He is a prophet whether you recognize him as such or not. God has always given his word through prophets, He holds all who hear his words accountable. You don't tell God who his prophets are. BTW MST3k might just be the greatest thing to ever grace a tv screen.
What The Bible Really Says About Sex
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Sorry dude but there are millions of us who have never met Joseph Smith and we know he was a prophet, forget about all those who knew and served with him who testified of that. Do you believe the Holy Ghost can reveal truth? If Joseph was not a prophet then what of the priesthood of the old testament? Where did it go? You have no reason to dispute Joseph as a prophet, he only makes the case for Christ that much stronger. Do you believe that the Holy Ghost could tell you whether he is or isn't?
MadeFromDust
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"He's a prophet because I say so" is not a convincing argument. Thousands of people throughout history have claimed to be prophets, Joseph Smith is no different. The book of Mormon has no historical, archaeological, or geographical confirmation for anything written in it. You believe what Joseph Smith claimed and wrote alone.
And there are billions upon billions of people today and throughout history who know God is One and understand the true Gospel of Jesus Christ. I know the Holy Spirit can reveal truth, He is God. The Holy Spirit however says nothing about Smith or him revealing the truth to humanity. He doesn't make the case for Christ stronger either, he skews it. Muslims also make claims about Jesus, does that mean they are strengthening the case for Jesus too? Was Muhammad a true prophet? What gives Joseph Smith more credibility than him?
And there are billions upon billions of people today and throughout history who know God is One and understand the true Gospel of Jesus Christ. I know the Holy Spirit can reveal truth, He is God. The Holy Spirit however says nothing about Smith or him revealing the truth to humanity. He doesn't make the case for Christ stronger either, he skews it. Muslims also make claims about Jesus, does that mean they are strengthening the case for Jesus too? Was Muhammad a true prophet? What gives Joseph Smith more credibility than him?
If you truly study the bible you will see that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints bears the closest resemblance to the Church of old. Tithing, 12 Apostles, Baptism for the Dead, a Prophet, Temples, Quorum of the Seventies etc. This is not a new Church but a restored Church under the direction of Christ through his Prophet just like in the bible.
John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
John 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.
Does that sound like an end to the words of God?
John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
John 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.
Does that sound like an end to the words of God?
crowTrobot
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but someone who doesn't recognize him as a prophet isn't going to give any weight to his opinion on polygamy. not sure why you think they should.
MadeFromDust
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Please point the verses out where this is true, I have studied the Bible cover to cover and nothing has led me to believe Mormonism is anything but a cult.
And this is supposed to mean what exactly? That we will become "gods"? Sounds like it's affirming there is only one God to me.
Jesus is an eternal being, He is God. If we were to write everything He's done the whole universe couldn't fit the books written about Him. It doesn't mean that there are pieces of the Gospel missing from the Bible that a sole prophet will reveal to less than 1% of the world in the latter days.
No, that sounds like the end of the Gospel of John, an end you don't seem have much understanding of. There are over 20 books explaining the nature of God and salvation after the book of John.
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Notice how it says "many things that Jesus did", it doesn't say and Paul wrote a bunch of epistles as did John and Peter. It says many things that Jesus did, he was long gone when this was written was he not? Everything after the gospels is the continued teaching of the Apostles, Jesus was no longer among them. How can a book that testifies of Christ be wrong? The Book of Mormon testifies of the truth of the Bible, they can either both be true or both be false.
MadeFromDust
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So because it testifies of Jesus that automatically makes it the Word of God and the true Gospel, even though it contradicts the Bible in numerous areas? What if I sat down and wrote a book tonight and claimed it to be the third and final testament of Jesus Christ? And that it testifies of Jesus so it can’t be wrong! Point is there is no reason whatsoever to believe what the book of Mormon says. The Bible in its entirety was written by 44 different authors over some 1,600 years on three different continents and in three different languages, yet it has withstood the test of time and challenges of nonbelievers. It is flawless in the message it delivers and reading it as a whole you would swear it were done by one author (hmmmm…). Not to mention it’s actually backed by history, archaeology , geology etc etc… no other holy book in the history of the world can come close to saying the same. Not the Qur’an, Mormon book, or any other so-called holy book that was written by one author in a matter of a few years.
LameR
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OdenRoyLMA2 throwin' DOOOOOOOWN!
