Politics Ukraine / Russia (2 Viewers)

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https://digbysblog.net/2022/12/24/a-very-tucker-christmas/

Thoughts on why American right hates Zelensky so much.

Briefly, Putin to them represents white supremacy, Christian theocracy and machismo. The picture of Putin on a horse, shirtless, wearing a cross, represented epitome of manliness, unlike "effete" Obama. Rather awkward when they met and President Obama towered over the diminutive Putin. (Napoleon complex, anyone?)

Just before Russian invasion of Ukraine, Ted Cruz favorably compared a Russian propaganda video of a muscular shaven headed soldier doing calisthenics with a US Army recruitment video in which a Latina soldier talks about what she learned from her two moms. Cruz talked about strong masculine Russian army as compared with weak "woke" US Army.

When Russia invaded the right expected a quick victory for the forces of whiteness, Christian nationalism, male dominance and heterosexuality over wimpy Ukraine with a Jewish president of all things.

That it didn't happen is to them an outrage. Ukraine resisted. The Jewish president is a worldwide example of fighting tyranny. The supposedly senile Biden is balancing aiding Ukraine while not directly going to war.

None of this was supposed to happen. For the right, they now see Zelensky and Ukraine the same way they saw a Harvard educated Black man with perfect manners becoming President of the United States. It's an offense to their entire world view. It's not just a political disagreement. It's an incomprehensible outrage.
 
beast crnjo said:
Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
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beast crnjo said:
How is that going to help the us? Russia was no threat to us aside from the nuclear threat, which this conflict only enhances.
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beast crnjo said:
The us instigated the conflict by orchestrating a coup in 2014.
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beast crnjo said:
Russia didn't use their best equipment, nor much air power. Wait for round 2.
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Spoken like a true comrade.
 
crandc said:
https://digbysblog.net/2022/12/24/a-very-tucker-christmas/

Thoughts on why American right hates Zelensky so much.

Briefly, Putin to them represents white supremacy, Christian theocracy and machismo. The picture of Putin on a horse, shirtless, wearing a cross, represented epitome of manliness, unlike "effete" Obama. Rather awkward when they met and President Obama towered over the diminutive Putin. (Napoleon complex, anyone?)

Just before Russian invasion of Ukraine, Ted Cruz favorably compared a Russian propaganda video of a muscular shaven headed soldier doing calisthenics with a US Army recruitment video in which a Latina soldier talks about what she learned from her two moms. Cruz talked about strong masculine Russian army as compared with weak "woke" US Army.

When Russia invaded the right expected a quick victory for the forces of whiteness, Christian nationalism, male dominance and heterosexuality over wimpy Ukraine with a Jewish president of all things.

That it didn't happen is to them an outrage. Ukraine resisted. The Jewish president is a worldwide example of fighting tyranny. The supposedly senile Biden is balancing aiding Ukraine while not directly going to war.

None of this was supposed to happen. For the right, they now see Zelensky and Ukraine the same way they saw a Harvard educated Black man with perfect manners becoming President of the United States. It's an offense to their entire world view. It's not just a political disagreement. It's an incomprehensible outrage.
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100% correct.
 
Difficult to know how much damage Ukraine did with the drone attack. Some russian sources say 17 dead and several airplanes damaged. but russia did not allow any photos or video to leak this time.
Day 307. Russian airbase in Saratov’s Engels under attack again: Russia claims “Ukrainian” UAV downed but three troops killed. Fighting has remained focused around the Bakhmut sector of Donetsk Oblast, and near Svatove in Luhansk; little territory has changed hands.
 
crandc said:
I have that person on ignore so comments seemed to be floating in midair.
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Ahhh, gotcha...I've run into the same problem before when using the "ignore" feature...sometimes it can help by filtering out undesired content, but it can also makes things a bit confusing.
 
Day 308. Nearly 9 million Ukrainians without electricity. Occupiers damage over 700 critical infrastructure facilities since the start of the full-scale invasion. Group of Ukrainian soldiers killed in Bryansk Oblast.
(Only four killed in that "group"; they were special ops guys operating inside russia.)
 
A couple other notes. Ukraine not happy with NY Times piece claiming both sides have hardened negotiating positions, implying both are being unreasonable. Ukraine is only asking that russia gets out of all Ukrainian territory before negotiating. russia is demanding that Ukraine recognize russia's annexed territories (much of which they don't even presently occupy) as now russian. Who is being unreasonable?
Also want to say there will be no stalemate. I think that before the end of January, Ukraine will have a surprise for the russians.
Day 309. Ukraine’s near-future goals are its liberation and restoration, returning citizens home, and rapprochement with key partners, says Zelenskyy. Ukrainian forces continued counteroffensive operations toward Kreminna. Electricity deficit in Ukrainian power grid grows after Russia’s latest shelling.
 
