Why not Shavlik?

[Boob-No-More]

Why not put Shavlik on the active roster (in place of Ike) and give him a few minutes at back-up power forward?

After accusing other posters of being overly negative, I won't be too hard on Channing and Ike, but they aren't getting the job done.

After the way Channing finished last season, I had high hopes for him backing-up LaMarcus this season, Last year, due to Oden's injury, Channing spent most of his minutes playing out of position at center. This year, with Oden and Przybilla manning the center position, I thought Channing would excel at his natural position, power forward, with the second unit. It hasn't really worked out that well.

Ike is exactly what I expected. When a guy can't get minutes on bad teams, there's no reason to expect he'll deserve minutes on a good team. Every time he touches the ball, you know he's going to force up a bad shot. He has zero assists for the season, and a TS% of 0.308. Ironically, his rebounding has picked up lately, but it's almost all offensive rebounds of his his own missed/blocked shots.

In preseason, Shavlick played well, brought a lot of energy and seemed to mesh well with his teammates. I thought he deserved the 15th roster spot, would be a good practice player and an adequate extra big to hold down the 12th spot in case of an injury.

With Frye and Diogu struggling, why not give Shavlik a shot. Seriously, neither Frye nor Diogu are playing big minutes. And, they aren't really effective when they do play. How much can it hurt to give Shavlik their minutes for a game or two? At the very least, I think he'd bring more energy than Frye or Diogu. And, I think it will send a message - hustle and work hard and you'll be rewarded.

We keep reading quotes from Nate about a shake-up, but let's face it, he's reluctant to mess with the top 8 or 9 guys in the rotation. Activating Shavlik and giving him a couple minutes of PT will get the other guys' attention without impacting the top of the rotation. If it doesn't work, you'd still have one of Frye or Diogu on the bench next to him. Seems like a low risk chance to take, and who knows, it might actually improve our back-up power forward situation. All we really need is a little energy and some rebounding from that spot, and I think Shavlik would give us that - and least more of that than we are currently getting from Frye and Diogu.

BNM

 

[bluefrog]

This article came out today

 

[blue32]

I'm all about letting the unknowns getting a shot. Ike and Shav for sure. I just remember how long ZBO and JO stayed on the bench and then eventually turned into pretty good players.

 

[Nate4Prez]

S-bo deserves a shot just as much, if not more than Frye, cause we have seen what Frye can do.

 

[Stepping Razor]

Because he's crap?

 

[Boob-No-More]

Because he's crap?

And Diogu isn't? In what way could Shavlik possibly be worse than Ike? For his career, Shavlik is a better rebounder. Ike is shooting 0.308 from the field and makes Zach Randolph look like a good defender and a capable passer. Ike has ZERO assists and ZERO steals.

Shavlik looked decent in preseason - totally outplayed Ike. Frye had his chance. Diogu has had his. Neither have done very well. So, now it's time to give Shavlik a turn.

Seriously, what could it hurt? If by some miracle he's actually worse than Ike, he can go back to being the 15th man and sitting at the end of the bench in street clothes.

BNM

 

[blue32]

^ IDK, Ike didn't have as much play time as Frye, but I bet if he did, he'd do well. I would love to see both S-Bo and Ike get some good minutes...

 

[Boob-No-More]

^ IDK, Ike didn't have as much play time as Frye, but I bet if he did, he'd do well.

Do well at what? Every time he touches the ball you know he's going to force up a bad shot. He plays poor defense and doesn't even look to pass. Seeing the ball go into him reminds me of of the old Zach Randolph days - only Zach was a much more capable scorer and would occasionally look to pass out of the triple teams.

Ike is just flat out bad. He couldn't get minutes on lottery teams in Golden State or Indiana, and he's certainly done nothing to warrant minutes on a play-off contending team here in Portland.

Shavlik out played him in all ways during the preseason. I know it's only preseason, but Shavlik shot the ball better, rebounded better and turned the ball over less than Ike. So, why is Ike ahead of him in the rotation?

Preseason:

Ike Diogu - 14.1 pts, 6.3 reb and 6.3 TO per 36 minutes on 0.400 FG% - that's right, Ike has as many TOs as reb in the preseason.

Shavlik Randolph - 15.0 pts, 8.9 reb and 3.2 TO per 36 minutes on 0.538 FG%.

From watching the preseason games, Shavlik brought more energy, played smarter and produced better results than Ike. It won't make a lot of difference, but I do think Shavlik deserves a chance given how poorly Ike has played.

BNM

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

Free SBO!

 

[rocketeer]

shavlik wasn't even good at duke. and he hasn't done anything in the nba either.

ike and frye have both proven to be much better players than shavlik at the nba level. it's a better idea to let them play through their struggles or look for an upgrade than play a worse player just because he haven't played for the blazers yet.

 

[craigehlo]

From watching the preseason games, Shavlik brought more energy, played smarter and produced better results than Ike. It won't make a lot of difference, but I do think Shavlik deserves a chance given how poorly Ike has played.

I agree about Shavlik's energy. He also seemed not to take shots that were as ill-advised at Ike or Frye. I like to see an energy guy that knows his strengths and plays to them.

