20% of Oregonians are on food stamps

[Wheels]

in my defense I have no idea why I put that lol.

 

[Wheels]

And also for the record I am not saying that aiding people who are in need is a bad thing. I fully recognize hard times that people are going through in this economy, and if anyone is on them, please dont take my comments as directing them at you, or anyone in particular... getting the things allowed with EBT cards is fully within the rules, and your rights the way its set up.

I just think the program can be run better.

 

[Minstrel]

I saw some of these EBT welcome signs at Fast Food places in California a couple months ago... talk about angering me...

Why, though? Fast food is definitely not the healthy way to go, but it's hardly a luxury. It's cheap and often what poorer people eat, whether they are paying for it or the government is. In other words, it doesn't seem like that would be an abuse of the system. They're using the money to buy the (cheap) food that they'd buy anyway.

 

[Wheels]

Why, though? Fast food is definitely not the healthy way to go, but it's hardly a luxury. It's cheap and often what poorer people eat, whether they are paying for it or the government is. In other words, it doesn't seem like that would be an abuse of the system. They're using the money to buy the (cheap) food that they'd buy anyway.

not so much that its "Fast Food" even though that isnt allowed in Oregon.. and honestly I dont know how many states do. But part of what would "Combat" buying garbage like is bought with Food Stamps.. is that it would only work for food thats being taken home to be prepared. It would seem the Nutrional aspect in it being a "Supplemental Nutritional Assistance Program" would be negated by making it that much more convenient to eat garbage.

 

[GriLtCheeZ]

and then Baracuda squashes my above post

Sorry

I work in a related field

I think the Timbers all just got their EBT cards. They just weren't hungry last night

The reserve team they put out there probably don't make shit for money.

 

[Minstrel]

not so much that its "Fast Food" even though that isnt allowed in Oregon.. and honestly I dont know how many states do. But part of what would "Combat" buying garbage like is bought with Food Stamps.. is that it would only work for food thats being taken home to be prepared. It would seem the Nutrional aspect in it being a "Supplemental Nutritional Assistance Program" would be negated by making it that much more convenient to eat garbage.

I can understand why you'd rather that they purchased things of better nutrition. I would, too. The fact that it angered you, though, made it seem like you felt advantage was being taken of a system. Maybe I misread what you meant by that.

I think there are underlying issues why poorer people eat cheap junk food (whether purchased from stores or from fast food joints). Part of it is because it's much quicker. Some poor people have plenty of time, some don't in trying to find jobs or working multiple jobs. But it is also true that poorer people have poor habits. Growing up in that environment often doesn't instill good habits, like maintaining a proper diet, or even basic skills like cooking raw ingredients into something edible and minimally tasty. We can vilify them for it or take an "it is what it is" viewpoint...we can try to address it or not. But I think that's the root of it, not how food stamps or SNAP work. If there were no SNAP, whatever money they had for food would still probably be going to fast food and such.

 

[Wheels]

Sorry

I work in a related field

lol no worries just flipping you crap

I think the Timbers all just got their EBT cards. They just weren't hungry last night

The reserve team they put out there probably don't make shit for money.

very true. I only watched it from the feed. Didnt miss much. Although props to the Army last night.. they sure brought it.

 

[blazerboy30]

Why, though? Fast food is definitely not the healthy way to go, but it's hardly a luxury. It's cheap and often what poorer people eat, whether they are paying for it or the government is. In other words, it doesn't seem like that would be an abuse of the system. They're using the money to buy the (cheap) food that they'd buy anyway.

Meanwhile your fellow lefties support implementing taxes are sodas and other unhealthy foods.

So, it is ok for the government to tell us what we shouldn't eat when it is our own money, but not ok for the government to tell people what they shouldn't eat when it is taxpayers' money. Got it.

 

[Wheels]

I can understand why you'd rather that they purchased things of better nutrition. I would, too. The fact that it angered you, though, made it seem like you felt advantage was being taken of a system. Maybe I misread what you meant by that.

I think there are underlying issues why poorer people eat cheap junk food (whether purchased from stores or from fast food joints). Part of it is because it's much quicker. Some poor people have plenty of time, some don't in trying to find jobs or working multiple jobs. But it is also true that poorer people have poor habits. Growing up in that environment often doesn't instill good habits, like maintaining a proper diet, or even basic skills like cooking raw ingredients into something edible and minimally tasty. We can vilify them for it or take an "it is what it is" viewpoint...we can try to address it or not. But I think that's the root of it, not how food stamps or SNAP work. If there were no SNAP, whatever money they had for food would still probably be going to fast food and such.

gotcha... no I dont feel that resentment towards the people on the benefits. Thats what I was trying to make clear in my post to anyone who receives them, or to clarify a little.. cause I could see how it could come across that way. Them spending the money on what is allowed is fully within their rights.

