Students sent home over American flag clothing

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BrianFromWA said:
How about not having an environment where a "big fight" could happen? That's up to the principal. WHy the eff would a "big fight" occur based on clothes someone's wearing? We don't think that the hispanic kids can control themselves? Or that the part-hispanic kids are going to throw the first punches? What? I wanna hear this.
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As someone who went to a high school where it really was literally about 50-50 hispanic/not hispanic... There was tension a whole lot of time out of the year. You had the idiot red-necks with "Beaner, Wetback, Sand-N*gger, (not directed at hispanics obviously) and you had idiot wanna be cholo's with their stupid "Cracker, whitey" comments. Mix together that stupidity, along with the immaturity of 14-19 year old kids, there is a lot of chances for tnesion and fights.. especially if someone is (allegedly) doing something to get someone's ire. and even especially moreso when added to immaturity. I wouldnt necassarily put that on the princeiple. Unless people are expecitng segregated schools, (not saying you are) or expecting Principles to all the sudden transform teenagers into mature adults. (again not saying you are)
 
it's_GO_time said:
So is wearing gang colors OK?

No policy against red or blue right
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We don't have any gangs where I live, so I don't know. But in theory, a boy or girl could wear all red or blue if they wanted. Before they built a new high school for our community, my daughter had to go to a school in an "under developed" neighborhood, or shit hole if you will. I know that school had a policy that you were not allowed to were gang colors, but only the grade schools have the uniform things where we are, so the older kids can wear what they want.
 
Well, I'd be pissed off as all hell if a bunch of Mexicans ran around with Mexican flag clothing on the 4th of July. It's their right to do so (if they're legal), but it would certainly anger me. The intent is obvious in both scenarios, IMO. It could certainly incite violence.
 
Mediocre Man said:
Just my anger, no link. I am sure none of the kids that go to the school were born to illegals. Especially in San Jose.
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ok.. A lame thing to say in anger, but thanks to clarifying whether you read that somewhere. I was confused.
 
The Professional Fan said:
Well, I'd be pissed off as all hell if a bunch of Mexicans ran around with Mexican flag clothing on the 4th of July. It's their right to do so (if they're legal), but it would certainly anger me. The intent is obvious in both scenarios, IMO. It could certainly incite violence.
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good point, hadnt thought of it that way.


but remember if they were HALF MEXICAN and HALF WHITE, then it would be ok and not to incite violence ;)
 
The Professional Fan said:
Well, I'd be pissed off as all hell if a bunch of Mexicans ran around with Mexican flag clothing on the 4th of July. It's their right to do so (if they're legal), but it would certainly anger me. The intent is obvious in both scenarios, IMO. It could certainly incite violence.
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And if these kids were running around Mexico City wearing American flags, that might be comparable. However, this was (technically) on American soil. Further, there's no indication in either article that the students were being demonstrative--they were wearing t-shirts. Plus, nobody requires any Mexican-American to celebrate or even acknowledge July 4th--why should these kids be forced to alter their behavior and/or attire as a result of a holiday that is irrelevant to them?
 
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Mediocre Man said:
We don't have any gangs where I live, so I don't know. But in theory, a boy or girl could wear all red or blue if they wanted. Before they built a new high school for our community, my daughter had to go to a school in an "under developed" neighborhood, or shit hole if you will. I know that school had a policy that you were not allowed to were gang colors, but only the grade schools have the uniform things where we are, so the older kids can wear what they want.
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I think it comes down of the opinion that I don't think kids at school should get same protected rights adults have. If I had a child going to a school, I would want to have trust in the principal and adminstration and then let them do their job without the bullshit of politics weighing ontheir decision. If a principal sees something he/she doesn't like . . . let them get it the hell out. Gang colors, skimpy clothes, clothes that cause tension and anger messages on clothes . . . . .. . . not on this campus type of mentality.

In the end I must be advocating for private school (which would put up with none of that) . . . but generally I am pro public schools.
 