 

[Ed O]

Ike is crap? I don't think so. He's an effective offensive player. He's only shot 30% from the field this season, but given the type of shots he was taking (and, in many cases, CREATING by getting offensive rebounds) there is no way it would stay that low. He gets to the line and he is a reasonably good shotblocker.

There's simply no reason to give Shavlik a chance when we haven't even given Ike--a far superior talent and player--one.

Why Frye is still playing is beyond me.

Ed O.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

Didn't Shavlik score 19 on 9 of 9 shooting in pre-season? Or was that summer league?

Anyway, I'm all for activating Shavlik for a few games to give him a try. He seems like an Ime Udoka/Viktor Krhyappa in the "overachieving stiff" mold.

That said, I'd much rather see Frye and Bayless together in the bench unit instead. I noticed that, when the bench unit (Ike/Frye, Joel, Travis, Rudy, Sergio) is in the game, we only have 3 legitimate shooters. Our starting lineup has 4 legit guys who can score if passed the ball (5 when Webster returns). When Sergio starts the offense at 12 seconds left, and the defense stops the guy he passes to, we're sunk. Let's say Rudy gets doubled and passes it back to Sergio. Sergio then has 5 seconds to dump it to another guy who can shoot who also isn't Rudy. That leaves Travis or Frye shooting a jumper as time expires.

In the starting lineup, if Roy's doubled, he can pass back to Blake, who can and will shoot the open shot, and can make it at a decent clip.

Anyway, I think the worst part of our bench play, specifically a guy like Frye, is that he's Sergio's bailout. Frye will get the ball in a bad position because Sergio can't shoot and there's only 3 on the shot clock. He misses, and looks bad. Same with Ike. Get a legitimate scorer running the point, and suddenly you have a decent number of options. It's much harder to defend 4 scoring threats than 3.

So, fixing our backup PF problem might be as simple as chaning the number of options we have on the bench, since either of our backup PFs will likely play batter as option #4 instead of option #3.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Ike is crap? I don't think so. He's an effective offensive player. He's only shot 30% from the field this season, but given the type of shots he was taking (and, in many cases, CREATING by getting offensive rebounds) there is no way it would stay that low. He gets to the line and he is a reasonably good shotblocker.

He also shot 0.400 in preseason. And he's NOT creating his own shots by getting offensive rebounds. Both of his offensive rebounds in the Denver game came when he got his shot blocked right back in his face.

He has a grand total of 2 BLK this season. He's had his own shot blocked 4 times. He's not a good shot blocker. Shavlik actually has a higher career BLK% than Ike (and a higher STL% and a higher AST% and a lower TOV%).

And again ZERO assists and ZERO steals for Ike so far this season. I wonder what the NBA record is for most consectutives games without an assist. Ike's currently at 13 and counting.

There's simply no reason to give Shavlik a chance when we haven't even given Ike--a far superior talent and player--one.

I disagree. Shavlik, today, is a better player than Ike. Shavlik outplayed him in preseason and is a better defender and better rebounder. Prior to his season ending ankle injury in 2006-07, Shavlik has worked his way into the starting line-up in Philadelphia.

Ike scores more becuase that's all he does. He doesn't pass the ball and he plays awful defense. In a back-up power forward, especially with Outlaw and Rudy taking most of the shots, I'd like to see some energy, rebounding and defense. Not some guy who forces up a bad shot everytime he touches the ball.

Why Frye is still playing is beyond me.

Because, as bad as he's been playing, Frye is still better than Diogu.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

Didn't Shavlik score 19 on 9 of 9 shooting in pre-season? Or was that summer league?

It was preseason. Shavlik wasn't on our Summer League team. In less than 20 minutes against Atlanta, he had 19 points on 9 - 9 shooting, 10 rebounds and 3 blocks.

In three preseason games, he averaged 12.3 PPG, 8.9 RPG and 2.3 BPG on 0.538 FG%

In six preseason games, Ike averaged 4.5 PPG, 2.0 RPG and 1.2 BPG on 0.400 FG%

Yeah, it was preseason and a small sample size, but it's pretty clear that Shavlik totally outplayed Ike in preseason.

BNM

 

[ehizzy3]

wasnt shavlik pretty decent for philly before he got hurt?

 

[Boob-No-More]

wasnt shavlik pretty decent for philly before he got hurt?

He's never been a good offensive player, but he was a good rebounder and defender prior to his injury. Based on his preseason performance (all we have to base anything on at this point), that hasn't changed.

BNM

 

[ehizzy3]

He's never been a good offensive player, but he was a good rebounder and defender prior to his injury. Based on his preseason performance (all we have to base anything on at this point), that hasn't changed.

BNM

sounds good to give him a try. its not like we're gonna throw him in the starting lineup

 

[Boob-No-More]

sounds good to give him a try. its not like we're gonna throw him in the starting lineup

Exactly, we're talking 3 - 5 MPG here.

BNM

 

[MARIS61]

Does it matter?

Do you expect better results?

 

[Nikolokolus]

I guess I'd rather trust Monty, KP, Nate, Dean, Prunty and Lucas to decide if the team's 15th man should be activated or not. I doubt Shav is all that worried about it, after all he's playing for 700K this year and only made the roster by winning "pre-season survivor."

