Trail Blazers gear up for legislative ask that would ‘guarantee’ team’s future in Portland (2 Viewers)

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wizenheimer said:
bullshit

my brother lived in Klamath Falls; my wife's nephew lives in Ashland. I have a good friend who lives in Port Orford (you can find him on Facebook and google under Scrimshander); and another who lives in Lakeview. A guy I went to the UofO with lives in LaGrande and his son lives in Pendelton. My parents lived in Sweet Home. A guy I worked with for years and who was a scolarship gymnast at the UofO lives in Falls City. These people are not hillbillies and I seriously doubt any of them want their tax dollars to be spent on the Blazers. You're acting like a snob
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Look at the states that don't have top 3 sports teams. They are probably higher on the hillbilly rankings than most which do.

I'm sorry if I've offended you. I didn't realize hillbilly was such a loaded slur.
 
Gov Dudley and a sales tax might possibly work.
 
wizenheimer said:
bullshit

my brother lived in Klamath Falls; my wife's nephew lives in Ashland. I have a good friend who lives in Port Orford (you can find him on Facebook and google under Scrimshander); and another who lives in Lakeview. A guy I went to the UofO with lives in LaGrande and his son lives in Pendelton. My parents lived in Sweet Home. A guy I worked with for years and who was a scolarship gymnast at the UofO lives in Falls City. These people are not hillbillies and I seriously doubt any of them want their tax dollars to be spent on the Blazers. You're acting like a snob
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Uno reverso on your bullshit

I have lived in Klamath Falls, and my grandparents lived in Lakeview. My second cousin is from Burns. I learned all the dead n****r jokes I know (against my will) in Klamath Falls, and my grandma’s neighbors’ kids used have family fun times in the treehouse. Fucking hillbilly country. Fucking family reunions where the conversation was mostly about how cheaply you could sniper Obama. I’m glad your friends and family are all civilized but mine sure weren’t.
 
Everything Beagle said:
Uno reverso on your bullshit

I have lived in Klamath Falls, and my grandparents lived in Lakeview. My second cousin is from Burns. I learned all the dead n****r jokes I know (against my will) in Klamath Falls, and my grandma’s neighbors’ kids used have family fun times in the treehouse. Fucking hillbilly country. Fucking family reunions where the conversation was mostly about how cheaply you could sniper Obama. I’m glad your friends and family are all civilized but mine sure weren’t.
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I must not go out that much around here or keep better company because Walmart is the only super rednecky place where I have seen people like that out in the wild unless I go out of town to like Bonanza or Merrill
 
So more people watch the us pro soccer league finals than the World Series?
 
I don't think it really matters what makes sense to us. It doesn't matter if the Moda Center needs a remodel or not. A group just spent over 4 billion dollars to buy our team and they have framed this like they wanted a new arena but will compromise with a 600 million dollar renovation.

The local and state politicians have said they'll do what it takes to keep the team here. There has been reporting this week that both on the local level and state level they have enough votes/backing to make the 600 million dollar plan go through.

There might be a tweak here or there but the people that just invested several billion dollars and by the end of next month will own a major cultural and economic touchstone in our area will very very likely get their way.

I don't think it's great that our society works this way but it will almost certainly result in the Blazers staying here which is something I do like. Sometimes you have to take the things you like out of the systems you don't like.
 
Everything Beagle said:
Soccer is more popular than the MLB in the US as of a couple years ago so technically we do have a big three sport even if we lose the NBA.
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Soccer as a sport might be popular, it's easier to play. But the MLS as a league is not more popular, valuable or monetarily more solid than MLB.

Popularity as a sport and leagues are two massively different things.

The average value of an MLS team is under a billion, with only like 5 teams being worth that.

The average value of an MLB team is 2.5 billion with zero teams worth less than 1 billion. Hell, the least valuable dumpster fire of a franchise in MLB is almost worth as much as the most valuable MLS team.

The NHL is even significantly more valuable than MLS.

