OT Taxing churches

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crandc said:
Yes. We taxpayers are subsidizing religion to the tune of billions of dollars annually. And many openly engage in political activity. Let them fund themselves.
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I dont subsidize religion, but I sure as hell do professional politicians with my tax dollars.
 
I view the Church of Maxine Watters & Mitch McConnell the same.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
How are taxpayers subsidizing religion?
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Because religious institutions own billions in property for which they pay no tax. Which means the rest of us have to make up the difference. I would add they get police and fire protection, street cleaning and other public benefits they don't pay for.
 
crandc said:
Because religious institutions own billions in property for which they pay no tax. Which means the rest of us have to make up the difference. I would add they get police and fire protection, street cleaning and other public benefits they don't pay for.
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Also, they tax their congregations and that money is then not spent on the economy. It's basically flushed down the toilet. Imagine how much money is donated to churches every year that could be put back into the economy.

Not sure how accurate this website is, but they claim $50 billion a year.
https://nonprofitssource.com/online-giving-statistics/church-giving/
 
Natebishop3 said:
Also, they tax their congregations and that money is then not spent on the economy. It's basically flushed down the toilet. Imagine how much money is donated to churches every year that could be put back into the economy.

Not sure how accurate this website is, but they claim $50 billion a year.
https://nonprofitssource.com/online-giving-statistics/church-giving/
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I know at one point, my parents gave 10% of their income to their church.

That's money that should have gone into their (non existent) retirement, or to help their kids with clothing, food, or preparing for college.

Being an atheist/agnostic is kinda like a tax break on its own, I guess.
 
Fairly-Hard said:
The very second they abuse their tax exempt status they need it revoked.
That means no politics......
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That's what DeSantis said about Disney.
 
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ABM said:
At a risk of TMI, Chris Botti is love-making music for my wife and I. When the mood arises (pun intended), it's "Alexa, play Chris Botti music!"
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Sounds like some kind of sex cult



:bgrin:
 
riverman said:
I think it's quite a difference given the political clout and enormous wealth that is generated by televangelists and fundamentalist lobbyists...organized religion....our money says In God We Trust...not In Science Do We Trust......I don't dislike religion in general...I dislike greed and a lack of separation between church and state....I don't have that problem with science and state or the Elks club and state...atheists aren't telling people not to have babies or giving donations to that cause. Religion should be personal and private but not dictating our laws or policies in general.
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My church separates religion from politics. We are there to cleanse the soul not tell people how to vote. Secular things are excluded.
 
Lanny said:
My church separates religion from politics. We are there to cleanse the soul not tell people how to vote. Secular things are excluded.
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As it should be. Unfortunately that's not the trend in the political landscape with the attempts to strip away civil rights in favor of religious beliefs. Roe vs Wade
 
A little off-topic but is God sending/guiding the 3 wise men to Jesus his way of paying child support?
 
theprunetang said:
Ahhhh. It all makes sense now. I have been wondering why you played Chris Botti at your place when I hung out with yall in Panama City. I'm feeling fortunate that the wings were the only spicy thing in the house.
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LOL

Just snagged CB tix for November. Should be fantastic at the Schermerhorn with the Nashville Symphony.....



Oh, and as mentioned in another thread, Chris has Portland/Oregon roots:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Botti

Botti was born in Portland, Oregon and raised in Corvallis, although he also spent two years of his childhood in Italy.[4] His earliest musical influence was his mother, a classically trained pianist and part-time piano teacher.[5] He started playing the trumpet at nine years old, and committed to the instrument at age 12 when he heard Miles Davis play "My Funny Valentine".[6]

In 1981, he was selected as a member of McDonald's All American High School Jazz band, which marked his first Carnegie Hall performance.[7] At the age of 17, he ended up at Mount Hood Community College in Gresham, Oregon, by convincing his high school to allow him to fulfill his remaining senior year credits there. Chris set his class schedule so that he could also play at Portland clubs in the evening. Mount Hood's program was headed by Larry McVey, whose band had come to be a proving ground and regular stop for Stan Kenton and Mel Tormé when they were looking for new players. It was here Botti played alongside his friend, trombonist and future Academy Award nominated filmmaker, Todd Field.

After graduating from Crescent Valley High School, Chris studied under jazz educator David Baker and trumpet professor Bill Adam at the Indiana University School of Music.[8] Botti was also the recipient of two grants from the National Endowment for the Arts which allowed him to study with trumpeter Woody Shaw and saxophonist George Coleman during two consecutive summer breaks.
 
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Churches should be taxed if they make over a certain amount of money, especially super churches and religious institutions that own billions in property.
 
Jesus didn't need a church or money and whatever he had was shared with all..he could turn water into wine though so that's a plus if you believe in Christian mythology
 
I read zero previous comments to keep my blood pressure in check.

