We NEED To Consolidate!

[MAS RipCity]

It is becoming painfully obvious, we need a 3 for 1 to obtain a fairly high level player. We can only put 5 guys out there at once an, the problem is only going to get worse once Marty gets back and Bayless moves up in the rotation. Oh yea, and that Big Guy might takes up some time too.
I am thinking a combination of any of the following:
Steve Blake
Martell Webster
Sergio Rodriguez (although inclined to keep him)
Travis Outlaw (really want to keep him,but not untouchable)
Channing Frye
Raef LaFrentz
Jerryd Bayless/Nic Batum (would LOVE to hold onto both, but if we want another top flight player to be in the "Big 4", one would have to go)

So we have a few options:

1- Stay put. We are a young team. Let the cake bake and anything we accomplish this year is gravy. We should see who is officially going to be in the Free Agent market before we react to anything.

2- Consolidate, but keep our youth. Trade a few like Frye, Blake, and Raef and get someone to help us out for this year, like a one year rental. If we like the fit, we re-sign. If we don't, we keep our cap space and our youth had more time to develop.

3- Go for the gusto now! Use Raef's expiring deal along with a vet and one of our prospects and get a Vince Carter type (NOT VINCE HIMSELF, but a great player in a situation that looks bleek). Shawn Marion is the obvious fit.

The question remains: Is it really worth it to deal our prospects to maybe reach the playoffs or win a round?
Our goal is to win a championship, be a title contending team, not just reach the show.
Thoughts? Comments?

Personally, I think we should just wait and see with our youth. Batum just looks SPECIAL and I think dealing Bayless would come back to bite us in the ass, BUT we do need a 3 for 1 to just make playing time available. I really want to see what noise we can make in the free agent market to get our vet before dealing Batum or Bayless for one. I do not want a quick fix, this is a process that takes TIME.

 

[BalancedMan]

If we find a deal of good value, then go after it. Don't mortgage the future to make the playoffs or win only one extra round this year. We are fortunate that we have great young players who are still on cheap rookie contracts and can potentially add another piece via FA. So no one is untouchable, but the trades need to make sense.

 

[KingSpeed]

I think we might have to re-evaluate the Big 3. Might Rudy be better than Roy in the long term? Is LMA really a cornerstone player? And who knows with Oden?

 

[BalancedMan]

I think we might have to re-evaluate the Big 3. Might Rudy be better than Roy in the long term? Is LMA really a cornerstone player? And who knows with Oden?

All three of those are fair enough. LMA has shown he's good, but he still has a step to take to be one of your main guys on a team. Oden...time will tell with that fiasco, but right now I'm going to not bank on him as much as I might of in the past. As for Roy...I don't think you can get rid of him. Exactly who would you look to get back for him? Granted, he has a few injury concerns and is on the older end of a "newer" player in the league, but the guy was an all-star last year, let's not forget.

Watching him play for the Blazers as well as the NCAA tournament for Washington, Roy exudes confidence and leadership. It's sort of like an aura. I think that he does help make the other players on his team better. I'm not saying he'll ever be a top-5 or top-15 player in this league. But he could very well be a top-30 player in this league and would be amazing if he were the "second dog". Rudy will also likely be very good, and I like what I've seen so far, but we have to see what we'd be getting back before we make any judgments.

But as for consolidation, at some point we'll need to make it happen. Either by a 3 for 1 or developing players and letting others go.

 

[Mediocre Man]

IMO the players that need to be kept are these

Roy
Aldridge
Oden
Batum
Fernandez

This team needs defense and stability. Batum is our best defender period. He might also be our smartest player.

 

[craigehlo]

IMO the players that need to be kept are these

Roy
Aldridge
Oden
Batum
Fernandez

I tend to agree with this list, but Batum could be packaged if the deal was right for a great SF.

I'm just worried that TO's stock has dropped really far (and it wasn't amazingly high to begin with) after his mediocre play at the start of the season. The longer we wait, the less we get for him IMHO.

