Which player besides Lillard would you most be upset to see traded?

[BrianFromWA]

I think blaming coaches is lazy. I would love to see regular Blazer fans sit down with Stotts, Vanterpool, Tibbets, Osborne etc and tell them how bad they are. Funny to me.

When Nate asked Canzano what he needed to do differently (something a half-dozen of you guys in the forum here could've explained pretty professionally) the invincibility of coaches went by the wayside, if it had ever been there. When Kaleb (who's a nice guy, and who I've had a couple of conversations with on basketball) became an assistant coach (and then head coach) it was a "good for him, he put in dues" moment, but not a "dude, this guy is sooo far removed from mortals in his understanding of the game" way.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I said I find fans who think they know more than NBA coaches funny. Some players just aren’t cut out to be good NBA players. Meyers is one of them. Sit down with a GM or a coach and talk to them about what it’s like to coach 22-30 year old millionaires. What they do for them, the resources they have, the coaches who fly to their hometowns in the offseason, the film, the constant support and some just never take to it. Some really love their puppies and jeeps and taking photos of themselves shirtless.

I never said I know more than any NBA coaches. I never suggested the Blazers hire me as their big man coach. So, why don't we try to focus less on me and more on the issue?

It is a fact that their are big men coaches out there who have a proven track record of "coaching up" young big men. We used to have one on our payroll until he was fired for something unrelated to his job performance.

It is also a fact that we currently have 5 big men on our roster that are 25 and younger. All five were first round picks and three were lottery picks.

This is where opinion enters the equation. I am personally disappointed in the development of the three young bigs that have been here the longest: Meyers Leonard, Noah Vonleh and Jusuf Nurkic. I feel our coaching staff has done a poor job developing these three players.

The jury is still out on the two 20-year old rookies, but given the development arcs of the other three, I am not optimistic the two rookies will reach their full potential.

You used this thread as an opportunity to take a cheap shot at Meyers Leonard. I get it, bashing Meyers is a favorite forum pastime and he's an easy target. However, in this case, you're off the mark.

Meyers was making progress under Kim Hughes. His defense and rebounding were both improving. At the time he made the comments that got him fired, Hughes was, in fact working with Meyers, during the off season, in Illinois.

After Hughes was fired, Meyers immediately went into a tailspin. Meyers was never going to be an all star, but during the previous season, and especially the playoffs series against MEM, at least he looked like he could be one a decent 8th or 9th man. Instead, he regressed and the season following Hughes' dismissal was the worst of Meyers' career and he's never gotten back to where he once was. Blame it all on Meyers if you wish, but history shows when we had a proven big man coach, Meyers was making progress and without a big man coach, he regressed.

If a proven big man coach can help Meyers, imagine what one could do with Nurk, Collins, Vonleh and Swanigan. Worst case, what does it hurt to try? What do we have to lose by hiring a proven big man coach?

BNM

 

[riverman]

I never said I know more than any NBA coaches. I never suggested the Blazers hire me as their big man coach. So, why don't we try to focus less on me and more on the issue?

It is a fact that their are big men coaches out there who have a proven track record of "coaching up" young big men. We used to have one on our payroll until he was fired for something unrelated to his job performance.

It is also a fact that we currently have 5 big men on our roster that are 25 and younger. All five were first round picks and three were lottery picks.

This is where opinion enters the equation. I am personally disappointed in the development of the three young bigs that have been here the longest: Meyers Leonard, Noah Vonleh and Jusuf Nurkic. I feel our coaching staff has done a poor job developing these three players.

The jury is still out on the two 20-year old rookies, but given the development arcs of the other three, I am not optimistic the two rookies will reach their full potential.

You used this thread as an opportunity to take a cheap shot at Meyers Leonard. I get it, bashing Meyers is a favorite forum pastime and he's an easy target. However, in this case, you're off the mark.

Meyers was making progress under Kim Hughes. His defense and rebounding were both improving. At the time he made the comments that got him fired, Hughes was, in fact working with Meyers, during the off season, in Illinois.

After Hughes was fired, Meyers immediately went into a tailspin. Meyers was never going to be an all star, but during the previous season, and especially the playoffs series against MEM, at least he looked like he could be one a decent 8th or 9th man. Instead, he regressed and the season following Hughes' dismissal was the worst of Meyers' career and he's never gotten back to where he once was. Blame it all on Meyers if you wish, but history shows when we had a proven big man coach, Meyers was making progress and without a big man coach, he regressed.