 

[Boob-No-More]

Does it matter?

Does ANYTHING said here really matter?

Do you expect better results?

Neither Frye nor Diogu are getting the job done. So, why not try something else?

Giving Shavlik a few minutes at back-up 4 seems to be pretty low risk. KP is level headed and hasn't shown any tendency to make a trade just to shake things up, but with all the posters on this board clamoring for multiple trades after every loss (and every 13-point win), I think giving Randolph some of Diogu's and Frye's minutes seems better than trading away away something of value to solve our back-up power forward "problem".

BNM

 

[cdub503]

every time i went to a preseason game and saw him on the floor i absolutely cringed on how horrible he was..... it still blows my mind how hes even on the bench

 

[Ed O]

He also shot 0.400 in preseason.

So what? After shooting about 50% for his career up until this year, I'd bet he shoots a heck of a lot better than 30% with some more minutes.

And he's NOT creating his own shots by getting offensive rebounds. Both of his offensive rebounds in the Denver game came when he got his shot blocked right back in his face.

You're not making sense. He has had his shot blocked four times and he has 9 offensive boards. How is that not creating extra possessions?

He has 9 offensive boards and 13 field goal attempts this year. How is that not creating his own shots?

I would be shocked if many players in the NBA get 75% as many offensive boards as FGA.

And again ZERO assists and ZERO steals for Ike so far this season. I wonder what the NBA record is for most consectutives games without an assist. Ike's currently at 13 and counting.

Yinka Dare went at least 59 games (to start his career) without an assist. Over 630 minutes.

But who cares? Ike barely touches the ball except right near the basket. Why does him not having any assists in 51 minutes make a difference?

I disagree. Shavlik, today, is a better player than Ike. Shavlik outplayed him in preseason and is a better defender and better rebounder. Prior to his season ending ankle injury in 2006-07, Shavlik has worked his way into the starting line-up in Philadelphia.

There's no evidence that I can see that matters that Randolph is or ever has been a better player than Diogu. Preseason games mean little more than summer league.

Ike scores more becuase that's all he does. He doesn't pass the ball and he plays awful defense. In a back-up power forward, especially with Outlaw and Rudy taking most of the shots, I'd like to see some energy, rebounding and defense. Not some guy who forces up a bad shot everytime he touches the ball.

You're watching the games, right? Ike is forcing up bad shots? Are you kidding?

He's dunked once, taken nine close shots and three jumpers. He has missed a lot of shots that he has made throughout his career, but that doesn't make them bad shots.

Because, as bad as he's been playing, Frye is still better than Diogu.

By what standard? Not by any statistical or anecdotal one I can see, other than that Ike has missed 9 of the 13 shots he's taken this year. And anyone willing to judge based on 13 shots seems to be out of touch with reality. Or named Nate McMillan.

Ed O.

 

[Boob-No-More]

every time i went to a preseason game and saw him on the floor i absolutely cringed on how horrible he was..... it still blows my mind how hes even on the bench

Are you referring to Shavlik, or Ike?

Shavlik only played in three preseason games - two at home.

One of those was the already mentioned game where he had 19 points on 9 - 9 shooting, 10 rebounds and 3 blocks in less than 20 minutes. I can't imagine that kind of performance making anyone "cringe".

His other home preseason game was against Utah (the game where Roy, Oden and Aldridge all sat out and Utah played their regular rotation for much of the game). Admittedly, it was probably Shavlik's worst preseason game of the three, but he still had 8 points (2 - 7 FG, 4 - 6 FT), 5 rebounds, 2 assists, 2 steals and 2 blocks in 26 minutes.

BNM

 

[cdub503]

shlavik and maybe im thinkin of someone else but im pretty sure the games i saw were of shlavik

 

[Boob-No-More]

You're watching the games, right? Ike is forcing up bad shots? Are you kidding?

He's dunked once, taken nine close shots and three jumpers. He has missed a lot of shots that he has made throughout his career, but that doesn't make them bad shots.

Yes, I am watching the games. I've seen every minute of every game Ike has played in this year. And what I see over and over is a guy so determined to get a shot up he forces it up against double teams without ever even thinking about passing. It doesn't matter if they're from 20 feet or 20 inches - HE'S NOT MAKING THEM FOR A REASON. They are forced shots against multiple defenders when he has wide open teammates and he refuses to pass the ball. He's had over 30% of his FG attempts blocked. Why, because he's forcing up shots he has no chance of making.

Have you been watching the games? It sure doesn't sound like it.

BNM

 

[Drink Your Milkshake]

The backup quarterback is always the most popular guy in town. I don't know any reason why Randolph deserves playing time.

 

[Boob-No-More]

The backup quarterback is always the most popular guy in town. I don't know any reason why Randolph deserves playing time.

Because the guys in front of him aren't getting the job done. Again, we're not talking major minutes here, but what exactly has Ike Diogu done to deserve playing time?

BNM

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Shavlik is a far superior talent to Ike. I don't think most of you ever caught Shav's excellent season with Philly when he was healthy. He contributed regularly.