WOLVES @ BLAZERS - GAME THREAD - 03.02.13, SATURDAY 7 PM - KGW/NBA TV

[jlprk]

Every other team would give the RoY and 2x allstar the same contract.

Nope, only Pritchard would have. Allen was mad that Pritchard didn't negotiate (in fact, Pritchard took Roy's side and argued against Allen) so Allen fired Pritchard's media-loving ass.

 

[PapaG]

Nope, only Pritchard would have. Allen was mad that Pritchard didn't negotiate (in fact, Pritchard took Roy's side and argued against Allen) so Allen fired Pritchard's media-loving ass.

Meanwhile, Pritchard is the GM of the #2 seed in the East, and Paul Allen sits on the baseline looking like a toad when things don't go well for the Blazers. I wonder how long it will be before he shoos Olshey away from his seat on the baseline?

Plus, the Blazers signed Roy after Pritchard was fired. So much for "negotiation". Allen and Bert Kolde have yet to prove they can do anything in the NBA. Meanwhile, Pritchard resigned Hibbert, who is their defensive backbone, and that team without Danny Granger is pretty damned good.

 

[magnifier661]

Nope, only Pritchard would have. Allen was mad that Pritchard didn't negotiate (in fact, Pritchard took Roy's side and argued against Allen) so Allen fired Pritchard's media-loving ass.

You are such a wonderful storyteller

 

[Wizard Mentor]

MM may be off his rocker some times, but this time is not one of those times. A healthy Roy would have received a max contract without any questions. The blazers knew he was badly injured, Roy knew he was badly injured (though Roy was and is in some denial), and Roy's agent knew he was badly injured.

Why do people think the Blazers took the entire summer to sign him? Why do you think Brandon's agent had Brandon negotiate through the press on multiple occasions. They were pressuring the Blazers to give him huge $$$. The post-jail-Blazers couldn't take the PR hit, so they gave in.

Brandon's OK, but he's not the great guy everyone gives him credit for.

 

[RoyToy]

LOL and Roy being some bad guy for signing a contract the BLAZERS OFFERED HIM

Fuck you people are so delirious and you just love to hate your own players. I don't get it.

The Blazers knew about Roy's knees and still offered him the contract. That's on them, not Roy.

 

[RoyToy]

And Roy didn't trick the Blazers in to some kind big contract. The big hang-up in the negotiations was the Blazers wanted Roy on a 4yr contract, while Roy wanted a 5yr contract. The $ per year amount wasn't the big deal. And in the end Roy got 5 years because the FREAKING OWNER, Paul Allen, said Roy deserved it.

Some of you people need to start living in reality.

 

[magnifier661]

And Roy didn't trick the Blazers in to some kind big contract. The big hang-up in the negotiations was the Blazers wanted Roy on a 4yr contract, while Roy wanted a 5yr contract. The $ per year amount wasn't the big deal. And in the end Roy got 5 years because the FREAKING OWNER, Paul Allen, said Roy deserved it.

Some of you people need to start living in reality.

I don't know why you are getting bent man. Portland fans, well many in here, don't feel alive unless they can complain about something.

 

[MickZagger]

Meanwhile, Pritchard is the GM of the #2 seed in the East, and Paul Allen sits on the baseline looking like a toad when things don't go well for the Blazers. I wonder how long it will be before he shoos Olshey away from his seat on the baseline?

Plus, the Blazers signed Roy after Pritchard was fired. So much for "negotiation". Allen and Bert Kolde have yet to prove they can do anything in the NBA. Meanwhile, Pritchard resigned Hibbert, who is their defensive backbone, and that team without Danny Granger is pretty damned good.

Because Pritchard should be given complete credit for building that dynasty in Indiana...

 

[magnifier661]

Because Pritchard should be given complete credit for building that dynasty in Indiana...

Isn't a dynasty one that wins multiple championships?

 

[Wizard Mentor]

No disagreement, it's on the blazers not Roy. But that doesn't make him a good guy.

LOL and Roy being some bad guy for signing a contract the BLAZERS OFFERED HIM

Fuck you people are so delirious and you just love to hate your own players. I don't get it.

The Blazers knew about Roy's knees and still offered him the contract. That's on them, not Roy.