My issue lies with how the program is run, its kinda of off from what its called IMO.. I.e. my department/division of CAF (Children, Adults, and families (please correct me if wrong Barcuda jk)) is called "Self Sufficiency" yet with the rules made the way they are, and how hard advocates push to make things easier on people, I hardly think we help that many people become self sufficient. I have been with the state for going on 4 years, and I can maybe think of 2 instances where I really feel we helped better someone, and helped them with their self sufficiency.

I know Nutrition can be defined as just "Food, or nourishment" but I have also seen it defined as "The process of providing or obtaining the food necessary for health and growth" allowing it to be used for what it is now, IMO doesnt aid with obtaining food necessary for health.

 

[Minstrel]

Meanwhile your fellow lefties support implementing taxes are sodas and other unhealthy foods.

So, it is ok for the government to tell us what we shouldn't eat when it is our own money, but not ok for the government to tell people what they shouldn't eat when it is taxpayers' money. Got it.

I've never supported "health taxes" on sodas and similar types of junk foods. Also, I said in an earlier post that I'm fine with food stamps/vouchers having a more limited grouping of products that they can purchase.

Still got it?

 

[blazerboy30]

I've never supported "health taxes" on sodas and similar types of junk foods. Also, I said in an earlier post that I'm fine with food stamps/vouchers having a more limited grouping of products that they can purchase.

Still got it?

Sorry, I can't keep up with the lefty flip-flopping. I could have sworn you supported Obamacare.

 

[Minstrel]

Sorry, I can't keep up with the lefty flip-flopping.

You mean, you lazily tried to group multiple people's positions into one to create a strawman to fight. That's cool, apology accepted.

I could have sworn you supported Obamacare.

Certainly not all aspects of the health care reform.

 

[blazerboy30]

You mean, you lazily tried to group multiple people's positions into one to create a strawman to fight.

No, I meant what I typed. Why are you creating strawmen?

That's cool, apology accepted.

Typical soft, sensitive, spineless lefty.

Certainly not all aspects of the health care reform.

Way to take a stand. Please refer back to my statement above.

 

[MARIS61]

This. Have the government contract with grocery stores to supply food stamp "food packages" that are sold to the Federal Government at a discount (most raw foods are low margin anyway, so it wouldn't be a huge discount). You show up with your card and you get a grocery bag or two filled with preselected food.

A completely bizarre idea coming from a guy who bitches all the time about big brother government controlling his life.

 

[Minstrel]

No, I meant what I typed. Why are you creating strawmen?



Typical soft, sensitive, spineless lefty.




Way to take a stand. Please refer back to my statement above.

 

[huevonkiller]

I would love some food stamp access at the Four Seasons.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

 

[blazerboy30]

Correction...

I'm PISSED!! :MARIS61: :MARIS61:

 

[MARIS61]

I am in a collage town, Salem is a state town Eugene is a collage town...

It's all in the eye of the beholder.

I see Eugene more as a photomosaic town.

 

[MARIS61]

Does anyone believe that one in five people can't afford to pay for their own food? The math to me doesn't make sense.

As your many previous crusades against the less fortunate have proven time and time again, you're not very good at basic math.

The real number is closer to 50%, but thanks to help from friends and relatives, and fantastic programs like the Oregon Food Bank, most hungry Oregonians never bother to even look into the food stamp program having heard what a hassle it is.

Here's some numbers to toss around:

http://www.oregonfoodbank.org/Understanding-Hunger

http://www.ktvz.com/news/25803401/detail.html

http://www.oregonfoodbank.org/News/...ke-food-a-priority?source=/News/News-Releases

 

[Wheels]

understanding what a hassle it is? It is one of the easiest things to do.. Its overly lenient on what needs to be reported by the client. And easily frauded.

 

[barfo]

Hahahaa Barfo, spoken like a true liberal. Anything opposed to your line of thought is wrong or incorrect, regardless of anything else. You know I have enjoyed good banter, I can have my mind changed, I am not so closed minded that I refuse to see another's point of view. Just because I do not bother to pull up a piece from a year ago, to satisfy only you..well I must be in error.

