What's your religion?

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What is your religion?

  • Catholic

    Votes: 5 9.8%
  • Other Christian

    Votes: 13 25.5%
  • Mormon

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Muslim

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Hindu

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Buddhist/Taoist/Confusionist

    Votes: 2 3.9%
  • Spiritualist?

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Atheist

    Votes: 12 23.5%
  • Agnostic

    Votes: 11 21.6%
  • Anti Organized Religion

    Votes: 8 15.7%

  • Total voters
    51
good for you. among atheists you'd be in a very small minority.

Do atheists typically meet and express their atheism to each other? Seems pointless to me, based on what atheism actually means.



you're the one making stuff up here and being pointlessly stubborn about semantics. you should research the origin and history of the word beyond that MMO quote. the defintion of atheism has always been used fluidly by philosophers, and almost every modern reference lists simple lack of belief as a valid definition. in fact if you want to base things on tradition, by lumping everyone who isn't 100% certain the existence of any god is impossible into agnosticism you're using a much too loose defintion.

I didn't lump everybody together. You just don't fit the category of "atheist", in its truest sense.


you're confused. atheism isn't a set of beliefs. it's lack of belief.

Um, no it isn't. It's a belief that there is no possibility of any supernatural entity. A belief that there is no God. You're confusing atheism with being agnostic again. Perhaps you should reevaluate your core beliefs.
 
"What is atheism?" is usually the one question never asked of most atheists. Most people do not ask this question because they already have their own ideas about what atheism is and what atheists are. Where these ideas originate vary.

Older dictionaries define atheism as "a belief that there is no God" and/or "denial of God." Some dictionaries go further and say that atheism is "wickedness," "sinfulness," "heathenism," "paganism," and "immorality." Some dictionaries even say that atheism is the "doctrine that there is no God." At least The American Heritage ® Dictionary says "God and gods" after the word "doctrine," but that does not detract from the fact that use of the word doctrine is incorrect.

The fact that the dictionary's definition uses the phrase "there is no God" betrays the theistic influence in defining the word atheism. If dictionaries did not contain such influence, then the definition would read, "A belief that there are no gods." The use of god in singular form, with a capital G, is indicative of Christian influence.

In addition, using words like "doctrine" and "denial" betray the negativity seen of atheists by theistic writers. Atheism does not have a doctrine at all and atheists certainly do not "deny" that gods exist. Denial is the "refusal to believe." Atheism does not "know there is a god but refuse to believe in him" (or her). That would be like saying that you know Big Foot exists but you refuse to believe in him. If the evidence of gods was insurmountable and provable, and atheists still refused to believe, then that would be an act of denial.

Speaking of the original meaning, the word atheism comes from the Greek atheos, which means "without god." The original meaning of the word, based on its Greek origins, mentions nothing about "disbelief" or "denial." A short and single-word definition would be "godless."

http://www.atheists.org/atheism/About_Atheism
 
Do atheists typically meet and express their atheism to each other? Seems pointless to me, based on what atheism actually means.





I didn't lump everybody together. You just don't fit the category of "atheist", in its truest sense.




Um, no it isn't. It's a belief that there is no possibility of any supernatural entity. A belief that there is no God. You're confusing atheism with being agnostic again. Perhaps you should reevaluate your core beliefs.



restating what you believe over and over also doesn't strengthen your argument.
 
Many people who adopt the label of agnostic reject the label of atheist — there is a common perception that agnosticism is a more “reasonable” position while atheism is more “dogmatic,” ultimately indistinguishable from theism except in the details. This is not a valid position to adopt because it misrepresents or misunderstands everything involved: atheism, theism, agnosticism, and the nature of belief itself. It also happens to reinforce popular prejudice against atheists.

Agnostics may sincerely believe it and theists may sincerely reinforce it, but it relies upon more than one misunderstanding about both atheism and agnosticism. These misunderstandings are only exacerbated by continual social pressure and prejudice against atheism and atheists. People who are unafraid of stating that they indeed do not believe in any gods are still despised in many places, whereas “agnostic” is perceived as more respectable.

Atheists are thought to be closed-minded because they deny the existence of gods, whereas agnostics appear to be open-minded because they do not know for sure. This is a mistake because atheists do not necessarily deny any gods and may indeed be an atheist because they do not know for sure — in other words, they may be an agnostic as well.

Once it is understood that atheism is merely the absence of belief in any gods, it becomes evident that agnosticism is not, as many assume, a “third way” between atheism and theism. The presence of a belief in a god and the absence of a belief in a god exhaust all of the possibilities. Agnosticism is not about belief in god but about knowledge — it was coined originally to describe the position of a person who could not claim to know for sure if any gods exist or not.

Thus, it is clear that agnosticism is compatible with both theism and atheism. A person can believe in a god (theism) without claiming to know for sure if that god exists; the result is agnostic theism. On the other hand, a person can disbelieve in gods (atheism) without claiming to know for sure that no gods can or do exist; the result is agnostic atheism.

It is also worth noting that there is a vicious double standard involved when theists claim that agnosticism is “better” than atheism because it is less dogmatic. If atheists are closed-minded because they are not agnostic, then so are theists. On the other hand, if theism can be open-minded then so can atheism.