 

[GrandpaBlaze]

IMO the players that need to be kept are these

Roy
Aldridge
Oden
Batum
Fernandez

This team needs defense and stability. Batum is our best defender period. He might also be our smartest player.

Agreed. Everyone else is very tradeable. I like what little I've seen of Bayless but I'm not sure that he has what it takes to be the top dog and I'm not so sure he is a great team player.

We have a lot of nice guys that I like, but overall, those are the five that really get me excited. If Webster was playing, he might make that list based on reports of how he had been doing but we also heard similar reports in regard to Blake and he hasn't exactly been overwhelming.

Gramps...

 

[Nikolokolus]

I want to see how this team is playing in December when the schedule looks a little more like an actual NBA schedule and not some twisted version of "Gauntlet" that David Stern and the league execs cooked up to demoralize a young team.

It looks bad now, but it was to be expected.

 

[MrJayremmie]

IMO the players that need to be kept are these

Roy
Aldridge
Oden
Batum
Fernandez

This team needs defense and stability. Batum is our best defender period. He might also be our smartest player.

Mine is that plus Bayless... I think those 6 are our core that we should re-sign and then fill in with role players around. That gives us a starting lineup and a super sixth man for 30minutes+...

 

[Mediocre Man]

Mine is that plus Bayless... I think those 6 are our core that we should re-sign and then fill in with role players around. That gives us a starting lineup and a super sixth man for 30minutes+...

I'd like to see more of Bayless before I throw him in there, but yes he appears to have everything this team is missing. Perimeter defense, attacking the basket, fire in his belly.

 

[MrJayremmie]

I'd like to see more of Bayless before I throw him in there, but yes he appears to have everything this team is missing. Perimeter defense, attacking the basket, fire in his belly.

Yeah, by that I kinda meant he just isn't someone I would trade right now because of what you said, we haven't seen enough of him, but he has looked good.

He isn't a part of our core like I said right now though, I misspoke (typed).

IDK why i'm drawn to Bayless, he just seemed so perfect (for our team...) from the day we drafted him.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

At some point we'll definitely have to consolidate. I'm not so certain the time is now. There's absolutely no way I would move any of our big three, Batum, Fernandez, or Bayless. Batum and Bayless have shown too much promise (and then some in Batum's case).

I'm also not as concerned about the Playoffs this season as I am with the development of each of my keepers above.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Yeah, by that I kinda meant he just isn't someone I would trade right now because of what you said, we haven't seen enough of him, but he has looked good.

He isn't a part of our core like I said right now though, I misspoke (typed).

IDK why i'm drawn to Bayless, he just seemed so perfect (for our team...) from the day we drafted him.

What I love about Bayless is his fuck you attitude. The game agianst the L*kers was a great example. He drove and elbowed Kobe in the head on his lay up attempt. This team needs a lot more of that attitude.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

I want to see how this team is playing in December when the schedule looks a little more like an actual NBA schedule and not some twisted version of "Gauntlet" that David Stern and the league execs cooked up to demoralize a young team.

It looks bad now, but it was to be expected.

Losing to Utah without their star point guard is to be expected?

 

[BrianFromWA]

Can someone explain to me another young team that, without veteran presence that had won anything, learned to win the right way on their own?

I can't recall off the top of my head. But I think there's much more value in a short-term rental like Nash or, dare I say it, Kidd (and of course Parker) as our starting PG. I think Sergio and Bayless/Koponen could be groomed for it in a couple years. I think just about everyone in here underestimates how much we need a veteran PG who Nate knows is better than he was who's won something to help this team out.

