Would you trade BRoy if there were a taker?

[STOMP]

Everything about this post is purely your opinion. Cause those two games BRoy played well, the rest of the team wasn't. Those two wins were because Roy had a stellar game. You can spin it all you want. But you said you want your team to win. They did and it was because of Roy, pure and simple. So give me all your "PER" and statistical gargabe. Portland would have been swept by Dallas without Roy having those great games. I think we're done here. You won't give two shits if Roy scored 500 points and won. You still will toss your hate. For me, I'm glad this team has Roy and his heart. I'm glad the entire team supports Roy and Roy. I will be even more glad when Roy actually proves you wrong once again.

good grief what a temper tantrum. It's like you're five years old and I took your blanky when all I did was point to facts. Facts don't hate, they often enlighten. Emphatically stated opinions (like Portland being swept without Roy), are still just opinions.

I seem to remember you making a call out that Roy will never have a game like he did in game 4. You were wrong then, and you are wrong now. NEXT...

Your memory here is shit Mags. How surprising is it that you provided no link to this silly fantasy? I was fucking thrilled when he was going off during game 4, mostly because the team I follow won a playoff game. Feel free to sift through my posts and discover what I've actually said

Here's a link for you

Roy had several great games this season (my fav was vs Denver), so it's pretty obvious that he's capable of occasionally being the great Brandon Roy of old. But unfortunately for fans of the team, the tremendous All Star we've been rooting for has had his abilities/career seriously impacted by injury. Unfortunately, he has been having more bad nights then good... his footspeed has tailed off significantly and defensively he is a true liability. It will take a major medical breakthrough for him to regain his legs. Doctors, management, hell Brandon himself has told us this.

Don't be angry with the truth, even if it's bad news... try dealing with it rationally.

STOMP

 

[PapaG]

good grief what a temper tantrum. It's like you're five years old and I took your blanky when all I did was point to facts. Facts don't hate, they often enlighten. Emphatically stated opinions (like Portland being swept without Roy), are still just opinions.


Your memory here is shit Mags. How surprising is it that you provided no link to this silly fantasy? I was fucking thrilled when he was going off during game 4, mostly because the team I follow won a playoff game. Feel free to sift through my posts and discover what I've actually said

Here's a link for you

Roy had several great games this season (my fav was vs Denver), so it's pretty obvious that he's capable of occasionally being the great Brandon Roy of old. But unfortunately for fans of the team, the tremendous All Star we've been rooting for has had his abilities/career seriously impacted by injury. Unfortunately, he has been having more bad nights then good... his footspeed has tailed off significantly and defensively he is a true liability. It will take a major medical breakthrough for him to regain his legs. Doctors, management, hell Brandon himself has told us this.

Don't be angry with the truth, even if it's bad news... try dealing with it rationally.

STOMP

You bashed on Roy prior to Game 3 to a degree that was embarrassing for most readers, and you didn't show up after Games 3 and 4.

Now, you're back to sharing your opinions, and treating them as fact.

It's an old act.

 

[magnifier661]

good grief what a temper tantrum. It's like you're five years old and I took your blanky when all I did was point to facts. Facts don't hate, they often enlighten. Emphatically stated opinions (like Portland being swept without Roy), are still just opinions.

LMAO! The infamous "Good grief what a temper tantrum" rant. That's cute buddy. I'm hardly pissed at you. I just think you're wrong. Nothing wrong about that. Do you think, just because I think your comments on Roy are full of shit, I am pissed off at you? No think again brother... Hardly...

 

[STOMP]

LMAO! The infamous "Good grief what a temper tantrum" rant. That's cute buddy. I'm hardly pissed at you. I just think you're wrong. Nothing wrong about that. Do you think, just because I think your comments on Roy are full of shit, I am pissed off at you? No think again brother... Hardly...

your comments towards me in this thread are ridiculous and over the top emotional... temper tantrum describes your behavior perfectly. I'm not a hater, I'm a realist. The goal is to win a championship. The only Blazer I ever even sort of hated was Damon, and that was because he acted like such a stupid spoiled bitch back in HS. Pulling a BS recollection out your ass without a link is just pathetic.

