What are your beliefs on religion, god?

[MadeFromDust]

PS the answer is "nothing" created Everything. It's been repeatedly observed. ;]

at about 4:20 he starts describing things that are definitely against accepted scientific knowledge about the expansion of space being real.

at 5:27 he also claims you cannot be seen without matter, which is QUITE, QUITE WRONG. You cannot see anything without photons, Photons are not matter, they are electricity. So not only can you see things without matter, you could not see things without this non-matter.
He then goes on to say that something that is without space is omnipresent, which is clearly not true. If something was everywhere like omnipresent, it would require space. That's just a flat lie to fit into his mold of Yahweh

Space is something confined to matter, you are missing the point entirely. The point of the video was to show that matter/time/space are not eternal therefore there is something that transcends them.

 

[magnifier661]

Space is something confined to matter, you are missing the point entirely. The point of the video was to show that matter/time/space are not eternal therefore there is something that transcends them.

When it's questioned; many would say its the mystery of the universe. We want to name it/he/she and they would prefer to just say "I don't know but it's not god"

 

[crowTrobot]

Scientists know the universe had a beginning

false

and know it will not always exist

false

 

[magnifier661]

PS the answer is "nothing" created Everything. It's been repeatedly observed. ;]

at about 4:20 he starts describing things that are definitely against accepted scientific knowledge about the expansion of space being real.

at 5:27 he also claims you cannot be seen without matter, which is QUITE, QUITE WRONG. You cannot see anything without photons, Photons are not matter, they are electricity. So not only can you see things without matter, you could not see things without this non-matter.
He then goes on to say that something that is without space is omnipresent, which is clearly not true. If something was everywhere like omnipresent, it would require space. That's just a flat lie to fit into his mold of Yahweh

You are breaking apart interpretations and not the concept. You are forgetting that a theist believes god is the universe but also outside the universe.

 

[MadeFromDust]

false



false

So you are willing to stand in the face of all modern science for the sake of your beliefs? I thought it was science that led you to atheism?

 

[crowTrobot]

It's funny that you portray Craig as a con men; yet some of the most brilliant minds can't beat him in a debate. Usually a con can be exposed. Guess his con is iron clad eh?

nobody would deny that craig is a world class debater - typically prepares better than his opponents and often comes off as more authoritative to the audience than his opponents. that doesn't make him right. he's just good at playing the game.

almost nobody in scientific or philosophical circles takes his arguments seriously.

 

[MadeFromDust]

You are breaking apart interpretations and not the concept. You are forgetting that a theist believes god is the universe but also outside the universe.

Pantheism is believing God is the universe, theism is believing that God is transcendent from the universe but is in total control of it, basically as omnipotent as conceivable.

 

[magnifier661]

nobody would deny that craig is a world class debater - typically prepares better than his opponents and often comes off as more authoritative to the audience than his opponents. that doesn't make him right. he's just good at playing the game.

almost nobody in scientific or philosophical circles takes his arguments seriously.

Ah but that would only explain that he isn't a con man. And if this is something so important to most atheistic leaders; you would think they would come better prepared. Instead they just use names to try and distract the serious questions he gives that the greatest minds of atheism can't come close to answering.

 

[Eastoff]

Space is something confined to matter, you are missing the point entirely. The point of the video was to show that matter/time/space are not eternal therefore there is something that transcends them.

So i'm missing the point that he's using individual items to prop up his belief, yet I can discredit his props?

 

[magnifier661]

Pantheism is believing God is the universe, theism is believing that God is transcendent from the universe but is in total control of it, basically as omnipotent as conceivable.

But god created the universe and when we were created; he breathed the breath of life in us yes? That would mean he is just as much a part of the universe as being outside of it.

 

[Eastoff]

Instead they just use names to try and distract the serious questions he gives that the greatest minds of atheism can't come close to answering.

Because you don't know the answer now, doesn't mean the answer can't be known.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Yeah, nobody should worry about people in power that have clearly stated that we need to die. That they need to insure that the following generations need to be trained to maintain that hated toward us. Instead, we should just ignore that shit, and send them gifts of jets and tanks. That will surely make things better between us.

I'm happy for you if that works for you. It doesn't work for me.

Then you should probably stop buying gas. The Brotherhood is just posturing. They are peanuts compared to the Wahabbis in Saudi Arabia.

 

[porkchopexpress]

Because you don't know the answer now, doesn't mean the answer can't be known.

Obviously, if you don't know the answer now, the answer is 'god did it'...

 

[magnifier661]

So i'm missing the point that he's using individual items to prop up his belief, yet I can discredit his props?

Most of the audience aren't trained to see past the trees brother. You sometimes need to explain things in a simple way for most the audience to understand. I can break apart a ton of Dawkins writings when he tries to dumb it down for his readers. What makes this any different?