Losing the Blazers and saying the Timbers keeps them among the "big three" is laughably wrong.
 
julius said:
Soccer as a sport might be popular, it's easier to play. But the MLS as a league is not more popular, valuable or monetarily more solid than MLB.

Popularity as a sport and leagues are two massively different things.

The average value of an MLS team is under a billion, with only like 5 teams being worth that.

The average value of an MLB team is 2.5 billion with zero teams worth less than 1 billion. Hell, the least valuable dumpster fire of a franchise in MLB is almost worth as much as the most valuable MLS team.

The NHL is even significantly more valuable than MLS.

Losing the Blazers and saying the Timbers keeps them among the "big three" is laughably wrong.
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I retract my statement. Sometimes i feel like you people exist only to jump down my throat when I make a mistake. Not really helping my paranoia any lol
 
Phatguysrule said:
I'm sorry if I've offended you. I didn't realize hillbilly was such a loaded slur.
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it's not loaded...it's just totally stupid in the context you're using...and you sure as hell intended it as an insult
 
Everything Beagle said:
I retract my statement. Sometimes i feel like you people exist only to jump down my throat when I make a mistake. Not really helping my paranoia any lol
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Its cool...speaking of K Falls my buddie back in the mid sixties was stationed at Kingsley Air Force Base, went to visit a few times. BacK then KFalls had some good HS teams.
 
wizenheimer said:
it's not loaded...it's just totally stupid in the context you're using...and you sure as hell intended it as an insult
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I was including myself... I literally said "we"

*Edit* and further, I said if we lose the team.

I don't think the team's going to get moved. I don't think the league wants it to happen. We'd have to screw up monumentally.

I don't think we have enough small-minded hillbillies to make that happen.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I was including myself... I literally said "we"
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whatever

all I'm saying is that you don't have to be a hillbilly or redneck or trailer trash to be against taking money out of the general fund to finance a Moda renovation. To be honest, I'm inclined to oppose that part of the proposal. I'm also questioning the legitimacy of the numbers involved and what the money is targeting. I just read this summary:

1770421464457.png

so, as I've been saying, a 360M bond issue and the jock tax would cover the debt service and principle. It would almost certainly have to be a 30 year bond so the interest rate would be in the 4-5% range. There would probably be a staggered call structure starting after 5-10 years. The projection for the jock tax revenue is 20M/year. If the bonds paid a 4.25% rate (assuming they were tax-exempt, which is not guaranteed), the debt service would be 15M/year. To retire the bonds at 5M a year would take 72 years....and that won't fly. Factoring in a staggered call schedule would probably drop the average annual principle payment to around 10M/year, maybe 11M. Meaning, this part of the proposal doesn't look right

I'm still waiting to hear how many millions the Dundon Group will be chipping in
 
PDXFonz said:
I agree with HCP. There are plenty of arenas in the league in much worse shape than MODA. The whole “we need a new arena” statement is a smokescreen. I’m not surprised that the city doesnt agree with this narrative. Nor do I expect the city to change their stance on this overnight, so I basically view this as a clear sign that Portland has no intentions on putting money into the MODA center at this time.

To the initial statement, as an example - I remember going to a Mystics game in DC like ~10 years ago and that arena looked and felt old AF back then. I’m not sure if they’ve done anything to it since then, but if not then it’s waaaaay behind MODA on that list.
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Aren't the wizards getting a new arena?

All the examples I've heard of worse arenas have new ones being built, or are in the middle of NYC.

If PDX and Oregon will vote to pay for a baseball arena but not the Blazers - maybe the team will be right to explore leaving.
 
THE HCP said:
The arena is absolutely fine. Don’t know where this all started that we need a new one.
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Do you think owners that paid 4 billion are going to be happy with a 30 year old arena that doesn't provide revenue like other cities more modern one?

Other cities will pay for a better arena than Moda. Why would Dundon keep the Blazers in Portland if we're unwilling to pay that? Or unwilling to pay for basketball what has already been approved for PDX baseball?
 
