letting Shae and Scoot just takeover. Comical. Ant is only 24 and most on here knew he’d be our best player and leading scorer. Very PRO-Ant here FAMS.
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Ant is solid. I doubt he ever starts all season for a 2nd round playoff team, though.

Unless he really picks up the D. Which could happen. But after like 6 seasons in the league... I wouldn't bet on it.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Ant is solid. I doubt he ever starts all season for a 2nd round playoff team, though.

Unless he really picks up the D. Which could happen. But after like 6 seasons in the league... I wouldn't bet on it.
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You are calling him a 6 year vet? He’s only played 300 games…..kid is a cold stoned killer out there.
 
THE HCP said:
You are calling him a 6 year vet? He’s only played 300 games…..kid is a cold stoned killer out there.
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I've just never seen somebody go from one of the worst defenders in the league their first 6 seasons to a reliable defender after that. I don't think I've ever seen a very bad defender become a decent defender after the age of 24. Has it ever happened?

Again, I'd love to be proven wrong, I just wouldn't expect that to happen. He'll likely always be a negative at the defensive end.
 
Sooo, offensive assassins' who are defensive liabilities don't exist on successful teams?
 
Phatguysrule said:
I've just never seen somebody go from one of the worst defenders in the league their first 6 seasons to a reliable defender after that. I don't think I've ever seen a very bad defender become a decent defender after the age of 24. Has it ever happened?

Again, I'd love to be proven wrong, I just wouldn't expect that to happen. He'll likely always be a negative at the defensive end.
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First person that comes to mind is Wiggins. That guy was an awful defender.
 
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BassPlaya said:
Sooo, offensive assassins' who are defensive liabilities don't exist on successful teams?
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You don't want your "best player" to be a one-way player. Never.

Jokic may be the best passing big man ever. Steph may be the best shooter ever. So there are cases where you can get around your best player not being a great defender, but that best player has to be an all-time great on offense.

But it's even simpler than that. To win a championship, you need an all-time great player. MVP-level. A two-way player being preferred.
 
blazerfan11 said:
You don't want your "best player" to be a one-way player. Never.

Jokic may be the best passing big man ever. Steph may be the best shooter ever. So there are cases where you can get around your best player not being a great defender, but that best player has to be an all-time great on offense.

But it's even simpler than that. To win a championship, you need an all-time great player. MVP-level. A two-way player being preferred.
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And even then...

Steph has been a league leader in steals (I believe multiple times). He has the GSW record for steals.

And Jokic is a great rebounder. Which is every bit as good as defense.

Ant doesn't bring anything like that.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Isn't he still pretty terrible at defense though?
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I don't watch a lot of their games, but I recall him being discussed as the finals MVP, partially because of the defense he played in that series.

It appears the Warriors prefer to start him on the opponents best wing to start games.
 
Wiggins was a very good defender for a couple of years there, but has really fallen all around since his return from absence
 
Okay. Let's take the Wiggins example.

So maybe after being rejected by the team that drafted him Simons will make his way to a title contending team that requires him to play tough D to get on the floor, and he'll manage it for a season or two.

This is not something I see helping Portland, where he'll be entrenched as the leading scorer and likely ball handler who makes his most talented teammates less effective when he's on the floor with them...

He's talented, for sure. I don't think anybody questions that. But something's gotta give.
 
Simons, somewhat like like Wiggins, has the tools to be a better defender (dame never did, for example). If he ever gets there I don't know, he seems to try a bit more this year, so that is something.

Fwiw, Wiggins had more tools to be a good defender than Simons, all I am saying is that Simons has a chance to get better, sometimes I never thought Dame could.
 
blazerfan11 said:
You don't want your "best player" to be a one-way player. Never.

Jokic may be the best passing big man ever. Steph may be the best shooter ever. So there are cases where you can get around your best player not being a great defender, but that best player has to be an all-time great on offense.

But it's even simpler than that. To win a championship, you need an all-time great player. MVP-level. A two-way player being preferred.
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I never said anything about a defensively limited player being the best player on a team. I asked if defensively limited players exist on high level teams. one person said not as a starter, and I disagree. I never talked about Jokic, or Steph. Folks ragging on moving Anfernee....who is the Blazers most deadly AND clutch scorer late in games, because he is defensively limited.....is like smashing one's self in the nose to spite one's face.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
Okay. Let's take the Wiggins example.

So maybe after being rejected by the team that drafted him Simons will make his way to a title contending team that requires him to play tough D to get on the floor, and he'll manage it for a season or two.

This is not something I see helping Portland, where he'll be entrenched as the leading scorer and likely ball handler who makes his most talented teammates less effective when he's on the floor with them...

He's talented, for sure. I don't think anybody questions that. But something's gotta give.
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Ant is one of the main reasons Ayton has been playing better recently. Ant’s on-ball gravity has opened up the floor for Ayton and Ant has been actively looking for Ayton.
 
OneSport3 said:
Ant is one of the main reasons Ayton has been playing better recently. Ant’s on-ball gravity has opened up the floor for Ayton and Ant has been actively looking for Ayton.
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Good point. I was more referring to Sharpe and Scoot.
 
PCmor7 said:
Who's CHP?
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ponch-chips.gif
 
Phatguysrule said:
I've just never seen somebody go from one of the worst defenders in the league their first 6 seasons to a reliable defender after that. I don't think I've ever seen a very bad defender become a decent defender after the age of 24. Has it ever happened?

Again, I'd love to be proven wrong, I just wouldn't expect that to happen. He'll likely always be a negative at the defensive end.
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I gave up on him being a quality defender just like I did Dame after year 2…..who cares. This dude is an assassin on the offensive end. You find me some players that put up his numbers AND are dominant on the defensive end. Far and few between. I got Matisse back there flying around covering for him.
 
THE HCP said:
I gave up on him being a quality defender just like I did Dame after year 2…..who cares. This dude is an assassin on the offensive end. You find me some players that put up his numbers AND are dominant on the defensive end. Far and few between. I got Matisse back there flying around covering for him.
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That's fine. You just won't find many of those guys leading teams to championships.

I don't have anything against him personally. I just don't think he'll be a pillar to a championship team.

And the fact that he's already here and not going to be interested in coming off the bench means he's probably more likely to wind up as an obstacle to becoming that level of team.
 
I don’t really have numbers to back this up but from what I have seen he has improved quite a bit over the last 2-3 years defensively. No not a great defender but much better and is figuring out the things he can do to help on defense.
I guess you could say he has improved with experience.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That's fine. You just won't find many of those guys leading teams to championships.

I don't have anything against him personally. I just don't think he'll be a pillar to a championship team.

And the fact that he's already here and not going to be interested in coming off the bench means he's probably more likely to wind up as an obstacle to becoming that level of team.
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So who HAS been dominate on BOTH ends and led their team to a championship?
 
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