The Professional Fan said:
Well, I'd be pissed off as all hell if a bunch of Mexicans ran around with Mexican flag clothing on the 4th of July. It's their right to do so (if they're legal), but it would certainly anger me. The intent is obvious in both scenarios, IMO. It could certainly incite violence.
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I'd be pissed if they ran around in the Mexican flag on July 4th here, in AMERICA, but what rite would I have to bitch if I were in Mexico and they all wore the Mexican flag over them on July 4th?


THIS IS AMERICA. Above all else, if you live here you should support it. If not, get the fuck out.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
And if these kids were running around Mexico City wearing American flags, that might be comparable. However, this was (technically) on American soil.
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What does it matter what soil they are on? How do we know these kids werent citizens? (the ones doing and the ones being pissed off)
 
PtldPlatypus said:
And if these kids were running around Mexico City wearing American flags, that might be comparable. However, this was (technically) on American soil.
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Yes, I understand, but it's clear the intent would be the same either way. We shouldn't over think this. These kids wore american flags on cinco de mayo, in San Jose no less. The intent was to rile shit up.
 
Wheels said:
What does it matter what soil they are on? How do we know these kids werent citizens? (the ones doing and the ones being pissed off)
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Sure it matters. If I were "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday in Mexico, it would be completely different then "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday while in America. Setting is completely relevant.

Similarly, would any student be not permitted to wear American Flags on Bastille Day? Would that be disrespectful? In Paris, it probably would be, maybe even in Montreal. But in any city in America, no.
 
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PtldPlatypus said:
Sure it matters. If I were "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday in Mexico, it would be completely different then "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday while in America. Am I not permitted to wear American Flags on Bastille Day?
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gotcha. Just trying to understand the thinking process :cheers:
 
The Professional Fan said:
Yes, I understand, but it's clear the intent would be the same either way. We shouldn't over think this. These kids wore american flags on cinco de mayo, in San Jose no less. The intent was to rile shit up.
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Exactly. And the school put a stop to it on that day . . . good for the school.

I think it sucks that when schools make these decisions it turns into politcal discussions. It would be a shame if schools made decisons based on politics or even let it factor in.

On it's face, it seems like an easy call . . . but then we got throw in rights and being patriot and shit like that. It was a decision so a fight wouldn't break out . . . nothing more.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Sure it matters. If I were "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday in Mexico, it would be completely different then "disrespecting" a Mexican holiday while in America. Am I not permitted to mock French people on Bastille Day?
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You likely can, and are protected in doing so. But mocking them with, I dunno what, and doing it, seemingly, with tyhe intent to rile up and anger french individuals, in a school wouldn't fly, IMO. I think the intent seems rather obvious, and in a school setting, shouldn't be tolerated. Is it perfectly fine, in a school that's say half black half white, during Black History Month if a bunch of white kids wore shirts with confederate flags on them. You know, just to show their support of the south. Should the black kids be removed from school if they were upset with that?
 
Seems like a great teaching opportunity. Sure you can be offended/upset/whatever...but throw a punch and go to jail. That's the American way. What did Michael Douglas say in the American President?
America isn't easy. America is advanced citizenship. You gotta want it bad, 'cause it's gonna put up a fight. It's gonna say "You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who's standing center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours. You want to claim this land as the land of the free? Then the symbol of your country can't just be a flag; the symbol also has to be one of its citizens exercising his right to burn that flag in protest. Show me that, defend that, celebrate that in your classrooms. Then, you can stand up and sing about the "land of the free"
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RR7 said:
Is it perfectly fine, in a school that's say half black half white, during Black History Month if a bunch of white kids wore shirts with confederate flags on them. You know, just to show their support of the south. Should the black kids be removed from school if they were upset with that?
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The confederate flag is, inherently, equated with anti-black racism.