JfizzleBlazer said:
This is leverage imo. The only city it makes sense to move the team to would be Vegas for $$$$. Remember they have to pay a massive amount for relocation costs. I just don't see the league being in a hurry to allow someone to move the team.
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Of course this is leverage. But if voters don't give the Blazers anything like Sacramento gave, and instead hold out like Seattle, the owners and league will certainly look at other cities. Maybe just move to Seattle or Vegas - they both already have arenas.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
One thing that everyone overlooks is that the Sonics were losing money. They needed their arena remodeled so the team could financially survive.

Honestly, on the business side of things, the Blazers have an excellent staff. It was long argued that small market teams can't make a profit. The Blazers do make one. They have for the last 10+ seasons. Business-wise, the Blazers gone from S.P.A.M. to profit-generating.
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Blazers have also been bottom 5 in the league in luxury tax paid since 2004. There isn't any team that won a title out of that group.
 
wizenheimer said:
you know what....I think that's mostly bullshit

what we're talking about is taking current money out of the State's general fund. In the scheme of things the amount is small, but the budget needs to balance and there are a lot of competing interests like:

K-12 education
health care, Medicaid, and human services
public safety and emergency response
safe roads & highways, and structurally sound bridges
food assistance
housing assistance
electrical infrastructure
wildfire response and mitigation
etc. etc. etc.

it's difficult for me to elevate a Moda Renovation that will mostly benefit a billionaire and one small region of the state over all those other priorities. Renovation of a 30 year old building for guys to shoot basketbalss and Miley Cyrus to shake her booty. It just doesn't seem to rise to necessity when competing against all those other claims on a limited resource. That's not hillbilly logic

something else and I'm not sure about this...it kind of sounded like the State of Oregon would be required to underwrite the bond issue. If so, the State could be on the hook for the entire 600M which everybody knows will probably end up at 800M (or more) by the time it's done
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Flip side is if the team moves all the"Jock tax" funds are gone so the general fund is smaller than if the state paid for arena upgrades.

Not saying it's right, but that's what pro sports do everywhere.

Oregon set themselves into a corner by funding a baseball arena.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
We do support the team.

We're currently 13th in average attendance.

Team makes a profit.

This is very different than the Sonics situation.

They were the only team/arena that had to cancel a game because of the roof leaking.

What upgrades does the Moda need?
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Moda needs more suites so the owners can make more money. Go look at the clippers arena for some ideas of what owners would like.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
The Blazers have done an amazing job of continuously improving the Moda. Just this offseason they did new video boards and improved the seating.

A major renovation is not needed. It's like your house, if you take care of it, you don't need to take it down to the studs and rebuild it.

And we can't get a straight answer on what upgrades are needed. Are we talking 400 level? Chocolate and champagne fountains?
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Doesn't matter if you or me or anyone here articulates what upgrades are or are not needed.

Adam Silver said it's needed. That was not by accident. The NBA is beginning the processes of moving the team if Oregon doesn't partner in giving those upgrades.
 
wizenheimer said:
That's really insulting for all the people who really don't care about sports or the Blazers (there are millions of them), but are taxpayers. Why the fuck should working people in Coos Bay and Grants Pass and Klamath Falls and Lakeview and Vale pay part of the cost for a Moda renovation? That 'jock tax' component of this funding proposal is kind of a bullshit cop-out. By all reporting, Dundon is going to have a major say, the lead control on what happens with the renovation; but I have not heard about how much money he'll be investing in the project. Will it even be 10 dollars? 1 dollar? Why should a farmer in Roseburg Oregon pay more than the guy who owns the Blazers?
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Because if Oregon doesn't pay another city/state will and yes the "Jock tax" loss will harm the Oregon budget with the team leaving more than if the guy from Roseburg paid.

On a national level I agree it's stupid sports teams basically blackmail cities for this. But that's just how it works - any city that object losses the team.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Moda needs more suites so the owners can make more money. Go look at the clippers arena for some ideas of what owners would like.
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Suites are corporate buys, so yes, any arena in LA is going to have far more suites than an arena in Portland.
 
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