And Batum needs not only to start, but to play crunch time. Our problems in crunch time aren't not having enough shooters on the floor, but of not having a lot of people who do "dirty work" at the end of the games. It's why I wanted Przy on the floor at the end of games last year. It's why I think Przy and Batum should be on the floor now. Rudy/Outlaw and Roy and LMA are plenty of offense...bring in Travis offense/defense if you want...but yesterday there wasn't anyone there to rebound Rudy's wide-open miss. There wasn't anyone collecting the Jazz misses during the 4th quarter. When LMA is your great rebounding hope ('cuz let's face it...Blake, Roy, Frye and Outlaw aren't sniffing close to the hoop at all--and Rudy's outside waiting for the 3--at the end of the game), something is way wrong.

I think a less-intrusive consolidation is required. Look at what the market dictates for Frye, Blake, Diogu and Raef. Definitely keep one of the Bayless/Sergio combo, though I'd give up Bayless first since I imagine he has much more value, and Sergio can turn into a really good distribution PG.

Nash first. Then Kidd. But I think that's what we need to target. Moreso than the Harris types.

Crazy thought...could D-Wade play PG for our team?

 

[1 Eye Jack]

Roy as PG, Rudy at SG, Batum/Webster, Oden

Need a bruising back up PF that actually likes going inside. Our PF's give you absolutely no rebounding, not hustle plays, and no defense. Trade for David Lee (make him the back up to LMA) and give Roy the PG spot whether he wants it or not. This is the only way we are going to get Rudy on the floor and it's obvious that he needs to be playing at the end of the game and getting at least 30 minutes a game. This gives us a lineup of Roy,Rudy,Batum/Webster, LMA and Oden. Very good offensive team, good defense and a couple of hustle players (Rudy and Batum).

 

[Hank The Dwarf]

Nash first. Then Kidd. But I think that's what we need to target. Moreso than the Harris types.

Crazy thought...could D-Wade play PG for our team?

Do you realize what it would cost to get one of those guys? At the bare minimum it would cost us LMA. We don't need a superstar. We simply need clearly defined roles for our guys and an offensive system that puts them in positions to make plays, not shoot tough shots against the shot clock.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Losing to Utah without their star point guard is to be expected?

Minus Martell and Oden, and in Utah? Yeah.

 

[1 Eye Jack]

Do you realize what it would cost to get one of those guys? At the bare minimum it would cost us LMA. We don't need a superstar. We simply need clearly defined roles for our guys and an offensive system that puts them in positions to make plays, not shoot tough shots against the shot clock.

I would love to have Wade but you might as well trade either Roy or Rudy because there's not enough minutes for all of them. Plus offense isn't costing us games it's our defense. I also hate that our PF's combined for something like 5 rebounds, ouch!

 

[craigehlo]

I want to see how this team is playing in December when the schedule looks a little more like an actual NBA schedule and not some twisted version of "Gauntlet" that David Stern and the league execs cooked up to demoralize a young team.

Last night's game was against a Jazz team without DWilliams. Let's not pretend they were close to full strength and playing some high level basketball. If we can't pull off a win against a team starting Ronnie Price, then we are no better than the Clippers.

This fanbase seems to have an excuse for everything. If we expect to make the playoffs without beating tough teams, then we need to move to the Easten Conference.

 

[#1_War_Poet_ForLife]

You guys are batshit. Raef+Outlaw+Sergio isn't going to net you much. You NEED to give up good value to get back great value. Vince Carter should be something like Raef+Rudy.

 

[gatorpops]

What I love about Bayless is his fuck you attitude. The game agianst the L*kers was a great example. He drove and elbowed Kobe in the head on his lay up attempt. This team needs a lot more of that attitude.

Nate needs to yell at Roy and LA to let them know, maybe even in front of the other player to get more agressive. The Refs honor the agressive team. Both guys are not that by nature. Nate needs to challenge their professionalism, or so it seems to me.

When I played basketball I couldn't run or jump well, but I did hustles and that got me on at least one team. These guys have great talent but are not intent enough on winning.

g

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Losing to Utah without their star point guard is to be expected?