If a proven big man coach can help Meyers, imagine what one could do with Nurk, Collins, Vonleh and Swanigan. Worst case, what does it hurt to try? What do we have to lose by hiring a proven big man coach?

BNM

I agree we could use a big man coach but it's not Stotts fault Meyers has a slow motion brain....Meyers hired a coach this off season...Noah I think it's a matter of maturity as well...Noah plays better like anybody with minutes so we have a small sample size to see what he can do now

 

[Boob-No-More]

I agree we could use a big man coach but it's not Stotts fault Meyers has a slow motion brain....Meyers hired a coach this off season...Noah I think it's a matter of maturity as well...Noah plays better like anybody with minutes so we have a small sample size to see what he can do now

Meyers is the least of my concerns. Just pointing out that even he was making progress under Kim Hughes.

I'm much more concerned with Nurkic and Collins, and to a lesser extent, Swanigan. The future of this franchise rides on the shoulders of the first two. I want to see Paul hire the best big man coach money can buy to work with these two.

BNM

 

[calvin natt]

The fact that Meyers went into a years long tailspin (according to you) when Kim Hughes was fired tells us a lot about his mental toughness and willingness to develop into a big man. Meyers wants to be on the perimeter - another fact. Why didn’t he use the unbelievable tutelage he got from Hughes and carry it on? He just let it all go and took nothing from it? As I have written multiple times, I am not opposed to a “big man coach”. I do however think it is an easy excuse for relieving the players of responsibility because I think they are in fact getting coaching and being told what and how to do their job.

 

[Boob-No-More]

The fact that Meyers went into a years long tailspin (according to you) when Kim Hughes was fired tells us a lot about his mental toughness and willingness to develop into a big man. Meyers wants to be on the perimeter - another fact. Why didn’t he use the unbelievable tutelage he got from Hughes and carry it on? He just let it all go and took nothing from it? As I have written multiple times, I am not opposed to a “big man coach”. I do however think it is an easy excuse for relieving the players of responsibility because I think they are in fact getting coaching and being told what and how to do their job.

Stop focusing on Meyers. At this point he is a lost cause. It wasn't Hughes that moved him to the perimeter, it was Stotts. And, it's not like he was Hughes' star pupil. Hughes has an excellent record of coaching up other big men, but he's just one example of a proven big man coach.

Being told what and how to do their jobs is not the same as teaching someone the specific, and often subtle, skills required to master their position. Hire a proven big man coach, and if the players don't improve, I will concede that it's the players' fault.

BNM

 

[tlongII]

I said I find fans who think they know more than NBA coaches funny. Some players just aren’t cut out to be good NBA players. Meyers is one of them. Sit down with a GM or a coach and talk to them about what it’s like to coach 22-30 year old millionaires. What they do for them, the resources they have, the coaches who fly to their hometowns in the offseason, the film, the constant support and some just never take to it. Some really love their puppies and jeeps and taking photos of themselves shirtless.

I don’t know more than the coaches, but I do know when they need help. This staff needs help with big man coaching.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I don’t know more than the coaches, but I do know when they need help. This staff needs help with big man coaching.

And this shouldn't be a Stotts' decision. It should be a Paul Allen decision. He is the one investing hundreds of millions of dollars is these young big men, some of whom may be around many years after Terry Stotts' is gone.

This isn't about in game coaching, calling plays and juggling lineups. This is about player development.

BNM

 

[tlongII]

And this shouldn't be a Stotts' decision. It should be a Paul Allen decision. He is the one investing hundreds of millions of dollars is these young big men, some of whom may be around many years after Terry Stotts' is gone.

This isn't about in game coaching, calling plays and juggling lineups. This is about player development.

BNM

Agreed, but that may be part of the problem. I’m not sure Paul will recognize the need.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Agreed, but that may be part of the problem. I’m not sure Paul will recognize the need.

Well, hopefully one of the Vulcans will point it out to him. It seems logical.

BNM

 

[tester551]

I do however think it is an easy excuse for relieving the players of responsibility because I think they are in fact getting coaching and being told what and how to do their job.

There is a big difference between being TOLD and SHOWN what to do

To effectively show a player what to do, the coach needs some practical experience.

 

[calvin natt]

There is a big difference between being TOLD and SHOWN what to do

To effectively show a player what to do, the coach needs some practical experience.

Hence, “how”

 

[tester551]

Hence, “how”

I can tell you 'how' to do a job without showing you a damn thing.

