What if the Pacers didnt match Roy Hibberts contract offer?

[Nhawz]

With our success this year with the pieces that we were able to aquire. Where do you think we would be if we landed Roy Hibbert? GO.

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Challenging for a title. I think we would be in even better position with selecting Drummond instead of Leonard (two picks ahead of him)...

Drummond makes less money AND is younger.

 

[julius]

Tough to say. What would the salary cap been like this off season?

 

[Nhawz]

Im not a big numbers guy, not sure what type of money and who we would have been able to put around him. Shooting off our bench has been huge for us this year and im just not sure if we would of had the money to get the type of guys we got

 

[Nhawz]

Challenging for a title. I think we would be in even better position with selecting Drummond instead of Leonard (two picks ahead of him)...

Drummond makes less money AND is younger.

Obviously, but that wasnt possible unless we passed on lilliard. I like Drummond alot and I liked him at the time of the draft, but drafting big men and putting them in blazer uniforms is a very risky pick.

 

[B-Roy]

We would have the MLE and some small exceptions to go after other guys.

The difference is, we'd be a good team last year with Hibbert. Good teams tend to attract good players, even if they can't pay as much. There's no way we couldn't sign guys like Mo Williams or Dorell Wright if we had Hibbert. The only thing we couldn't do is absorb contracts like Lopez and TRob.

 

[Nhawz]

We would have the MLE and some small exceptions to go after other guys.

The difference is, we'd be a good team last year with Hibbert. Good teams tend to attract good players, even if they can't pay as much. There's no way we couldn't sign guys like Mo Williams or Dorell Wright if we had Hibbert. The only thing we couldn't do is absorb contracts like Lopez and TRob.

Oh okay. So we would probably still have the worst bench in the league with the hands down best starting five. And bringing in future stars would be tough because of LMA's and Hibberts contracts.

 

[Eastoff]

Obviously, but that wasnt possible unless we passed on lilliard. I like Drummond alot and I liked him at the time of the draft, but drafting big men and putting them in blazer uniforms is a very risky pick.

Theoretically, we might have been able to package our 11th and some players to move up to the 7th pick to guarantee we got him as well as Dame. We really would be juggernauts with Drummond instead of Meyers.

 

[magnifier661]

We would definitely be legit contenders this season. Blowing our load like that, would enable us to get Hickson, since we had his Bird rights at that time; which would have had a front court rotation of Aldridge, Hibbert, Hickson and Freeland. We probably wouldn't have selected Leonard either and gone with a back-up PG; which would of helped us last season.

 

[ponderguy]

We would definitely be legit contenders this season. Blowing our load like that, would enable us to get Hickson, since we had his Bird rights at that time; which would have had a front court rotation of Aldridge, Hibbert, Hickson and Freeland. We probably wouldn't have selected Leonard either and gone with a back-up PG; which would of helped us last season.

Like Kendall Marshall!

 

[GriLtCheeZ]

Lillard
Wes
Batum
Aldridge
Hibbert

Hickson (possibly) EDIT: NOT Possible. Blazers had to renounce Hickson to offer Hibbert so he'd be gone for sure.
Mid Level Exception (would have been enough for Mo and Dorell)

No CJ cause the Blazers would have been too good to keep pick last year.

Would have been pretty fuckin' good IMO.

 

[Blazinaway]

I always wonder if we tried to trade up from #11 to get Drummond after we drafted Lillard, I wonder if Drummond was high on our list?

 

[Blazer Fanatic]

Oh okay. So we would probably still have the worst bench in the league with the hands down best starting five. And bringing in future stars would be tough because of LMA's and Hibberts contracts.

It would be worse than the bench we have now, yes. But who knows what free agents would be attracted to come to Port. It's still a small market.

 

[ponderguy]

It would be worse than the bench we have now, yes. But who knows what free agents would be attracted to come to Port. It's still a small market.