So many here have brains polluted by propaganda. Dont you see how they've been lying about how ukraine will win? And they frame russia as the devil and ukraine is so wonderful. The truth behind the conflict is much messier.

There should have been negotiations long ago rather than warmongering.

You all may think I'm full of it. But we will see. If terms are not reached soon, ukraine will be brought to its knees.
 
beast crnjo said:
So many here have brains polluted by propaganda. Dont you see how they've been lying about how ukraine will win? And they frame russia as the devil and ukraine is so wonderful. The truth behind the conflict is much messier.

There should have been negotiations long ago rather than warmongering.

You all may think I'm full of it. But we will see. If terms are not reached soon, ukraine will be brought to its knees.
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Why should a sovereign nation that has been unjustly invaded want to negotiate? Are you arguing in favor of appeasement policies? What positions do you believe Ukraine should have been willing to cede for the sake of ending hostilities?
 
3rd party, agreed upon by both sides conduct vote on disputed regions. Ukraine agree to not join NATO.
 
beast crnjo said:
3rd party, agreed upon by both sides conduct vote on disputed regions. Ukraine agree to not join NATO.
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The idea that there exists a 3rd party that both Russia and Ukraine would agree upon is ludicrous to me. As is the notion that one country should be able to have any say over whether or not another joins a particular international organization.
 
NY Times lives to "both sides". You know, Trump invited an insurrection but Biden jay walked so equivalent.
 
beast crnjo said:
3rd party, agreed upon by both sides conduct vote on disputed regions. Ukraine agree to not join NATO.
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Ukraine made an offer to agree not to join NATO and be a neutral country in the first days of the war. Rejected by russia. You do understand that a country cannot invade another country and then ask for avote while they militarily occupy, yes? What if USA invaded Mexico? Possibly a majority of Mexicans would vote to join USA. But is that the kind of world you want?
 
Massive missile attack on Ukraine today against civilian infrastucture, 54 of 69 rockets intercepted but electricity out in much of the country. Meanwhile on the real battlefield, 790 russians soldiers died in the slaughterhouse as their commanders sent them into battle without tank support.
322413281_557074449301911_4762371671459433126_n.png
 
beast crnjo said:
So many here have brains polluted by propaganda. Dont you see how they've been lying about how ukraine will win? And they frame russia as the devil and ukraine is so wonderful. The truth behind the conflict is much messier.

There should have been negotiations long ago rather than warmongering.

You all may think I'm full of it. But we will see. If terms are not reached soon, ukraine will be brought to its knees.
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You might want to read this if you think Ukraine will lose. Of course you can call it American propaganda. But who are the liars here? Who said they would never invade Ukraine? Who said there would never be a mobilization? Who keeps denying atrocities that have been confirmed by every human rights group in the world, including russia's own Memorial group?
https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-war-russia-spencer/32198977.html#0_8_10089_8766_2710_245401755
 
beast crnjo said:
So many here have brains polluted by propaganda. Dont you see how they've been lying about how ukraine will win? And they frame russia as the devil and ukraine is so wonderful. The truth behind the conflict is much messier.

There should have been negotiations long ago rather than warmongering.

You all may think I'm full of it. But we will see. If terms are not reached soon, ukraine will be brought to its knees.
Click to expand...

Damn I didn't know we had our own personal Russian bot!
 
beast crnjo said:
So many here have brains polluted by propaganda. Dont you see how they've been lying about how ukraine will win? And they frame russia as the devil and ukraine is so wonderful. The truth behind the conflict is much messier.

There should have been negotiations long ago rather than warmongering.

You all may think I'm full of it. But we will see. If terms are not reached soon, ukraine will be brought to its knees.
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You think we just read western propaganda. Well, here is an article by russian journalists who can't go back to russia, because in russia you go to jail for even calling it a war, Read about what it is like under russian occupation. How could any person with a conscience negotiate to allow them to keep occupying territories that they have taken by force or negotiate to allow them to occupy other territories which they claim have to be given to them before they will even start to negotiate?
https://meduza.io/en/feature/2022/12/29/i-heard-my-husband-s-inhuman-screams
 
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