 

[magnifier661]

No disagreement, it's on the blazers not Roy. But that doesn't make him a good guy.

Doesn't make him a bad guy either.

 

[Rhal]

MM may be off his rocker some times, but this time is not one of those times. A healthy Roy would have received a max contract without any questions. The blazers knew he was badly injured, Roy knew he was badly injured (though Roy was and is in some denial), and Roy's agent knew he was badly injured.

Why do people think the Blazers took the entire summer to sign him? Why do you think Brandon's agent had Brandon negotiate through the press on multiple occasions. They were pressuring the Blazers to give him huge $$$. The post-jail-Blazers couldn't take the PR hit, so they gave in.

Brandon's OK, but he's not the great guy everyone gives him credit for.

Roy wasn't injured when he signed the contract. They knew he had no miniscus in his knees and it could cause big problems down the line but having no Miniscus (like Kobe and CP3) and not being able to play isn't the same thing.

 

[RoyToy]

No disagreement, it's on the blazers not Roy. But that doesn't make him a good guy.

And how is he a bad guy in this situation? How does it question his character at all?

He did absolutely nothing wrong.

 

[jlprk]

Meanwhile, Pritchard is the GM of the #2 seed in the East, and Paul Allen sits on the baseline looking like a toad when things don't go well for the Blazers. I wonder how long it will be before he shoos Olshey away from his seat on the baseline?

Plus, the Blazers signed Roy after Pritchard was fired. So much for "negotiation". Allen and Bert Kolde have yet to prove they can do anything in the NBA. Meanwhile, Pritchard resigned Hibbert, who is their defensive backbone, and that team without Danny Granger is pretty damned good.

All irrelevant to determining how much blame to apportion each member of Blazer management for knowing of Roy's injury, yet helping Roy get a max contract.

You are such a wonderful storyteller

All taken from media accounts of Pritchard's firing.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Easy to answer, but let's flip it around. What makes him a good person?

And how is he a bad guy in this situation? How does it question his character at all?

He did absolutely nothing wrong.

 

[RoyToy]

Easy to answer, but let's flip it around. What makes him a good person?

You're the one questioning his character, say it's easy to answer why.... but then don't explain why he's not a good person.

Ooooooooooooooooook.

 

[ABM]

Easy to answer, but let's flip it around. What makes him a good person?

Blame his agent, if anyone.

 

[jlprk]

You're the one questioning his character, say it's easy to answer why.... but then don't explain why he's not a good person.

Ooooooooooooooooook.

Original sin. We are all inherently evil. I've been meaning to ask, is that the soooo-EY! sound of a pig?

 

[magnifier661]

Easy to answer, but let's flip it around. What makes him a good person?

Well based on all accounts and actions of when Roy was a blazer; I would say there is no significant data of him having hoops family shoving beer bottles up the va j js of women in hotel rooms. There just isn't any evidence that would pursued me otherwise.

Do you have any data explaining how bad of a guy he is?

 

[magnifier661]

You're the one questioning his character, say it's easy to answer why.... but then don't explain why he's not a good person.

Ooooooooooooooooook.

There is a saying "the burden of proof is on the one accusing"

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Odd criteria for being a "good guy." By that logic, each of the current Blazers and most of the rest of the league deserves the same type of love Roy's getting. You haven't explained how he's a good guy at all.

The Blazers gave him all kinds of love as a player, their whole advertising campaign was basically an attempt to paint Roy as a "good guy". How did he repay them? He went to the press using his "good guy" image to pressure the Blazers to give him a contract he in no way deserved (hence why we amnestied him).

The basic argument seems to be this: "I bought into all that Roy is a good guy stuff the Blazers forced down my throat. When it came time to show his character, well that's 'just business'".

So, I ask again. What did he do to justify being a "good guy"? Please, don't say stuff (like signing autographs) that every blazer does.

Well based on all accounts and actions of when Roy was a blazer; I would say there is no significant data of him having hoops family shoving beer bottles up the va j js of women in hotel rooms. There just isn't any evidence that would pursued me otherwise.

Do you have any data explaining how bad of a guy he is?

 

[magnifier661]

Odd criteria for being a "good guy." By that logic, each of the current Blazers and most of the rest of the league deserves the same type of love Roy's getting. You haven't explained how he's a good guy at all.

