What a Buffoon

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SlyPokerDog said:
We spend more per capita on healthcare than any other nation. Way more. The government already spends as much per capita on healthcare than other nations.

Our system is inefficient.

We are the hardest working industrial nation in the world. We work longer hours and have less time off. That's a fact.

So we can have the greatest military and provide all citizens with the best health care in the world and that doesn't mean a 5o to 60% tax rate.

And I would argue that the Declaration of Independence does address health care as a right of all citizens.

We hold these truths to be sacred & undeniable; that all men are created equal & independent, that from that equal creation they derive rights inherent & inalienable, among which are the preservation of life, & liberty, & the pursuit of happiness; ...
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We spend more on health insurance and healthcare because of many factors. The medical community in this country is a for-profit industry and it spends millions of dollars annually lobbying Congress to make sure that its interests are protected. The health insurance industry is a for-profit industry and it also lobbies Congress to protect its interests. The Federal government regulates the snot out of the production of new pharmaceuticals and then grants patents that allow drug companies monopolies for the period of the patent. The same is true of the equipment used in medicine, implants, and on and on. Add to that costs associated with medical malpractice and other tort claims, artificial constraints in medical schools on the number of doctors being educated, etc. and, yeah, it's pretty easy to see why we're paying so much and how inefficient it is. Unfortunately, the politics and the mechanics of trying to unravel that Gordian knot aren't so clear cut. It's in our DNA as Americans to throw money at problems. Sometimes that works, but more often than not it's just a way of convincing ourselves that we're doing something.

The Declaration of Independence is a statement of revolution. It contains a lot of flowery sentiments, but it holds no legal power. The Constitution and Bill of Rights are where the Founding Fathers set forth the legal basis of what rights we have as citizens. I don't think that there's anything in there that can be stretched to say that we have a basic right to healthcare. I wouldn't be opposed to adding that, but we'd better figure out exactly what we mean and how we're going to pay for it.
 
MarAzul said:
Nope, we have an amendment that says "arms" not muskets.
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You wanted original intent. They obviously didn't intend AR-15s, they couldn't have even imagined them.

barfo
 
barfo said:
they couldn't have even imagined them
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Oh, I don't know about that! They certainly anticipated imagination, that is no doubt why the didn't stick us with muskets. Arm had been improving for years, I allow them having the wisdom, they expected it would continue.
 
e_blazer said:
We spend more on health insurance and healthcare because of many factors. The medical community in this country is a for-profit industry and it spends millions of dollars annually lobbying Congress to make sure that its interests are protected. The health insurance industry is a for-profit industry and it also lobbies Congress to protect its interests. The Federal government regulates the snot out of the production of new pharmaceuticals and then grants patents that allow drug companies monopolies for the period of the patent. The same is true of the equipment used in medicine, implants, and on and on. Add to that costs associated with medical malpractice and other tort claims, artificial constraints in medical schools on the number of doctors being educated, etc. and, yeah, it's pretty easy to see why we're paying so much and how inefficient it is. Unfortunately, the politics and the mechanics of trying to unravel that Gordian knot aren't so clear cut. It's in our DNA as Americans to throw money at problems. Sometimes that works, but more often than not it's just a way of convincing ourselves that we're doing something.

The Declaration of Independence is a statement of revolution. It contains a lot of flowery sentiments, but it holds no legal power. The Constitution and Bill of Rights are where the Founding Fathers set forth the legal basis of what rights we have as citizens. I don't think that there's anything in there that can be stretched to say that we have a basic right to healthcare. I wouldn't be opposed to adding that, but we'd better figure out exactly what we mean and how we're going to pay for it.
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http://www.aha.org/research/rc/stat-studies/fast-facts.shtml

upload_2017-3-28_16-27-35.png

Looks to me like 80% of the hospitals are non profit.

And:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/peteru...ive-ruining-american-healthcare/#3d403c7537b9

“Imagine confiscating all the profits of all the famously greedy health insurance companies. That would pay for 4 days of healthcare for all Americans. Now add in the profits of the 10 biggest ‘rapacious’ drug companies. Another 13 days.”
 
Denny Crane said:
http://www.aha.org/research/rc/stat-studies/fast-facts.shtml

View attachment 13362

Looks to me like 80% of the hospitals are non profit.

And:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/peteru...ive-ruining-american-healthcare/#3d403c7537b9

“Imagine confiscating all the profits of all the famously greedy health insurance companies. That would pay for 4 days of healthcare for all Americans. Now add in the profits of the 10 biggest ‘rapacious’ drug companies. Another 13 days.”
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A. I'm glad to know you're still alive, Denny. You've been MIA around here.

B. You misunderstand me if you think that I have a problem with profit by either the insurance industry or the medical industry. I'm just saying that the fact that there are so many competing interests involved in the healthcare debate makes finding any kind of a solution, or even agreement as to what a solution would look like, nearly impossible.
 
Just copy how other countries do it. Ahh, but that would be socialist, so we must reinvent the wheel.
 
e_blazer said:
A. I'm glad to know you're still alive, Denny. You've been MIA around here.

B. You misunderstand me if you think that I have a problem with profit by either the insurance industry or the medical industry. I'm just saying that the fact that there are so many competing interests involved in the healthcare debate makes finding any kind of a solution, or even agreement as to what a solution would look like, nearly impossible.
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There's a big difference between insurance and care. That is completely lost in the discussion.

VA provides care via its hospital system. Aetna provides insurance, and maybe their only doctor employees are in advisory roles.

I don't see the profit motive as being the issue. The real issue is the individual isn't shopping around and making providers compete for the $$$
 
Denny Crane said:
The real issue is the individual isn't shopping around and making providers compete for the $$$
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Very true, and the Government has been instrumental in hiding the financials from the individual. A big part of the reason is to make it possible shift the cost to the from some groups to the others.
 
e_blazer said:
I don't think that there's anything in there that can be stretched to say that we have a basic right to healthcare. I wouldn't be opposed to adding that, but we'd better figure out exactly what we mean and how we're going to pay for it.
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Sound reasons for why this system upgrade should be started by the amendment process.
 
MarAzul said:
Too slow for streaming.
It's an old copper land line Verizon would not sell DSL on. Frontier does but... It sucks. Works for this but games are annoying.
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Try some of the mobile friendly links. Makes sure you have ad block plus installed.

 
MarAzul said:
Too slow for streaming.
It's an old copper land line Verizon would not sell DSL on. Frontier does but... It sucks. Works for this but games are annoying.
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You should just tether your cell phone to your computer.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
You should just tether your cell phone to your computer.
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I think the cord on MarAzul's phone is not long enough to reach the computer.

we3.gif


barfo
 
barfo said:
You wanted original intent. They obviously didn't intend AR-15s, they couldn't have even imagined them.

barfo
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They meant ALL and ANY arms, which is why they didn't specify only one type. And yes, they had most likely already imagined them.
 

(not sure why this video won't embed in the correct size...half of it is cut-off for some reason :dunno: )

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Trump may actually be a nut!67432505.jpg or he plays with numb skulls like a kid with silly putty
 
Jimmy Carter and GHW Bush had wonderful first 100 days. How'd they do in their reelection bids?
 
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