STOMP

 

[STOMP]

You bashed on Roy prior to Game 3 to a degree that was embarrassing for most readers, and you didn't show up after Games 3 and 4.

Hi unwanted stalker! Since when do you and Mags equal "most readers"? Besides you two taking on all comers defending BR's bitching about PT in the playoffs, not a single poster expressed any sort of issue with anything I posted... one did rep me though

Following game 3 (April 21st) through the day after game 4 (April 24th) I posted well over 20 times, though a couple of those were on the Ducks. Is that me hiding? I even referred to Roy's good game and apology...http://sportstwo.com/threads/185001...oy-s-big-emotional-game?p=2593587#post2593587

Now, you're back to sharing your opinions, and treating them as fact.

no sorry, I post opinions and facts. Recently posting Roy's stats are an example of facts

It's an old act.

having you stalk me with BS certainly is tired and boring. Feel free to continue to flood the board with your blather, I won't ever respond as long as you leave me alone. Again, stalking someone like you do with me is creepy and weird

STOMP

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

Everything about this post is purely your opinion. Cause those two games BRoy played well, the rest of the team wasn't. Those two wins were because Roy had a stellar game. You can spin it all you want. But you said you want your team to win. They did and it was because of Roy, pure and simple. So give me all your "PER" and statistical gargabe. Portland would have been swept by Dallas without Roy having those great games. I think we're done here. You won't give two shits if Roy scored 500 points and won. You still will toss your hate. For me, I'm glad this team has Roy and his heart. I'm glad the entire team supports Roy and Roy. I will be even more glad when Roy actually proves you wrong once again.

I seem to remember you making a call out that Roy will never have a game like he did in game 4. You were wrong then, and you are wrong now. NEXT...

MAGS

BRoy made a stretch of shots - one amazing 4-point play..and one very lucky - off the glass (missed it so far, he made it) shot from straight on.

Truth is, Dallas went ice cold, the team did a very nice job playing defense, and BRoy took and made shots. Dallas folded under the pressure.

That is what really happened.

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

....and my thread was not about hating on BRoy at all. It was more of a poll to ask "would you trade BRoy?" and the more about the "business scenario" than anything to do with BRoy. I even stated that Roy had become one of my all-time favorite Blazers.

 

[magnifier661]

your comments towards me in this thread are ridiculous and over the top emotional... temper tantrum describes your behavior perfectly. I'm not a hater, I'm a realist. The goal is to win a championship. The only Blazer I ever even sort of hated was Damon, and that was because he acted like such a stupid spoiled bitch back in HS. Pulling a BS recollection out your ass without a link is just pathetic.

STOMP

Let's rehash this thread now shall we? First off, the OP said would you trade Roy if there was any takers. I replied sadly yes, so I have no idea why you think I am flaming on the original thread. My response was when the OP said Roy was done and basically dumping his contract for nothing is better for the team. I disagreed and I made it clear that I didn't believe his comment was "A hater statement" and Roy showed value by leading his team to the only 2 victories against Dallas. Then you come swooping in like captain save a ho and took offense to my "I know you're not a hater statement". I took offense, knowing I made no comment that I felt was calling someone out as a hater. In fact, replied "cordially to you at first". Of course you took it to a pompous level and kept it going.

I figured that if you want to be a dick about it, I will return the favor. Obviously you took it personal and went on your childish rant. I again simply said, "Fact is we lose game 3 and 4 without Roy". Which is 100% true. And like I said before. You can spin it any way you want, but the fact remains that without Roy, we lose both games.

And please show me a thread where I called you a hater? You seem like you are trying to call me out on something I haven't said. You even said yourself that I didn't provide a link that explained my opinion on you. I give you the challenge.

So in a nutshell you clearly got defensive on me, was wrong about what I said and intended and are trying to dig yourself out by labeling me as some argumentative "Roy fan" and not a fan of the team. I can prove I have love for every player on this ball club. The only real rant I ever have is being upset if Oden leaves us without giving us anything in return. That is a fan of the team. Who else would want to support a player that doesn't want to give back to the team that supported him?

I eagerly await your witty response. It may take a while.