The Blazers gave him all kinds of love as a player, their whole advertising campaign was basically an attempt to paint Roy as a "good guy". How did he repay them? He went to the press using his "good guy" image to pressure the Blazers to give him a contract he in no way deserved (hence why we amnestied him).

The basic argument seems to be this: "I bought into all that Roy is a good guy stuff the Blazers forced down my throat. When it came time to show his character, well that's 'just business'".

So, I ask again. What did he do to justify being a "good guy"? Please, don't say stuff (like signing autographs) that every blazer does.

I just pointed out examples of someone being a bad guy. And there is no evidence I've seen that would pursued me to think he's a bad guy.

Then if there isn't much evidence that suggests he's a good guy; then that puts him right in the middle right? Seems you are the one that is accusing Roy of being a bad guy, so I ask you again. What evidence do you have that puts him as a bad guy?

This "flip around" doesn't apply because I'm not the one saying he's a good guy. I just said that there isn't evidence that proves he's not a bad guy and the evidence provided doesn't prove he isn't a good guy either.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Player's have a finite window in which to make a living as a professional athlete. Rookie scale contracts artificially suppress the "worth" of some players, particularly guys who start making all-star appearances on those contracts. When it came time for Roy's extension he was well within his rights to demand a raise commensurate with his past performance and to recoup four years of under-compensation. Just because he had a history of injuries didn't mean he should have negotiated against himself, or that there's some moral imperative or character issue wrapped up in a contract negotiation. If anything he owed it to the player's association to get the most money he could because getting the best deal raises the bar in similar negotiations with his union members.

Maybe Roy's good-guy image was a marketing fabrication (or maybe not) but that's just the thing, the Blazers' profited from that image just as much as Brandon. And ultimately him being a good-guy or not has absolutely zero to do with the extension he signed. Professional sports is a business, if you think otherwise then you deluding yourself.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Oh many men of straw...
I never said that Brandon was a bad guy. Feel free to click on my name, then "Find all posts." Since I know that none of you will actually do that, here's one of my early quotes:

Brandon's OK, but he's not the great guy everyone gives him credit for.

Nik and others still want to say that

And ultimately him being a good-guy or not has absolutely zero to do with the extension he signed. Professional sports is a business, if you think otherwise then you deluding yourself.

Fine, it's a business. What has Brandon done to convince everyone that he's a good guy? None of you will answer the question because you can't.

Yes Brandon was a nice guy, but so was Travis Outlaw.
Yes Brandon played hard, but so did Travis Outlaw.
I'm not saying Outlaw is great, but what did Brandon do that Outlaw didn't. When Outlaw returned to PDX, did he get so much love.

Bottom line: Brandon was not any better of a guy than many, but he helped us win some, and fans like winning, and if you can't agree with that then you're "deluding yourself."

Player's have a finite window in which to make a living as a professional athlete. Rookie scale contracts artificially suppress the "worth" of some players, particularly guys who start making all-star appearances on those contracts. When it came time for Roy's extension he was well within his rights to demand a raise commensurate with his past performance and to recoup four years of under-compensation. Just because he had a history of injuries didn't mean he should have negotiated against himself, or that there's some moral imperative or character issue wrapped up in a contract negotiation. If anything he owed it to the player's association to get the most money he could because getting the best deal raises the bar in similar negotiations with his union members.

Maybe Roy's good-guy image was a marketing fabrication (or maybe not) but that's just the thing, the Blazers' profited from that image just as much as Brandon. And ultimately him being a good-guy or not has absolutely zero to do with the extension he signed. Professional sports is a business, if you think otherwise then you deluding yourself.