Churches should be taxed. Of course. Otherwise, they become monsters like the Catholic Church, the Church of Scientology, the Mormon Church, the Evangelicals, and so forth, hoarding riches, buying properties, buying lawyers, hiding misdeeds, etc., or in other words: they become corrupt.

Really the tax exempt status is just another way for churches to obfuscate finances. EVERYONE should get tax breaks for things, for charity based ACTIONS for example, for money donated to charities with full transparency, etc. That creates community: we are all in this together. The way it is now there is just a bunch of factions operating in the dark.

This country is just petrified of offending religious people. The bar is Dark Ages low right now.
 
The validity of “religious following” in regards to the profitable church should have to do with their taxation.

A lot of churches are somewhat integral parts of the community. Doing sincere and legitimate good for others which may otherwise be neglected by the majority of society.

It’s kind of like a job if the church is legit. And if they are putting in sincere work then they should be able to show how they spend their funds to prove that there is no financial corruption and therefore be free to do what they need to do in order to fund their organization.

Some institutions are just for profit, and corrupt in regards to what they would say their goals and desires are. There was one here in the Portland Metro area called the “Living Enrichment Center”, or LEC. The founders actually got arrested and charged for financial crimes.
 
Propagandist said:
I read zero previous comments to keep my blood pressure in check.

Churches should be taxed. Of course. Otherwise, they become monsters like the Catholic Church, the Church of Scientology, the Mormon Church, the Evangelicals, and so forth, hoarding riches, buying properties, buying lawyers, hiding misdeeds, etc., or in other words: they become corrupt.

Really the tax exempt status is just another way for churches to obfuscate finances. EVERYONE should get tax breaks for things, for charity based ACTIONS for example, for money donated to charities with full transparency, etc. That creates community: we are all in this together. The way it is now there is just a bunch of factions operating in the dark.

This country is just petrified of offending religious people. The bar is Dark Ages low right now.
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The crusades part deux?...and it's not like churches are truly "non-profit"...they have amassed a truckload of property. The Catholic church alone owns an estimated 175,000,000 acres.
 
yankeesince59 said:
The crusades part deux?...and it's not like churches are truly "non-profit"...they have amassed a truckload of property. The Catholic church alone owns an estimated 175,000,000 acres.
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Ive always supported a flat type of tax across the board with no tax exemptions for churches and bogus non profits out there.
 
riverman said:
Jesus didn't need a church or money and whatever he had was shared with all..he could turn water into wine though so that's a plus if you believe in Christian mythology
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Not a believer...but I do however, believe in wine. "In vino veritas."



 
barfo said:
I don't see any reason why they shouldn't be taxed. One could argue that yoga studios have just as much reason to be tax-free.

barfo
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If the Yoga studio is a non profit 501c3 then it doesn't pay taxes.

Churches should be the same - if there are no owners cashing in profits and the Church's funds are used to further their mission it should be tax exempt.

If owners are getting cash, or other stakeholders pocketing excessive expenditures to themselves personally it should be taxed. If they go further it should possibly even be prosecuted. That should apply regardless if its a church or another charity.
 
yankeesince59 said:
The crusades part deux?...and it's not like churches are truly "non-profit"...they have amassed a truckload of property. The Catholic church alone owns an estimated 175,000,000 acres.
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I guess it depends if we are talking income or property taxes.

Property tax I can see a stronger argument to impose taxes on church's and other non-profits. I'm not sure most of them get a lot of property tax relief there anyways.

For income tax if all the income from the 175 million acres are used in accordance with their missions I don't see a problem with it.

Perhaps some would like a limit on the tax exempt status - after x millions or billions of revenue they pay ~10% tax or something. There might be some good arguments for this but I feel like it would need to be applied equally to all non profits and I'm not sure that is a good change overall.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
I guess it depends if we are talking income or property taxes.

Property tax I can see a stronger argument to impose taxes on church's and other non-profits. I'm not sure most of them get a lot of property tax relief there anyways.

For income tax if all the income from the 175 million acres are used in accordance with their missions I don't see a problem with it.

Perhaps some would like a limit on the tax exempt status - after x millions or billions of revenue they pay ~10% tax or something. There might be some good arguments for this but I feel like it would need to be applied equally to all non profits and I'm not sure that is a good change overall.
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I don't think that would be acceptable...and churches are not "non-profit", where do you think all the property comes from?

As far as the "10%" suggestion, well, I'll gladly pay 10% as opposed to what I'm forced to pay now.

...churches and corporations are flush with cash, which in turn will surely hire the best tax attorneys...no, I believe big business and all churches of all religions should pay just like the rest of us...the poor are not really taxed and neither are corporations in relation to the middle class, who take it up the wazoo.

who-pays-taxes-chart-1_0.jpg
 
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