 

[MadeFromDust]

But god created the universe and when we were created; he breathed the breath of life in us yes? That would mean he is just as much a part of the universe as being outside of it.

Yes God created the universe ex-nihilo, but He is not a part of the universe He created. That means we could point to ourselves and call ourselves God, which is what some people do. But God created us and all that is around us separately from Himself but He is in and throughought in Spirit.

 

[MadeFromDust]

So i'm missing the point that he's using individual items to prop up his belief, yet I can discredit his props?

Huh?

 

[magnifier661]

Obviously, if you don't know the answer now, the answer is 'god did it'...

I'm open on your take on how something that can't be infinite is always there. Doesn't have to be god did it yo!!!

It seems that when a Christian actually brings up something to think about; the atheists just use sarcasm and condescending words.

 

[crowTrobot]

Ah but that would only explain that he isn't a con man.

on the contrary it's exactly why i think he IS. he's a really smart dude using pitifully weak arguments - winning debates and selling books by pandering to the unintelligent.

And if this is something so important to most atheistic leaders; you would think they would come better prepared.

i agree.

Instead they just use names to try and distract the serious questions he gives that the greatest minds of atheism can't come close to answering.

as i said almost nobody in philosophy or science takes him seriously or cares much what he says. all of his arguments are actually quite basic and easily refuted by grade school students.

 

[magnifier661]

Yes God created the universe ex-nihilo, but He is not a part of the universe He created. That means we could point to ourselves and call ourselves God, which is what some people do. But God created us and all that is around us separately from Himself but He is in and throughought in Spirit.

I disagree because the moment we are saved we be one one with god. I believe in the trinity. God the father, son and Holy Spirit. We have the Holy Spirit in us; therefor we have god in us

 

[MadeFromDust]

Obviously, if you don't know the answer now, the answer is 'god did it'...

Better and more logical than 'nothing did it', especially when given the evidence.

 

[MadeFromDust]

I disagree because the moment we are saved we be one one with god. I believe in the trinity. God the father, son and Holy Spirit. We have the Holy Spirit in us; therefor we have god in us

We are one with God in that we are children of God, but we are not a part of God. God is infinitely transcendent from us.

 

[crowTrobot]

So you are willing to stand in the face of all modern science for the sake of your beliefs? I thought it was science that led you to atheism?

no, you are apparently misinformed about the positions of science.

 

[Eastoff]

Repeatedly observed? You mean like protons and electrons popping in and out of existence? That has nothing to do with the finitude of matter/time/space. If you want to believe everything literally came from nothing (and I'd like to know what your definition of "nothing" is), then fine go ahead and believe that. But I don't know how you could call believers in God wrong. There is a plethora of air-tight arguments for a Creator, the beginning of the universe/space/time, and historical method that we can validate the Bible with. Not only does God exist, but that the biblical God is our Creator.

That has everything to do with matter being created. His argument that, nothing can't create something, and yet there was no matter, and now there is matter.

 

[Denny Crane]

CrowTrobot mopping up!

 

[Eastoff]

Most of the audience aren't trained to see past the trees brother. You sometimes need to explain things in a simple way for most the audience to understand. I can break apart a ton of Dawkins writings when he tries to dumb it down for his readers. What makes this any different?

As far as I can tell, this isn't an analogy, he's trying to make a reasoned argument about why god exists.

 

[Eastoff]

We are one with God in that we are children of God, but we are not a part of God. God is infinitely transcendent from us.

So you deny the christian belief in the holy spirit?

 

[magnifier661]

That has everything to do with matter being created. His argument that, nothing can't create something, and yet there was no matter, and now there is matter.

Question... With what we know now; can matter be created from non matter?

 

[MadeFromDust]

no, you are apparently misinformed about the positions of science.

What happened 13.7 billion years ago according to most secular modern scientific beliefs? Did the raw materials for that singularity create themselves, or were they created and by something beyond them? If it came from nothing, why can't God come from nothing? I don't believe it, but I'd say that is much more reasonable given what we see and observe. No one has yet to show how something can come from nothing and give empirical evidence for it. People throw out wild rhetorics and baseless theories to attempt to escape the implications of these crucial truths, but they are just asking you to believe it by blind faith no more than you claim religious people do. In fact more so, because it goes against all logic and evidence there is actually more evidence historically and scientifically that Christianity is true.

 

[MadeFromDust]

So you deny the christian belief in the holy spirit?

Nope.

 

[Eastoff]

Space is something confined to matter, you are missing the point entirely. The point of the video was to show that matter/time/space are not eternal therefore there is something that transcends them.

Science describes something that transcends matter (pair production), time (general relativity) and space (general relativity and expansion of space at an accelerated rate). That is not god.