 

[magnifier661]

....and my thread was not about hating on BRoy at all. It was more of a poll to ask "would you trade BRoy?" and the more about the "business scenario" than anything to do with BRoy. I even stated that Roy had become one of my all-time favorite Blazers.

You are taking the rant back and forth with STOMP as me calling out anyone that wants to trade Roy. I was the first response to your original question and I replied "Brass would be foolish not to trade Roy". But I intended it for something of value. When you said that basically a salary dump for nothing in return would be best for this team, I disagreed. I even wanted to be clear that I didn't think you were a hater, so you wouldn't take offense to my comment. STOMP, not being able to see me intent, decided to take this thread to another level and flame on me. I just wanted to return the favor.

So "NO" I do not think you are a hater. And "YES" I do believe you are wrong that getting Roy for nothing is best for this team. But this is a forum and all of us are entitled to our opinions right? I respect yours, so hopefully you respect mine. It's obvious STOMP doesn't respect anything but his own, by the rant on this thread.

 

[Blazinaway]

Lets get past this, unless there is a medical miracle breakthrough this team is better off with this current much reduced capacity Roy being gone, it's that simple and obvious IMO. I would prefer the amnesty clause route if we get one with the new CBA, obviously a medical retirement would be ideal but at least for now does not yet seem likely. If those choces are not available we are likely stuck with Roy.

 

[Nikolokolus]

You are taking the rant back and forth with STOMP as me calling out anyone that wants to trade Roy. I was the first response to your original question and I replied "Brass would be foolish not to trade Roy". But I intended it for something of value. When you said that basically a salary dump for nothing in return would be best for this team, I disagreed. I even wanted to be clear that I didn't think you were a hater, so you wouldn't take offense to my comment. STOMP, not being able to see me intent, decided to take this thread to another level and flame on me. I just wanted to return the favor.

So "NO" I do not think you are a hater. And "YES" I do believe you are wrong that getting Roy for nothing is best for this team. But this is a forum and all of us are entitled to our opinions right? I respect yours, so hopefully you respect mine. It's obvious STOMP doesn't respect anything but his own, by the rant on this thread.

I don't care about the rest of your post, but this little snippet jumped out. I think you are missing a major point. The owners are about to push for a hard cap so waiving Roy might be the most important thing Cho/Allen do this offseason. Roster building and management is all about cap flexibility in the NBA, if you don't have cap flexibility there is a very real possibility that this team won't be able to resign some actual productive players or make trades to improve the team, especially if the owners get a hard cap implemented.

So instead of looking at it like they'd be moving him for "nothing" they do get "something," the ability to field a competitive team or at least the ability to make moves to field a competitive team.

 

[magnifier661]

I don't care about the rest of your post, but this little snippet jumped out. I think you are missing a major point. The owners are about to push for a hard cap so waiving Roy might be the most important thing Cho/Allen do this offseason. Roster building and management is all about cap flexibility in the NBA, if you don't have cap flexibility there is a very real possibility that this team won't be able to resign some actual productive players or make trades to improve the team, especially if the owners get a hard cap implemented.

So instead of looking at it like they'd be moving him for "nothing" they do get "something," the ability to field a competitive team or at least the ability to make moves to field a competitive team.

If there is a "hard cap" than I think you are on target. I think there is a disagreement on Roy having "0" value. If he was waived with the "proposed amnesty clause"; then it can help the team. But just releasing him without the clause, like what was mentioned before makes no sense. This was what this thread was about. And it was mentioned that we needed to release both Roy and Oden; so I doubt that was the intent of OP's comment.

 

[magnifier661]

Lets get past this, unless there is a medical miracle breakthrough this team is better off with this current much reduced capacity Roy being gone, it's that simple and obvious IMO. I would prefer the amnesty clause route if we get one with the new CBA, obviously a medical retirement would be ideal but at least for now does not yet seem likely. If those choces are not available we are likely stuck with Roy.

Do you think a player of Roy's new condition is worth a MLE contract?