 

[magnifier661]

Examples of Roy being a "good guy".

http://www.aplusyouthprogram.org/events/annual-breakfast/breakfast-2012/

In consecutive years, Brandon Roy and Martell Webster have shared with guests their development as student-athletes and address the challenges that today’s youth face, workable solutions for the youth of our community to grow to become successful leaders and extraordinary individuals. Even with their athletic accomplishments, Brandon and Martell both emphasized the importance of a sound academic foundation.

http://205.186.129.59/2008/09/adidas-nations-showcasing-the-best/

This link is the story where Roy gave a basketball court to his community

http://seattletimes.com/html/editorialsopinion/2003693970_broyed05.html

Roy quietly led the University of Washington to three appearances in the NCAA tournament, and was an All-American his senior year. Not many Rookie of the Year winners can claim that many tournament appearances because most do not stay on campus long enough. Roy is the rare student-athlete who stayed for four years of college and plans to work on his nearly completed degree in the off-season. Roy's place atop all NBA newcomers was not a slam dunk. Roy publicly considered turning pro after a stellar career at Garfield High School. When only the Portland Trail Blazers, the team he later joined, offered him a tryout, Roy decided on the UW.

Seems he is responsible enough to wanna complete college. Usually thugs will just milk the millions they receive in the nba.

I remembered Roy being a part if multiple backpack giveaways to under priveledged kids too.

Okay so I have my evidence, now wizard show me the reports on how Roy is a bad guy.

 

[magnifier661]

Oh many men of straw...
I never said that Brandon was a bad guy. Feel free to click on my name, then "Find all posts." Since I know that none of you will actually do that, here's one of my early quotes:



Nik and others still want to say that



Fine, it's a business. What has Brandon done to convince everyone that he's a good guy? None of you will answer the question because you can't.

Yes Brandon was a nice guy, but so was Travis Outlaw.
Yes Brandon played hard, but so did Travis Outlaw.
I'm not saying Outlaw is great, but what did Brandon do that Outlaw didn't. When Outlaw returned to PDX, did he get so much love.

Bottom line: Brandon was not any better of a guy than many, but he helped us win some, and fans like winning, and if you can't agree with that then you're "deluding yourself."

Well Joel pryzbilla received a lot of love when he returned. I don't understand your point... Blazer fans recognize great players. Joel pryzbilla wasn't much of a stat guy, but he was that hard worker that helped give us wins. Outlaw had dismal years of development and many complained he actually didn't work hard.

Oh and how is it straw man when this post reply to Roytoy went like this???

"Easy to answer, but let's flip it around. What makes him a good person?

Originally Posted by RoyToy
And how is he a bad guy in this situation? How does it question his character at all?

He did absolutely nothing wrong."

When you say "how is Roy a bad guy in this situation" you are implying Roy is a bad guy, no?

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Thank you for at least attempting to actually show why you think Brandon is a "good guy." I think Brandon is an OK guy, too, as I said. However, I will point out that these examples led to an increase in Roy's ridiculous salary and are therefore as much as "just business" as his contract negotiations.

\end thread

Examples of Roy being a "good guy".

http://www.aplusyouthprogram.org/events/annual-breakfast/breakfast-2012/


http://205.186.129.59/2008/09/adidas-nations-showcasing-the-best/

This link is the story where Roy gave a basketball court to his community

http://seattletimes.com/html/editorialsopinion/2003693970_broyed05.html


Seems he is responsible enough to wanna complete college. Usually thugs will just milk the millions they receive in the nba.

I remembered Roy being a part if multiple backpack giveaways to under priveledged kids too.

Okay so I have my evidence, now wizard show me the reports on how Roy is a bad guy.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Oh many men of straw...
I never said that Brandon was a bad guy. Feel free to click on my name, then "Find all posts." Since I know that none of you will actually do that, here's one of

Maybe I misread, but it seemed like there was an implication that he somehow acted in bad faith.

For the record, I have no idea if he's good or bad as a person

 

[Wizard Mentor]

For the record, I think Brandon is an OK guy, just not worthy of the worship given by most fans including most on this board.

Maybe I misread, but it seemed like there was an implication that he somehow acted in bad faith.

For the record, I have no idea if he's good or bad as a person

 

[magnifier661]

Thank you for at least attempting to actually show why you think Brandon is a "good guy." I think Brandon is an OK guy, too, as I said. However, I will point out that these examples led to an increase in Roy's ridiculous salary and are therefore as much as "just business" as his contract negotiations.

\end thread

I can respect this response. And personally I worshiped his game, not personality. I can agree he is an average ok guy. I think the good guy term is valid with Portland fans because our bar was set soooo low for so many years before his arrival. He changed the overall look of our teams public example. That's a true statement. Would that have been the same if we never had the jail blazer era? Probably not...