I personally expected them to win also, but I'm not surprised that they didn't. Utah's a veteran team. Without Williams, Brewer, Kiri, Boozer, Okur stepped up big. It was as if Williams wasn't even needed. Especially, the emergence of Brewer. His energy and attacks to the basket were big for them.

I also think you're not realizing the impact of losing Greg Oden and Martell Webster. This team as been preparing to play around Oden. Aldridge and Frye were needed as centers last year, but not this year. Aldridge increased his range to the perimeter and Frye worked on his handles and quickness so that they could better serve a team centered around Oden. I don't think this is a major impact, but it's something to consider.

What was an important impact is the loss of Webster. Webster was a huge key to the Blazers' success against the Jazz last year. It's not a stretch to say he was our MVP in that entire season-long match up. In place of him, while we did add Batum, Nate didn't go to him down the stretch and instead decided to lean on Outlaw and Roy at the SF spot. This was a major difference.

Lastly, home court is huge for them.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

And Batum needs not only to start, but to play crunch time. Our problems in crunch time aren't not having enough shooters on the floor, but of not having a lot of people who do "dirty work" at the end of the games.

Also, Batum, on offense, not only works his ass off to help get the ball back in our possession should we miss fire, but also keeps that ball moving around.

What did us in last night was lack of ball movement in the late 3rd and 4th quarter IMO.

I'm not that excited about Roy at the PG, but it's at least palatable if Batum and Rudy are in there to make our offense more effective.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Need a bruising back up PF that actually likes going inside.

As much as many on here think Shavlik Randolph is worthless, he's actually very skilled and active PF. I'm pissed off about Nate not giving Batum more minutes, but I'm very ticked off that he didn't embarrass both Aldridge and Frye by giving Randolph those minutes in the late 3rd period when the tide was obviously changing.

I hate to say it folks, but I'm very concerned with Nate's decision making. I'll try and keep supporting him, but he's giving me less and less reasons to anymore!

 

[Crimson the Cat]

This fanbase seems to have an excuse for everything. If we expect to make the playoffs without beating tough teams, then we need to move to the Easten Conference.

Or many, such as yourself, have unreasonable expectations and lack patience.

 

[BrianFromWA]

You guys are batshit. Raef+Outlaw+Sergio isn't going to net you much. You NEED to give up good value to get back great value. Vince Carter should be something like Raef+Rudy.

1) Pau Gasol for Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittendon, Marc Gasol and 2 late 20's picks.
2) Ray Allen for Wally Szczerbiak, Delonte West and Jeff Green.
3) Mo Williams for Luke Ridnour, Damon Jones and Adrian Griffin (Bucks' side of the trade)
4) Richard Jefferson for Yi and Bobby Simmons.
5) 3M and a trade exception for James Jones and Rudy.
6) Kurt Thomas and 2 #1 picks for a trade exception

Do you want me to go back farther than the last year? Money is a REALLY big player in trades. But I guess I'm the batshit one, not NBA GMs.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

You guys are batshit. Raef+Outlaw+Sergio isn't going to net you much. You NEED to give up good value to get back great value. Vince Carter should be something like Raef+Rudy.

I'd rather just keep Rudy then. Kevin Pritchard has proven that by remaining patient, the deals will come.

Vince Carter is nice, but there are other players such as Josh Childress, maybe a Michael Redd, or a Kirk Hinrich that could really help this team and the asking price wouldn't be that high IMO.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Nate needs to yell at Roy and LA to let them know, maybe even in front of the other player to get more agressive.

That was there whole focus in practice the last couple of days from what I heard. I thought Brandon actually did a good job of penetrating. He did shoot 6 foul shots.

I'm disappointed in Aldridge. He did take his game closer to the basket this time around, but still couldn't grab the rebounds. I'm really puzzled by this. I hope Coach Lucas gets well soon. Aldridge could use a kick-in-the-pants. (unless Boozer was just that good)

 

[BrianFromWA]

Boozer's no joke, but LMA still needs to step up his game.