Ok, let's see you prove that you can have your mind changed. I've done the research for you.

Here are the data on employees of state and local government, according to the census bureau. You can see that there is quite a detailed breakdown, so you can examine it to see if anything is left out. According to the census, there are just under 200,000 state and local government employees in Oregon. 238 of those work at state liquor stores, 3502 are firefighters, etc. You'll note that this list includes both k-12 and higher ed, city, county, state workers. Everything, in fact, except for federal.

Then for federal employees in OR, we have this. As I said before, just over 30,000 federal employees in Oregon.

That's it. 230,000 government employees in Oregon (although those numbers are from 2008 and 2009).

The labor force in Oregon (this excludes farm labor) is about 1.62 million. That's as of March 2011. You'll note, if you look, that that source puts the number of federal, state, and local government employees at 299,000. However, I thought it useful to present the census numbers as well, since they are much more detailed, if older.

So let's take the more recent, and higher number, of 299,000 government employees in Oregon, out of a workforce of 1.62 million. Is that 52%, as you claim? It seems to be 18%. Which, oddly enough, was what the quote in my very first post on this subject said.

Now, am I still "speaking like a true liberal" and "doing liberal math"? Or are you ready to admit that you and Lars were wrong (and not just a little wrong, but way, way off base)?

I await your capitulation.

barfo

 

[MARIS61]

If you count all the private sector jobs that are dependent on government contracts for their survival the number easily approaches 50%.

If you've got 50%, you've got about half.

 

[DaLincolnJones]

Larson, Lars to me
show details 5:36 PM (16 hours ago)

Hard to find it in that form. There are 50,000 state employees (ore more) ...and that's more than any other single industry. Also, in Portland, the biggest five employers are gov, gov, gov, gov, gov

In many small towns, the biggest employer is the local school district...followed by the law enforcement, blm etc

cut

This is part of an email from Lars last night.

I will find out exactly what figures were used to give the numbers I gave you. I believe that looking at just the "government jobs' your numbers would provide a convincing argument, but if one looks deeper, looks at adding things like Oregon National Guard, Those in the military, OD VA, OHSU, union reps for all of the above, contract workers that are not reflected in the figures you have, industries that support the system like Oregon Freezdry that would not be in existence if not for providing MREs, BOM, industries that provide metals for aerospace and military application, NASA, etc etc Its pretty easy to see where I am giong with this, and the numbers ramp up fast.
I will let you know as I dig into this deeper, and I do admit that your questioning has made me interested as well.

 

[MrJayremmie]

Who, specifically? I would think most people against these entitlement programs were also against the bailouts.

No. Not against bailouts, though I wonder how many were against the Bush bailouts while they were going on, and not after the fact.

I'm talking about the fact that when a company took many, many were not in favor of having the money come with strings attached, aka limiting pay in the company until the debt is paid off. This seems close to that.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

If you recall, a lot of the posters here just wanted the systems to fail naturally. invisible hand.

 

[MrJayremmie]

If you recall, a lot of the posters here just wanted the systems to fail naturally. invisible hand.

Again, that isn't what I'm talking about. I'm sure you know that.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I'm much more in favor, philosophically speaking, of programs like Food Vouchers and WIC than of welfare or extended, government-subsidized unemployment benefits. Agree with Maris, though, that many more people are coming to food banks and shelters for free meals in the last year or so than before.

I don't think that limiting the brands/foods you can get with food stamps (or some kind of card or whatever) would be an infringement of the gov't on your life. I mean, it's their help that they're giving you. If the gov't came out to say "no one can go to McD's anymore b/c the food can kill you" that seems different than saying "Brian, I'm giving you a coupon for free lunch, but it's for a Subway sandwich b/c it's healthy and will provide you nutrition until you can buy your own lunches again." I don't think I have the right to say "WTF?! I hate Subway. I wanna free Big Mac!"

My wife helped some WIC ladies as they were shopping for their families. There are specific items that are available...for instance, you can get single-food baby food (like "bananas", "peas", etc.) but not combinations (like "strawberry-banana blend"). Or you could get "Similac" formula, but not "Enfamil". It's odd, though, that you can shop anywhere with them. The same items at WINCO are much cheaper than at Safeway, but you're able to just write the amount on the WIC check.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

wic sounds ideal actually, why wouldnt they just expand that?

 

[44Thrilla]

a kid that works for me (college student) gets food stamps because he's a full time student and "responsible for buying his own food".

the fucking kid lives with his parents, and he didn't lie on the application.