In the end, the fact of the matter is a person isn’t faced with the necessity of only being either an atheist or an agnostic. Quite the contrary, not only can a person be both, but it is in fact common for people to be both agnostics and atheists. An agnostic atheist won’t claim to know for sure that nothing warranting the label “god” exists or that such cannot exist, but they also don’t actively believe that such an entity does indeed exist.

http://atheism.about.com/od/aboutagnosticism/a/atheism.htm

Does that clear it up for you PapaG?
 
I simply don't include the word agnostic, because all it is for is to nice things up.
 
Many people who adopt the label of agnostic reject the label of atheist — there is a common perception that agnosticism is a more “reasonable” position while atheism is more “dogmatic,” ultimately indistinguishable from theism except in the details. This is not a valid position to adopt because it misrepresents or misunderstands everything involved: atheism, theism, agnosticism, and the nature of belief itself. It also happens to reinforce popular prejudice against atheists.

Agnostics may sincerely believe it and theists may sincerely reinforce it, but it relies upon more than one misunderstanding about both atheism and agnosticism. These misunderstandings are only exacerbated by continual social pressure and prejudice against atheism and atheists. People who are unafraid of stating that they indeed do not believe in any gods are still despised in many places, whereas “agnostic” is perceived as more respectable.

Atheists are thought to be closed-minded because they deny the existence of gods, whereas agnostics appear to be open-minded because they do not know for sure. This is a mistake because atheists do not necessarily deny any gods and may indeed be an atheist because they do not know for sure — in other words, they may be an agnostic as well.

Once it is understood that atheism is merely the absence of belief in any gods, it becomes evident that agnosticism is not, as many assume, a “third way” between atheism and theism. The presence of a belief in a god and the absence of a belief in a god exhaust all of the possibilities. Agnosticism is not about belief in god but about knowledge — it was coined originally to describe the position of a person who could not claim to know for sure if any gods exist or not.

Thus, it is clear that agnosticism is compatible with both theism and atheism. A person can believe in a god (theism) without claiming to know for sure if that god exists; the result is agnostic theism. On the other hand, a person can disbelieve in gods (atheism) without claiming to know for sure that no gods can or do exist; the result is agnostic atheism.

It is also worth noting that there is a vicious double standard involved when theists claim that agnosticism is “better” than atheism because it is less dogmatic. If atheists are closed-minded because they are not agnostic, then so are theists. On the other hand, if theism can be open-minded then so can atheism.

In the end, the fact of the matter is a person isn’t faced with the necessity of only being either an atheist or an agnostic. Quite the contrary, not only can a person be both, but it is in fact common for people to be both agnostics and atheists. An agnostic atheist won’t claim to know for sure that nothing warranting the label “god” exists or that such cannot exist, but they also don’t actively believe that such an entity does indeed exist.

http://atheism.about.com/od/aboutagnosticism/a/atheism.htm

Does that clear it up for you PapaG?

I don't reject atheism. You aren't a true atheist though, based on what you've posted in this thread.
 
I simply don't include the word agnostic, because all it is for is to nice things up.

You seem to lack the intellectual curiosity to understand the basic difference between atheism and agnosticism (if that's even a word). They are not the same thing, no matter how you want to say that they are the same thing.
 
I don't reject atheism. You aren't a true atheist though, based on what you've posted in this thread.

So apparently, atheism has different meanings to different people. It is not just me vs. you. You do not know what the word is supposed to mean, but many people call themselves atheists even though they do not claim that there being a God is impossible. I have actually never met someone who says it is impossible.
 
restating what you believe over and over also doesn't strengthen your argument.

It's not what I believe. I am posting commonly accepted definitions and how they apply to a given ideology. You are replying with nothing but your opinion. :dunno:
 
I can't know this for sure but I am pretty confident that most atheists feel the same way I feel about what atheist means. Why do you think you know what it means more than actual atheists?
 
So apparently, atheism has different meanings to different people. It is not just me vs. you. You do not know what the word is supposed to mean, but many people call themselves atheists even though they do not claim that there being a God is impossible. I have actually never met someone who says it is impossible.

Of course it does. I'm going with the generally accepted definition that even atheism.org recognizes. You seem to be shoehorning the term atheism to fit into your own hybrid of atheism.
 
Of course it does. I'm going with the generally accepted definition that even atheism.org recognizes. You seem to be shoehorning the term atheism to fit into your own hybrid of atheism.

It is not my own, it is every atheist I have ever mets. And did you not read the things I posted from atheism websites? We do not deny the possibility of a god or gods.
 
I can't know this for sure but I am pretty confident that most atheists feel the same way I feel about what atheist means. Why do you think you know what it means more than actual atheists?

I posted what atheism.org thinks atheism means and the history of what it means. I'll take that over your gut feeling on how anonymous "atheists" feel. Although if they feel as you do, I won't consider them to be true atheists either. :cheers:
 
It is not my own, it is every atheist I have ever mets. And did you not read the things I posted from atheism websites? We do not deny the possibility of a god or gods.

Then you aren't a traditional atheist, which is what I've been saying all along. I coined the term neo-atheist. I think it fits.
 
Then you aren't a traditional atheist, which is what I've been saying all along. I coined the term neo-atheist. I think it fits.

So do you accept the terms agnostic atheist and agnostic theist?
 
Your long article talks about "agnostic atheists", not true atheists.
 
Neo-atheist is fine with me, but until that becomes a universal term, I am going to stick with atheist. Agnostic just doesn't get the job done for me.
 
guys, this thread is getting off topic, I want to see Chutney's turban!!
 
Okay, so, agnostic theist vs. theist. What do religious people say about this?
 

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