 

[STOMP]

Let's rehash this thread now shall we? First off, the OP said would you trade Roy if there was any takers. I replied sadly yes, so I have no idea why you think I am flaming on the original thread. My response was when the OP said Roy was done and basically dumping his contract for nothing is better for the team. I disagreed and I made it clear that I didn't believe his comment was "A hater statement" and Roy showed value by leading his team to the only 2 victories against Dallas. Then you come swooping in like captain save a ho and took offense to my "I know you're not a hater statement". I took offense, knowing I made no comment that I felt was calling someone out as a hater. In fact, replied "cordially to you at first". Of course you took it to a pompous level and kept it going.

I figured that if you want to be a dick about it, I will return the favor. Obviously you took it personal and went on your childish rant. I again simply said, "Fact is we lose game 3 and 4 without Roy". Which is 100% true. And like I said before. You can spin it any way you want, but the fact remains that without Roy, we lose both games.

right... it's all my fault I see you're still having issues differentiating between your opinions and actual facts... oh well

And please show me a thread where I called you a hater? You seem like you are trying to call me out on something I haven't said. You even said yourself that I didn't provide a link that explained my opinion on you. I give you the challenge.

okay... post #59 of this thread

You won't give two shits if Roy scored 500 points and won. You still will toss your hate.

hell, nevermind that I've literally made dozens of posts trumpeting Brandon's game & heart, you're here to throw the kitchen sink.

So in a nutshell you clearly got defensive on me, was wrong about what I said and intended and are trying to dig yourself out by labeling me as some argumentative "Roy fan" and not a fan of the team.

you seem to regularly put whats best for Roy ahead of concern for whats best for the team. Roy's faults are overlooked, his positives overblown.

I can prove I have love for every player on this ball club. The only real rant I ever have is being upset if Oden leaves us without giving us anything in return. That is a fan of the team. Who else would want to support a player that doesn't want to give back to the team that supported him?

I'm reminded of something old Suns coach and GM Cotton Fitzsimmons relayed that he would tell his players at the start of the season. Roughly quoting... "I'd tell them, guys I love you all and the exciting opportunities that we have before us. I think a whole lot of each and every one of your games, which is why I acquired you via the draft and trades. But some day I will trade each and every one of you... this is a business"

Greg doesn't owe us anything other then his best effort while under contract. Being a fan isn't only limited to the narrow confines of unwavering loyalty that you seem to describe. Many of the diehards here have been posting daily for years seem to have no problem recognizing the business end of things. They both love the players and yet realize that each of them are limited talents who will only play for Portland for a short span. It's okay to talk about trades and such, because we're just fans speculating... our threads don't actually affect team decisions. Players don't generate a feeling of pride because some poster defended them in a forum any more then they get down if another says they suck.

I eagerly await your witty response. It may take a while.

so sorry to keep you waiting

STOMP

 

[magnifier661]

right... it's all my fault I see you're still having issues differentiating between your opinions and actual facts... oh well

Oh my what a cry baby SlyPokerDog is. Yeah everything is his fault. Oh dear SlyPokerDog's fragile ego has been maimed. We can go back and forth all month, and his inability to take any sort of criticism will fight to the bitter end. Are you an attorney?

okay... post #59 of this thread

Ah yes, was this after I stated that without Roy we would have been swept? Answer this with a simple "Yes or No" answer. Do you think we would have won games 3 or 4 without Roy?

hell, nevermind that I've literally made dozens of posts trumpeting Brandon's game & heart, you're here to throw the kitchen sink.

Actually no I haven't. In fact, like I already posted. I didn't call you out as a hater, nor boom shaka either. Then you went on ego maniac rampage, so I gave you a taste of your own medicine. And from the long winded response, it sure looks like you can't take anything close of what you dish out. You have a very "whoa is me attitude". I think it's kinda funny. You are fine giving criticism or putting down others, then when it's given to you, you cry out "That I'm attacking you?" LMAO! Grow some skin buddy.

you seem to regularly put whats best for Roy ahead of concern for whats best for the team. Roy's faults are overlooked, his positives overblown.

Yes and that's why I said it's probably best to trade him and Brass would be stupid not to if they didn't? Read post #2. But hey, you can put some more words in my mouth. P.S. Roy lead the charge on winning games 3 and 4, therefor your denial of him actually helping this club proves your interest. Cause well, if Roy wasn't playing in games 3 and 4, we would have lost. Sooooooo, you would rather the Blazers lost to prove your point?