 

[calvin natt]

I can tell you 'how' to do a job without showing you a damn thing.

Yeah they probably just sit in a chair and send in hand signals

 

[Orion Bailey]

Wouldn't care if any of them went

True fan right there.....

I realize you disagree, many do. Until someone is able to tell me that the coaching staff isn't giving quality coaching, I blame players. if they are not accepting it or think they should be shooting 3's or they are 'all good thanks coach', then its on them.

Who coaches the Celtics big men? Rockets? Clippers?

Wait though... so you think that if a Coach coaches a player to do one thing and the player does something else on the court, it isn't the coaches responsibility to get the player to fix that shit or get rid of him?

By your reasoning, why have coaches and why not just let the players coach themselves since its all on them?

The facts are this... much of the time, our big men are not in the right spots(Ed and Collins are exceptions), not finishing well at the rim.

IF a coach tells a player to do one thing and the player does another it isn't on the player, its on the coach.

Players will always be in it for stats and fame (good ones understand the sacrifice of this to be part of a winning team), but all of them want to be the best. Some of them don't know what it takes to be the best and if they don't listen to the coach, then the coach needs to change the message until it sinks in. That's what coaching is all about.

 

[calvin natt]

How many DNP-CD’s does Meyers have this year? Noah? Coaches don’t get to “get rid” of a guy.

 

[Orion Bailey]

How many DNP-CD’s does Meyers have this year? Noah? Coaches don’t get to “get rid” of a guy.

Yes they do. If a front office is one with he coaching staff, and they should be, then its up to Stotts to let the team know this guy wll not fit with our game, or to tell the front office, the player isn't listening. Its then up to the front office to get rid of the guy.

Do you think Pop doesn't go to the front office and let them know a player is or isnt coachable?
Do you not think that NO and Stotts meet up and discuss these things?

Also a DNP is getting rid of a guy.

IF a player isnt listening to the coach then its on the coach to bench his ass.... get rid of him.

You are stuck on Meyers, so lets continue with him. And how I will continue is to tell you what BNM said about him and Hughes's departure respectively.

Your response was that Meyers should have took what he learned and continued to excel.
You also admitted some players just don't get it and aren't cut out for the NBA.
So which is it? Meyers should be playing better on his own because he has the skills to figure it out, or he is not cut out for the nba?

Either way, would not a big man coach help to figure this out?

Secondly, I think EVERYONES problem is we don't want to see this same regression in our new young bigs.

The improvements are far and few between for any of our big men over the last couple years. This isn't all the players.

You are right in that some players are not meant for the NBA.
So Nurk, VOnleh, Meyers, all not NBA calibre?

IF they ARE NBA caliber, but don't have the mental skills to improve on their own, then why not get them a big man coach?

Its really not that difficult to understand this.... unless you are saying NONE of our big men are fit for today's NBA.....

I also like how you cherry picked one sentence and did not address the substance of my post....

How about we put it into other terms.

A child genius.
Smarter than all his peers in school.... will STILL GO TO SCHOOL TO IMPROVE.....but will just look for better teachers....

 

[calvin natt]

Yes they do. If a front office is one with he coaching staff, and they should be, then its up to Stotts to let the team know this guy wll not fit with our game, or to tell the front office, the player isn't listening. Its then up to the front office to get rid of the guy.

Do you think Pop doesn't go to the front office and let them know a player is or isnt coachable?
Do you not think that NO and Stotts meet up and discuss these things?

Also a DNP is getting rid of a guy.

IF a player isnt listening to the coach then its on the coach to bench his ass.... get rid of him.

You are stuck on Meyers, so lets continue with him. And how I will continue is to tell you what BNM said about him and Hughes's departure respectively.

Your response was that Meyers should have took what he learned and continued to excel.
You also admitted some players just don't get it and aren't cut out for the NBA.
So which is it? Meyers should be playing better on his own because he has the skills to figure it out, or he is not cut out for the nba?

Either way, would not a big man coach help to figure this out?

Secondly, I think EVERYONES problem is we don't want to see this same regression in our new young bigs.

The improvements are far and few between for any of our big men over the last couple years. This isn't all the players.

You are right in that some players are not meant for the NBA.
So Nurk, VOnleh, Meyers, all not NBA calibre?

IF they ARE NBA caliber, but don't have the mental skills to improve on their own, then why not get them a big man coach?

Its really not that difficult to understand this.... unless you are saying NONE of our big men are fit for today's NBA.....

I also like how you cherry picked one sentence and did not address the substance of my post....