But yeah JET, I respect people's ability to believe what they want, but you are not convincing by any means. And honestly it sounds like your trying to bend Scripture and Jesus to suit your doctrine rather than making your doctrine around the Scripture and Jesus.
But yeah JET, I respect people's ability to believe what they want, but you are not convincing by any means. And honestly it sounds like your trying to bend Scripture and Jesus to suit your doctrine rather than making your doctrine around the Scripture and Jesus.
BLAZER PROPHET
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Nope read the Bible carefully and you'll find everything we do in there. We don't need to bend anything because our doctrine is based on scripture. Do you pay tithing? Abraham paid tithing. Why is our Church the only church with 12 Apostles? The quorum of the 70 is found in the Gospels. Read the Bible and you'll know that Joseph was a Prophet.
sole prophet? 1% of the world? So why do we send missionaries across the globe, why do we have a succession of prophets? If your church doesn't send out missionaries you are not a christian church because Christ explicitly instructs us to preach the gospel to every corner of the world. Why is the Book of Mormon translated into hundreds of languages if it is only meant for 1% of the world?
Shooter
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Where does the Bible talk about baptism for the dead?
Glad you asked.
1 Corinthians 15:29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? This is Paul explaining the resurrection and it's purpose and the reason why they did baptisms for the dead in those days as we do them now.
1 Corinthians 15:29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead? This is Paul explaining the resurrection and it's purpose and the reason why they did baptisms for the dead in those days as we do them now.
ABM
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I've seen all this ABM and it doesn't add up. So now we don't need baptism? Why then was Christ of all people baptized by John the Baptist? Why does Catholicism baptize infants? We need to decide if baptism is important or not it seems.
ABM
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Sure, I was baptized. Our church baptizes believers (on their own volition) all the time. The Scriptures say nothing about "proxy" baptisms (for others), though.
Another reference for baptism for the dead and the family history work that is central to the LDS Church. Any thoughts on this?
Malachi Chapter 4
5 ¶Behold, I will asend you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:
6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
Now what is this referring to and when does Elijah return?
Malachi Chapter 4
5 ¶Behold, I will asend you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:
6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
Now what is this referring to and when does Elijah return?
TripTango
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The Bible: quite possibly the greatest Rorschach test ever made.
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ABM
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As an act of obedience to his Father, God, Christ was baptized by John the Baptist. I'm a follower of Christ.
While the act of baptizing certainly isn't a prerequisite for salvation (see: the thief on the cross next to Jesus), it's an outward act of obedience as a Christian. In and of itself, the dipping into the water is meaningless. What it represents, however, is the outward testimony (to those who are witnessing the event) of one's new faith commitment. It's a symbol of the cleansing/repenting of the old life (lifestyle) and coming into (represented by the lifting out of the water) a new life in Christ.
ABM do you mind me asking which faith you belong to? Baptism is meaningless? As for the thief on the cross, he has to go through the same process as all of us to gain salvation. We believe that everyone goes through the same ordinances as they are all necessary for the highest Kingdom. As you may know there are 3 degrees of glory spoken of in our doctrine, there is more than baptism needed to achieve the highest level of the highest kingdom. We believe that every single saving ordinance will be performed for everyone before final judgement. We see baptism as a literal washing away of sin and the weekly sacrament as the renewal of the baptismal covenant.
ABM
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What my inference was, the taking the dip part is a '"symbolic" act. There's nothing magical in the water, itself. As I previously mentioned, baptism is an act of faith......not a prerequisite to salvation.
I attend Mars Hill Church in SE Portland. I'm of the Christian faith.
http://portland.marshill.com/
http://marshill.com/
bigbailes
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I agree with ABM on this one. Baptism is really more a profession of faith and symbolic more than having anything to do with your salvation. It isn't a "pre-requisite" for your eternal life but is something every new christian should do as it let's others know of their commitment and those in attendance need to keep that person accountable. it's much the same as a wedding, it isn't necessary to have the big ceremony and isn't needed to be married but it's a way to show your commitment to the people you know and love and hope they help you stay accountable to the person you wed.
ABM
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Interesting, so is there anything in your opinion that does matter? Why not just say you have faith? What exactly do you think salvation is and what do you need to attain it? Are you guys works + grace guys or just grace? Baptism and Marriage have a lot more significance in the LDS church than they seem to have in much of Christendom. I really don't think Christ gave us ordinances that are meaningless nor do I believe lip service is enough to gain exhalation. There is something wrong when the doctrine of Christ becomes a matter of opinion.
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