Game Thread 2022-23 Game #38 - BLAZERS @ PACERS - JANUARY 6, 2023 - FRIDAY - 4:00 PM (PDT) ROOT

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Cugel said:
They should consider selling the farm: Nurk, Hart, Dame, , Justise, Grant, and Payton. And Ant if it gets you picks. They desperately need picks. Ant and Grant would be grabbed for sure IMHO by teams going for a deep run.
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Really want us to start from scratch essentially? We are at .500 right now so that's pretty drastic imo. But hey to each their own.
 
AldoTrapani said:
Dame has been looking washed lately
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A shooting slump isn't washed but you always overstate the negative so what you say when going negative has zero validity. I am not shocked that you have turned on Dame today and on Sunday when his shot is back you'll be saying how sorry you are for the bad team he has to play with.. but others in here doing this is pretty fucking weird.
 
KSF-ERIC said:
He’s not all NBA. There are at least 7 guards better this year. Luka, Curry, Ja, SGA, Booker, Mitchell, and Fox.
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He's got better numbers than Fox with far more defensive attention. I expect him to have better numbers and wins than SGA by the end of the season. I think he'll be second team all NBA when this season is over but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
 
riverman said:
Our end games have to be smarter than guys practicing for the 3 pt contest...get to the fucking line with an and one and stop the clock for fuck's sake!
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not only that but it gives guys a breather late in games.

Unless our guards are lights out from outside we aren’t going to win a game
 
blazerkor said:
He's got better numbers than Fox with far more defensive attention. I expect him to have better numbers and wins than SGA by the end of the season. I think he'll be second team all NBA when this season is over but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
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the most recent Dunc’d on podcast had both the hosts agreeing that Dame (at least through this point in the season) was their pick to be 2nd team all nba. Lots of statical arguments to back that up if you want to give it a listen.
 
To everyone who gives up on dame 3 times a week.

I laugh.

Imagine giving up on dame after a decade of him proving you wrong? It's just really, really sad how fairweather they are.

Luckily, I'm not. So I get to not waste energy. Enjoy!
 
4 starters are averaging 35 minutes a game and are worn out. This team needs to find someone who can provide some production off the bench so we don't have to run the starters into the ground. The bench gets killed ever game in production. Until they get some production off the bench, they are going to continue to falter.
 
Freshtown said:
the most recent Dunc’d on podcast had both the hosts agreeing that Dame (at least through this point in the season) was their pick to be 2nd team all nba. Lots of statical arguments to back that up if you want to give it a listen.
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I think Luka and Steph will get the first team if things stay very similar to where they are both statistically and wins and losses. I think the second team will be Dame and likely Ja or Mitchell. Regardless I think Dame will make it on the second or third team. That's still All NBA.
 
Dame will be fine.. He still hasn't played much over the last year so he'll be fine.
 
blazerkor said:
Dame has had a couple of bad shooting games in a row but we've seen that before. The guy hasn't fallen off. Just look at his numbers this season. He's at an all NBA level. The way some of you have turned on him is embarrassing.
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The stats tell me one thing and my eyes are telling me something different.

I don't know if I'd say he's fallen off. I said this a couple of weeks ago that I don't think he looks right and I wouldn't be shocked if we eventually find out that he's hurt again and trying to play through it.

However, the bigger issue for me is his decision-making. Early in the year, he's trying to dribble through three guys and not trusting his teammates. More recently, it's just not putting even some passes I'd consider routine for him in bad places.
 
PCmor7 said:
The stats tell me one thing and my eyes are telling me something different.

I don't know if I'd say he's fallen off. I said this a couple of weeks ago that I don't think he looks right and I wouldn't be shocked if we eventually find out that he's hurt again and trying to play through it.

However, the bigger issue for me is his decision-making. Early in the year, he's trying to dribble through three guys and not trusting his teammates. More recently, it's just not putting even some passes I'd consider routine for him in bad places.
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He's been more active and less accurate with his passing than I've ever seen before. That needs to be better but I do think that's what he was talking about last game when he said that the team wasn't just young in age but young as a team together. He's trying to do different things than he's done before and acclimating to that.
 
DUB said:
We were right in the game until the starting lineup was put back in in the fourth, then we shat the bed.

All the hustle and energy of the bench players evaporated.
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Quite right. That is why I take a bit of issue with some comments after the game talking about the lack of production from the bench. That may be true in a vacuum, but in this case (and on many nights) it's not exactly the bench's fault. They are being efficient, just not getting (or taking) enough shots.
 
PCmor7 said:
The stats tell me one thing and my eyes are telling me something different.

I don't know if I'd say he's fallen off. I said this a couple of weeks ago that I don't think he looks right and I wouldn't be shocked if we eventually find out that he's hurt again and trying to play through it.

However, the bigger issue for me is his decision-making. Early in the year, he's trying to dribble through three guys and not trusting his teammates. More recently, it's just not putting even some passes I'd consider routine for him in bad places.
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And he’s no longer beating guys off the dribble when previously he would have blown by them.

Dame also seems to be complaining to the refs a lot more, to the point of turning his back on the ball, and giving up on a live play just to whine.

Maybe he’s injured/sick, maybe age has caught up with him, either way he needs to pull his finger out, and get his head in the game.
 
blazerkor said:
He's been more active and less accurate with his passing than I've ever seen before. That needs to be better but I do think that's what he was talking about last game when he said that the team wasn't just young in age but young as a team together. He's trying to do different things than he's done before and acclimating to that.
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Our opinions aren't going to align.