How about we put it into other terms.

A child genius.
Smarter than all his peers in school.... will STILL GO TO SCHOOL TO IMPROVE.....but will just look for better teachers....

Your first paragraph sounds nice but is also LaLa land. And Meyers is a prime example of it. Coaches and GMs don’t agree on players every single day.

 

[Mediocre Man]

True fan right there.....



Wait though... so you think that if a Coach coaches a player to do one thing and the player does something else on the court, it isn't the coaches responsibility to get the player to fix that shit or get rid of him?

By your reasoning, why have coaches and why not just let the players coach themselves since its all on them?

The facts are this... much of the time, our big men are not in the right spots(Ed and Collins are exceptions), not finishing well at the rim.

IF a coach tells a player to do one thing and the player does another it isn't on the player, its on the coach.

Players will always be in it for stats and fame (good ones understand the sacrifice of this to be part of a winning team), but all of them want to be the best. Some of them don't know what it takes to be the best and if they don't listen to the coach, then the coach needs to change the message until it sinks in. That's what coaching is all about.

I'm assuming you are mocking me about being a true fan. Ironic since I'm rooting for the name on the front of the jersey.

But ya, all those feels with the do good stories

 

[H.C.]

Wait though... so you think that if a Coach coaches a player to do one thing and the player does something else on the court, it isn't the coaches responsibility to get the player to fix that shit or get rid of him?

By your reasoning, why have coaches and why not just let the players coach themselves since its all on them?

The facts are this... much of the time, our big men are not in the right spots(Ed and Collins are exceptions), not finishing well at the rim.

IF a coach tells a player to do one thing and the player does another it isn't on the player, its on the coach.

Players will always be in it for stats and fame (good ones understand the sacrifice of this to be part of a winning team), but all of them want to be the best. Some of them don't know what it takes to be the best and if they don't listen to the coach, then the coach needs to change the message until it sinks in. That's what coaching is all about.

OB, do you remember a game last year before Plumlee got traded.
The other team called a timeout to set a last play to win the game.
Portland came out and gave up the winning basket. allowing the inbounds pass to go to the rim.
This board, talking ball, twitter, facebook and every other SM was all over Stotts for not putting a big on the inbounds pass with so little time left.
Only when Quick came into talking ball and said. 'Stotts wanted Plumlee on the inbounds pass, but it just didn't happen.'

Sometimes coaches can talk until their blue in the face and players don't listen. That's on the players, not the coach.
It's on the coach if he doesn't bench said player.

Stotts has benched Nurk multiple times for not taking advantage of a matchup this year...
I mean shit he played 17 minutes last game because right after a timeout. According to Brooke 'Stotts looked right at Nurk during the timeout and said, you have to take advantage of Harrison Barnes when he's switched onto you.' Very next possession Nurk turned it over and Davis was summoned to get Nurk out.
Stotts has also benched Vonleh, and Harkless this year. Harkless is obvious, Vonleh is mostlikely due to a rookie playing better than him on both ends.

As far as bigs not finishing at the rim. All of the Portland bigs lack basic footwork, so they are off balance 90% of the time when they go to finish at the rim.
Lillard had this issue early in his career also, but that has changed.

 

[MarAzul]

I see no reason to be upset trading anyone on this team. I would like to see a team play like they might become contenders. If a trade could do this, wonderful.

 

[stampedehero]

CJ For Sure.

 

[Mr. Robot]

CJ For Sure.

you misspelled Nurkic

 

[Orion Bailey]

Let it bake?

 

[stampedehero]

you misspelled Nurkic

What??!

 

[Orion Bailey]

What??!

Nurk is God to him.
I got it. Read more of his posts. Some are funny!

 

[SIeepwalker]

Nurk is God to him.
I got it. Read more of his posts. Some are funny!

most are not

 

[andalusian]

you misspelled Nurkic

-1

Am I doing it right?

 

[stampedehero]

Let it bake?

Nurk is God to him.
I got it. Read more of his posts. Some are funny!

The first thing to be is relevant. This may brighten things.

 

[Scalma]

Easily Nurkic. Everyone complains about his offense, but he still makes an impact defensively. He’s also got the highest ceiling. He shows flashes of being an elite center, which to me is still the most valuable position on the court outside of maybe PG. Despite all his “inconsistencies,” Nurkic has neutralized or outplayed pretty much every traditional center in the league this season.

I see and appreciate his value, but CJ is useless when not scoring. I’d trade him before Nurkic AND Collins.