I'm reminded of something old Suns coach and GM Cotton Fitzsimmons relayed that he would tell his players at the start of the season. Roughly quoting... "I'd tell them, guys I love you all and the exciting opportunities that we have before us. I think a whole lot of each and every one of your games, which is why I acquired you via the draft and trades. But some day I will trade each and every one of you... this is a business"

I can agree on that. Good work.

Greg doesn't owe us anything other then his best effort while under contract. Being a fan isn't only limited to the narrow confines of unwavering loyalty that you seem to describe. Many of the diehards here have been posting daily for years seem to have no problem recognizing the business end of things. They both love the players and yet realize that each of them are limited talents who will only play for Portland for a short span. It's okay to talk about trades and such, because we're just fans speculating... our threads don't actually affect team decisions. Players don't generate a feeling of pride because some poster defended them in a forum any more then they get down if another says they suck.

A twist again? Really? I clearly pointed out that was the one time I outwardly called out a player. And well, if you aren't pissed that we aren't gonna get anything back for Oden, then I question your loyalty to the ball club. You described me as a fan of a player and not the team because I would rather have a player succeed than the team (wrong analogy of me BTW). So take some of that criticism right back at ya buddy. If Oden leaves without us getting anything in return, then we just got worse. It is definitely not for the "Best interest of the ball club", therefor your criticism of me not wanting the team to succeed actually rests on your shoulders. You are damn right that this is "Oden's choice". I can be pissed off all I like because if he leaves without giving us anything in return, then we lose as fans. Are you a fan of Oden more than the Blazers?

so sorry to keep you waiting

STOMP

Thanks, I owe you a beer!

 

[Blazinaway]

Do you think a player of Roy's new condition is worth a MLE contract?

that's a tough one, the current full MLE would guarantee Roy 4-5 yrs at what - 7 mil pery] yr? No way would I take that risk. I think for the right team he might be worth 3 yrs max at 3-5 mil per yr, andi do not think the Blazers are the "right team" given our currentholes and needs

 

[magnifier661]

that's a tough one, the current full MLE would guarantee Roy 4-5 yrs at what - 7 mil pery] yr? No way would I take that risk. I think for the right team he might be worth 3 yrs max at 3-5 mil per yr, andi do not think the Blazers are the "right team" given our currentholes and needs

At that rate; you would value him about 29¢ to the dollar? (using this value system: 17 mil is the average per year. 5 mil *100 / 17 mil = 29.4%) And wait actually you value him even less. You said 3 years @ a high of 5 per season = 15 mil x 100 / 68 mil of his current contract value. That is 22¢ per dollar.

 

[oldmangrouch]

:


I can agree on that. Good work.



Thanks, I owe you a beer!

Would you guys just get a room and go have hot makeup sex so the rest of us can get back to being suicidally depressed!

 

[magnifier661]

Would you guys just get a room and go have hot makeup sex so the rest of us can get back to being suicidally depressed!

Sorry man. I'll stop now. Back to being depressed. LOL

 

[STOMP]

Oh my what a cry baby SlyPokerDog is. Yeah everything is his fault. Oh dear SlyPokerDog's fragile ego has been maimed. We can go back and forth all month, and his inability to take any sort of criticism will fight to the bitter end. Are you an attorney?

nope though dealing with law is an important part of my work

Ah yes, was this after I stated that without Roy we would have been swept? Answer this with a simple "Yes or No" answer. Do you think we would have won games 3 or 4 without Roy?

game 3 maybe. It was great that he contributed to two wins. I wasn't so happy about his contributions to the 4 losses.

Actually no I haven't. In fact, like I already posted. I didn't call you out as a hater, nor boom shaka either. Then you went on ego maniac rampage, so I gave you a taste of your own medicine. And from the long winded response, it sure looks like you can't take anything close of what you dish out. You have a very "whoa is me attitude". I think it's kinda funny. You are fine giving criticism or putting down others, then when it's given to you, you cry out "That I'm attacking you?" LMAO! Grow some skin buddy.