How would it be worse? Could still get Mo and Dorrell last summer. JJ Hickson could have been resigned. Freeland would still be here. No Robinson but with JJ in the fold we'd be better off. Only real loss is CJ McCollum but since he isn't playing atm anyways we wouldn't have lost anything from what we've seen so far. The real loss would be Robin Lopez (never thought I'd say that before the season!) but Hibbert more than makes up for that

 

[magnifier661]

I always wonder if we tried to trade up from #11 to get Drummond after we drafted Lillard, I wonder if Drummond was high on our list?

I really really love drummond. I was hoping Portland traded up to get him. I was hoping we used Felton + our pick to Toronto. They picked Ross because they needed a guard. Felton could have been that guard, and they probably could have gotten Ross or Lamb with our pick.

 

[Blazinaway]

I really really love drummond. I was hoping Portland traded up to get him. I was hoping we used Felton + our pick to Toronto. They picked Ross because they needed a guard. Felton could have been that guard, and they probably could have gotten Ross or Lamb with our pick.

I liked him a lot too, would have been an incredible draft getting him and Lillard, wonder what the cost would have been to move up 2 or 3 spots?

Drummond could easily end up being the best player in that draft, top 3 for sure

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Obviously, but that wasnt possible unless we passed on lilliard. I like Drummond alot and I liked him at the time of the draft, but drafting big men and putting them in blazer uniforms is a very risky pick.

I think 90% of all here was hoping Drummand would fall to #11 that year, just wasn't happening. :MARIS61:

 

[ponderguy]

I liked him a lot too, would have been an incredible draft getting him and Lillard, wonder what the cost would have been to move up 2 or 3 spots?

Drummond could easily end up being the best player in that draft, top 3 for sure

I think it would have been Wes + the #11 pick

 

[magnifier661]

I think it would have been Wes + the #11 pick

No we had Felton that we were able to trade. Toronto needed a PG back then, and Felton could have been their man.

 

[ponderguy]

No we had Felton that we were able to trade. Toronto needed a PG back then, and Felton could have been their man.

Are you forgetting the disaster of a season he had just completed here? This is the haul we got for him:
New York acquired guard Raymond Felton and forward Kurt Thomas from the Portland Trail Blazers in exchange for forward Jared Jeffries, center Dan Gadzuric, a 2016 second-round pick, the rights to Georgios Printezis and Kostas Papanikolaou, plus cash considerations.

How would he have moved us up 3 spots in the lottery in a good draft?

 

[magnifier661]

Are you forgetting the disaster of a season he had just completed here? This is the haul we got for him:
New York acquired guard Raymond Felton and forward Kurt Thomas from the Portland Trail Blazers in exchange for forward Jared Jeffries, center Dan Gadzuric, a 2016 second-round pick, the rights to Georgios Printezis and Kostas Papanikolaou, plus cash considerations.

How would he have moved us up 3 spots in the lottery in a good draft?

Felton played well on the back half of the season. The trade you mentioned were New York giving us picks and players. We would give them Felton + our 11th pick.

 

[PapaG]

Challenging for a title. I think we would be in even better position with selecting Drummond instead of Leonard (two picks ahead of him)...

Drummond makes less money AND is younger.

How exactly could the Blazers have drafted Drummond? Also, as good as he is on the boards, he is a 38% FT shooter, and can't be on the court late in games as an offensive option. The two FTs he missed against the Blazers basically cost Detroit the game.

 

[magnifier661]

How exactly could the Blazers have drafted Drummond? Also, as good as he is on the boards, he is a 38% FT shooter, and can't be on the court late in games as an offensive option. The two FTs he missed against the Blazers basically cost Detroit the game.

Yes his FT% is absolutely horrible, but he makes up for it with all the defense and rebounding.

 

[Blazer Fanatic]

How would it be worse? Could still get Mo and Dorrell last summer. JJ Hickson could have been resigned. Freeland would still be here. No Robinson but with JJ in the fold we'd be better off. Only real loss is CJ McCollum but since he isn't playing atm anyways we wouldn't have lost anything from what we've seen so far. The real loss would be Robin Lopez (never thought I'd say that before the season!) but Hibbert more than makes up for that

No, Hickson could not have been resigned because no way was Portland going to offer him a 3 year contract to play back up PF. Either no Wright or no Mo, no TReb, and definitely no CJ. It's CBA stuff. Is that worth Hibbert for Lopez? Up for debate, but what isn't a debate is that our bench would be lacking more than it is now.