Agree with your last sentence, and not just for Dame but for the team in general I'm not thinking this team is anywhere close to as good as it will be. I think there are a lot of growing pains and we've generally been close. I expect the Blazers to be a lot better by the first week of February barring a big injury.

I couldn't disagree more with the accuracy of Dame's passes and his decision-making, though. It might be getting used to playing a new system with new teammates, but he doesn't look close to precise to me and he doesn't have a good feel for when to shoot or when to pass.
 
I just took a gander at Dame's stats. His turnovers per game is at an all-time high. He's made more turnovers in 25 games this year than 29 last year while playing hurt.

His turnovers per 36 minutes and per 100 possessions is the highest of his career, too.

I didn't really need to see the stats to tell me he was loose with the basketball this season, but I didn't realize it was that pronounced. That doesn't include the number of passes I've seen him pass lately that were too look or high or got tipped by defenders that weren't a turnover on him but resulted in a bad shot or turnover from a teammate.
 
blazerkor said:
He's got better numbers than Fox with far more defensive attention. I expect him to have better numbers and wins than SGA by the end of the season. I think he'll be second team all NBA when this season is over but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
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SGA will make it. Fox is better defensively than Dame this year and is leading the Kings to playoffs right now.
 
Strenuus said:
To everyone who gives up on dame 3 times a week.

I laugh.

Imagine giving up on dame after a decade of him proving you wrong? It's just really, really sad how fairweather they are.

Luckily, I'm not. So I get to not waste energy. Enjoy!
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Dame has never gotten us to championship. That is all I care about. He has proven nothing.
 
blazerkor said:
I think Luka and Steph will get the first team if things stay very similar to where they are both statistically and wins and losses. I think the second team will be Dame and likely Ja or Mitchell. Regardless I think Dame will make it on the second or third team. That's still All NBA.
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Booker? Fox? SGA? Also Harden and Kyrie.
 
DUB said:
We were right in the game until the starting lineup was put back in in the fourth, then we shat the bed.

All the hustle and energy of the bench players evaporated.
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Walker should’ve been in there. Take out Hart, I don’t care. No one on the team can do what Walker does.
 
Walker kind of reminds me of a Brian Grant type player. Seems to have a will to get to the ball at times.
 
blazerkor said:
A shooting slump isn't washed but you always overstate the negative so what you say when going negative has zero validity. I am not shocked that you have turned on Dame today and on Sunday when his shot is back you'll be saying how sorry you are for the bad team he has to play with.. but others in here doing this is pretty fucking weird.
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Dude stop he’s almost 33 it makes sense

this team is trash
 
PCmor7 said:
The stats tell me one thing and my eyes are telling me something different.

I don't know if I'd say he's fallen off. I said this a couple of weeks ago that I don't think he looks right and I wouldn't be shocked if we eventually find out that he's hurt again and trying to play through it.

However, the bigger issue for me is his decision-making. Early in the year, he's trying to dribble through three guys and not trusting his teammates. More recently, it's just not putting even some passes I'd consider routine for him in bad places.
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what is more likely:

a) that in his 11th season he has suddenly become more careless with the ball for no reason at all;

B) or that in his first season playing off the ball in Chauncey's new offense with 3 new starters, his role has changed enough that he's getting the ball in unfamiliar spots on the floor and later in the shot clock resulting in more turnovers

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some numbers I'm looking at...

turnovers/game:

2019-20 2.9
2020-21 3.0
2021-22 2.9
2022-23 3.3

so, 0.4 turnovers/game more while he's adjusting to a new offense and 3 new starting teammates. The way some of you are talking it's like he's doubled his turnovers

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3 point attempt rate:

2018-19 .419
2019-20 .500
2020-21 .528
2021-22 .514
2022-23 .568

% of FGA at rim:

2018-19 .297
2019-20 .295
2020-21 .238
2021-22 .239
2022-23 .213

I don't believe he should be shooting that high a rate of three's, or that low a rate at the rim. If this is scheme, it needs to be adjusted. And Dame should exercise some shot selection here. He doesn't have to subtract a couple of three's a game and drive all the way to the rim; he's shooting by far his highest percentage in the 3-10' zone. 48.9% in that zone and 43.8% in the 10-16' zone. Those are good mid-range numbers, the best of his career, by far, and he'd be more likely to draw shooting fouls there
 
@wizenheimer ...to be fair, after this many year in the league, where exactly are "unfamiliar spots on the floor?" Legitimate question, and not purposefully objectionable. It's not like he is being asked to post up 8-10 times a game, or running the dunkers spot. What spots do you feel he is unfamiliar with?
 
TBpup said:
@wizenheimer ...to be fair, after this many year in the league, where exactly are "unfamiliar spots on the floor?" Legitimate question, and not purposefully objectionable. It's not like he is being asked to post up 8-10 times a game, or running the dunkers spot. What spots do you feel he is unfamiliar with?
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dame spoke about this.



3:33 mark

He especially is breaking habits that are 10 yrs in the making. What's important is he recognizes the value of changing the way he's asked to play and respecting the coach instead of saying my way or the highway...

let's give it a few more weeks. similar kinda growing pains were noticed in boston midway through last year until it suddenly kicked in.
 
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