Yes and that's why I said it's probably best to trade him and Brass would be stupid not to if they didn't? Read post #2. But hey, you can put some more words in my mouth. P.S. Roy lead the charge on winning games 3 and 4, therefor your denial of him actually helping this club proves your interest. Cause well, if Roy wasn't playing in games 3 and 4, we would have lost. Sooooooo, you would rather the Blazers lost to prove your point?

pot meet kettle and then some. It's amazing how wrong you are about what my point has been. Didn't I link a post made after game 3 where I said I was glad that he played well and that they won? Didn't I say in this very thread that I was thrilled by Roy's game 4 performance? Yet you're still going with a silly strawman having me rooting against Roy and the Blazers AND you're calling me out for putting words in your mouth... funny stuff

A twist again? Really? I clearly pointed out that was the one time I outwardly called out a player. And well, if you aren't pissed that we aren't gonna get anything back for Oden, then I question your loyalty to the ball club.

boy... you looking down on me for not being equally irrational, that sure would be hard to deal with. How would I ever shrug that off?

I'll be disappointed if Greg doesn't develop because I'm a basketball fan and he's a great talent. I'll be disappointed if Greg goes somewhere else via UFA and dominates, because the Blazers are my rooting interest. Hell, I was openly pining for him with many others here back when he was a Junior in HS. But if he does go via Free Agency, I'll understand because this is the way of the pro basketball business in the USA. It's not personal, it's business. The guy I resent is Stern for creating the system where players feel like they have to go to marquee markets to win. I don't resent player after player for recognizing this.

If Greg does go elsewhere, who doesn't think his ticky tack foul rate goes way way down?

[video=youtube;-6j8JCajoMA]

You described me as a fan of a player and not the team because I would rather have a player succeed than the team (wrong analogy of me BTW). So take some of that criticism right back at ya buddy. If Oden leaves without us getting anything in return, then we just got worse. It is definitely not for the "Best interest of the ball club", therefor your criticism of me not wanting the team to succeed actually rests on your shoulders. You are damn right that this is "Oden's choice". I can be pissed off all I like because if he leaves without giving us anything in return, then we lose as fans. Are you a fan of Oden more than the Blazers?

see above

STOMP

 

[Blazinaway]

At that rate; you would value him about 29¢ to the dollar? (using this value system: 17 mil is the average per year. 5 mil *100 / 17 mil = 29.4%) And wait actually you value him even less. You said 3 years @ a high of 5 per season = 15 mil x 100 / 68 mil of his current contract value. That is 22¢ per dollar.

well that's no surprise, I'll throw in some beer and chips if it helps...LOL

 

[Nikolokolus]

Do you think a player of Roy's new condition is worth a MLE contract?

Hell no.

Wesley Matthews was paid the full MLE and he does two things very well to make him worth his contract: shoot threes (although streaky) and play perimeter defense. What does Roy do very well now? 'D'? Nope. Shoot? Nope. Drive? Nope. Run the offense? Meh ... Brandon is barely above replacement level with the condition his knees are in. If I had to peg his actual value I'd say he's probably on par with a BAE level deal or a veteran's minimum contract.

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

Mags - I have no reason to poke fun at any of your thoughts. I was just hoping that the two of you guys would quit the bickering. This forum is to share thoughts and opinions and everyone is entitled.

And "NO" I would not think it worth paying Roy the MLE to keep him. A broken Roy hurts the team. It is tragic, but I think we have to find a way to move him and if a new hard cap happens, then we have to dump his contract. It is very tragic, but this is Cho's chance to prove he's worthy of GM of the Year!

 

[Pinwheel1]

How many players in the NBA have the ability to put together a quarter like Brandon did in game 3? Not many. You can debate all you want that he can't do it very often, but the fact remains he still has the skill to do it, where most have no chance.

He can shoot the ball better than most players in this league. At the very least he could develop into a 3 pt specialist. So if we are talking whether or not he worth the MLE, I would say I would still take him. Very few players in this league want to take the big shot. Brandon is one of those few that does, and can back it up.

We know this team needs shooters. So why get rid of one of the few who can.