It's not about the money, money, money...

[video=youtube;dRgs2Cgn7I0]

Wait... yes it is.

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

How exactly could the Blazers have drafted Drummond? Also, as good as he is on the boards, he is a 38% FT shooter, and can't be on the court late in games as an offensive option. The two FTs he missed against the Blazers basically cost Detroit the game.

By moving up in the draft. I would have even done Felton+Elliot+11th pick

 

[ponderguy]

No, Hickson could not have been resigned because no way was Portland going to offer him a 3 year contract to play back up PF. Either no Wright or no Mo, no TReb, and definitely no CJ. It's CBA stuff. Is that worth Hibbert for Lopez? Up for debate, but what isn't a debate is that our bench would be lacking more than it is now.

The money wouldn't have been an issue since we had bird rights for Hickson and would have already had Hibbert so we didn't need much money last summer for two of our bigger pickups. Mo Williams signed a vet minimum deal, he is joining under either scenario. Hickson is making ~$5 million a year, which is a very fair deal for his skillset and for a good backup big. I already discounted T Rob but he is worse than JJ so win in that dept. For me the argument comes down to
if we get hibbert then we can bring in/resign JJ, Mo & Dorell
vs
Lose JJ and sign/trade for Lopez, T Rob, Mo, CJ, Dorell

 

[tlongII]

Challenging for a title. I think we would be in even better position with selecting Drummond instead of Leonard (two picks ahead of him)...

Drummond makes less money AND is younger.

Drummond was picked before Leonard.

 

[tlongII]

And Drummond makes more money than Leonard.

 

[ponderguy]

Felton played well on the back half of the season. The trade you mentioned were New York giving us picks and players. We would give them Felton + our 11th pick.

The reason I brought up the trade was because it showed Felton's value to a team that was in desperate need for a PG, much like Toronto was. If all Ray brought back from NY was a 2nd round pick, some euro stash guys and a couple of washed up bigs then how could Ray have moved us up in the lottery by 3 spots? I think it would have taken at least Wes + #11 to get up to #8. People don't give up 3 spots in the lottery for this kind of production:
Year G MPG PPG RPG APG SPG BPG TOPG FG% 3P% FT%
09-10 CHA 80 33.0 12.1 3.6 5.6 1.5 0.3 2.1 .459 .385 .763
10-11 NYK/DEN 75 36.5 15.5 3.6 8.3 1.7 0.1 2.9 .425 .353 .805
11-12 POR 60 31.8 11.4 2.5 6.5 1.3 0.2 2.8 .407 .305 .806
Career 534 34.8 13.4 3.3 6.7 1.4 0.2 2.6 .412 .330 .787

 

[B-Roy]

No, Hickson could not have been resigned because no way was Portland going to offer him a 3 year contract to play back up PF. Either no Wright or no Mo, no TReb, and definitely no CJ. It's CBA stuff. Is that worth Hibbert for Lopez? Up for debate, but what isn't a debate is that our bench would be lacking more than it is now.

Wright signed for 3 million, Mo for 2.56. If they signed Hibbert, they would have a $5 million MLE and a $1.9 million bi-annual exception. They can't be combined, but I'm confident they could have signed both Wright and Mo, with some money leftover for someone else.

Obviously no TRob because they can't absorb his contract.

No CJ because the Blazers would have been a better team. Our pick would have went to Charlotte. We would still have Crabbe and possibly Withey. (Both might be able to play)

Hibbert is a lot better than Lopez though, especially defensively. Hibbert is arguably the best center in the league if you consider defensive impact and would make us instant contenders.

The team is 21-4 right now, with TRob as the 9th man and CJ not even playing. I shudder to think how good we would be with Hibbert instead of Lopez. (And that's not a knock on Robin)