The American flag is not inherently anti-Mexican. In fact, the American flag is representative of everything that the Mexican kids' parents/grandparents/etc. chose to leave Mexico in order to partake in. Acting as though the wearing of the American flag is disrespectful to Mexican-Americans is hypocritical.
 
RR7 said:
You likely can, and are protected in doing so. But mocking them with, I dunno what, and doing it, seemingly, with tyhe intent to rile up and anger french individuals, in a school wouldn't fly, IMO. I think the intent seems rather obvious, and in a school setting, shouldn't be tolerated. Is it perfectly fine, in a school that's say half black half white, during Black History Month if a bunch of white kids wore shirts with confederate flags on them. You know, just to show their support of the south. Should the black kids be removed from school if they were upset with that?
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I always forget. In what month do we celebrate white history?
 
I'm on the side that thinks this is ridiculous.

If all that kid did (even if he did it to piss off the Hispanics) was wear an American flag shirt, he should not be sent home... not in America.

It is completely different when talking about the 4th of July, because, well, this is America. We should be allowed to wear the flag (or anything), anytime, anywhere. If a Mexican wore a Mexican flag on the 4th, it is their right, but people should be upset because they are in AMERICA, on an AMERICAN PATRIOTIC holiday. If they were in Canada, and wore the Mexican flag on the 4th, then I wouldn't care at all. :)

I just don't think that example is all that relevant to the discussion.
 
MrJayremmie said:
I'm on the side that thinks this is ridiculous.

If all that kid did (even if he did it to piss off the Hispanics) was wear an American flag shirt, he should not be sent home... not in America.

It is completely different when talking about the 4th of July, because, well, this is America. We should be allowed to wear the flag (or anything), anytime, anywhere. If a Mexican wore a Mexican flag on the 4th, it is their right, but people should be upset because they are in AMERICA, on an AMERICAN PATRIOTIC holiday. If they were in Canada, and wore the Mexican flag on the 4th, then I wouldn't care at all. :)

I just don't think that example applies.
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But why should people get upset on the 4th? As you said, it's AMERICA. They have the freedom to wear a Mexican flag if they want, on the 4th. Or burn the flag, if they want, on the 4th.
 
Mediocre Man said:
I'd be pissed if they ran around in the Mexican flag on July 4th here, in AMERICA, but what rite would I have to bitch if I were in Mexico and they all wore the Mexican flag over them on July 4th?


THIS IS AMERICA. Above all else, if you live here you should support it. If not, get the fuck out.
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EXACTLY.

If this was done in a foreign country where they're celebrating a holiday of theirs, then yeah of course I'd say suspend, them, etc. But it happened in America, where you should be able to wear an american flag t-shirt 365 days out of 365.

Should be able is the key word I guess, because it seems things have changed, where to be American is now a crime, and to be a minority you're looked upon as a hero.
 
RR7 said:
But why should people get upset on the 4th? As you said, it's AMERICA. They have the freedom to wear a Mexican flag if they want, on the 4th. Or burn the flag, if they want, on the 4th.
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With this, I agree completely. I wouldn't be upset if I saw a Mexican flag on the 4th. Or a French one. Or Chinese, or Russian, or any other country. Ethnic diversity is part of what makes America what it is.

I have no problem with the school celebrating Cinco de Mayo, because it highlights diversity. I DO have a problem with any institution acting as though pride in America should be squelched to avoid "offending" someone.
 
Mediocre Man said:
I always forget. In what month do we celebrate white history?
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I'm curious, what activities or accomplishments by white people do you think are going under-reported or not acknowledged at all that a white history month would help draw the public's attention to?
 
SlyPokerDog said:
I'm curious, what activities or accomplishments by white people do you think are going under-reported or not acknowledged at all that a white history month would help draw the public's attention to?
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I would say the exact same number as in black history month. Commercials for teachers and congressmen? I think it's absolutely awesome that the people that achieved such great things did so under such repression. I just don't know why we need a month dedicated to it?
 
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