Game Thread 2023-24 Game #25 - BLAZERS VS WARRIORS - DECEMBER 17, 2023 - SUNDAY - 6:00 PM PST - ROOT

[Chris Craig]

I’m guessing you haven’t watch Moses Brown much….

Moses isn't a starter.

And Moses has actually outplayed him at times. That is fucking sad.

 

[Tince]

I'm not blaming refs, i'm just agreeing with Blazers PR blaming the refs. President Adam Silver loves his Warriors. This game was a scam !! (in all seriousness, the ref didn't have to review it because Grant was slapping at the ball with his feet by the camera guy. It was a no dought outta bounds decision.)

I can't find a good replay of it.

 

[Tince]

I was sitting right across from the Warriors bench (Blazers season ticket holder person handed me upgraded tickets as I was heading towards the escalator to go sit with my fellow not rich people - nice suprise!) and Brogdon clearly looked at Ayton before the missed Curry free throw and signaled timeout - so I was shocked when we didn't call it.

If that was the case, that means Brogdon either knew the plan was to call timeout (or was just doing it on his own) and either Ayton wasn't told the plan or didn't follow-through with the plan.

Either way, great info. Thanks!

 

[Tince]

what difference does that make?

I gave an opinion of Ayton as a player...that he's overrated and overpaid. That had nothing to do with Camara

I'm asking a question because I'm curious. What's the problem with answering it?

 

[illmatic99]

This is exactly who Ayton is.

Nurk & Ayton are the same tier of players.

i was hoping he was better than this.

 

[Chris Craig]

I was sitting right across from the Warriors bench (Blazers season ticket holder person handed me upgraded tickets as I was heading towards the escalator to go sit with my fellow not rich people - nice suprise!) and Brogdon clearly looked at Ayton before the missed Curry free throw and signaled timeout - so I was shocked when we didn't call it.

Wow. They are giving tickets away now. This team is beyond bad.

 

[wizenheimer]

Overrated by whom? The Suns basically begged us to take him.

overrated by a whole bunch of people here before and after the trade. I know because I had plenty of arguments with them. I seem to remember a thread were some people were predicting 22-23 points/game, lots of double-doubles and strong defense

 

[Whyachi]

I don’t understand people who are so upset about Ayton. We didn’t draft him first overall. We got him from the suns for two scrubs and Nurk. It was a low risk, high reward trade. Who cares if he’s inconsistent and mediocre? We have him for a few more seasons and if we let him walk we aren’t out anything. We got Camara out of the trade. Clearly Schmitz wanted him. People acting like we stumbled into Toumani.

I'm just glad Blazer fans are upset. Whether it's Ayton or Coach or those evil cheater head refs. Losing streaks SUCK, and i'm happy to see some passion within the Blazers community.

 

[RR7]

Looks like Simons was 5-8 from the field in the 4th, a +1, 13 points. 1 steal, 1 TO, 1 rebound. Guessing we're not bringing up his 4th quarter production tonight?

 

[PCmor7]

One other observation about tonight: Without going through and watching the entire game tape, it seemed to me our problems defending the screen and roll were with the rotation of our other three defenders.

I thought Ayton did a great job showing and staying with guys like Steph. He's willing to do it and he has the combination of agility and length to be good at it. Maybe the idea was for the switch to be made and the defensive chasers were slow to do that, but it looked to me like it was the responsibility of other guys to slide over and they were consistently late in doing so.

Probably didn't help that the Warriors other guys had great shooting nights beyond the arc. In the other games I've watched them this year -- admittedly a small sample size -- they weren't this hot, not like GSW teams of the past.

 

[Tince]

I don’t understand people who are so upset about Ayton. We didn’t draft him first overall. We got him from the suns for two scrubs and Nurk. It was a low risk, high reward trade. Who cares if he’s inconsistent and mediocre? We have him for a few more seasons and if we let him walk we aren’t out anything. We got Camara out of the trade. Clearly Schmitz wanted him. People acting like we stumbled into Toumani.

We kinda did luck into to Toumani. If Cronin knew how good he was but decided to draft Murray and/or not trade a future 2nd to pick him, he's an idiot.

Regarding Ayton, I agree. There is pretty much zero chance he'll be making $30m/year when this team is good enough to contend. If he is, that means he got a lot better than he is now, which would be awesome too!

 

[Tince]

I'm just glad Blazer fans are upset. Whether it's Ayton or Coach or those evil cheater head refs. Losing streaks SUCK, and i'm happy to see some passion within the Blazers community.

I'm upset with you!

 

[Chris Craig]

Overrated by whom? The Suns basically begged us to take him.

Now I see why

 

[Tince]

Looks like Simons was 5-8 from the field in the 4th, a +1, 13 points. 1 steal, 1 TO, 1 rebound. Guessing we're not bringing up his 4th quarter production tonight?

 

[Tince]

I'm not blaming refs, i'm just agreeing with Blazers PR blaming the refs. President Adam Silver loves his Warriors. This game was a scam !! (in all seriousness, the ref didn't have to review it because Grant was slapping at the ball with his feet by the camera guy. It was a no dought outta bounds decision.)

Jay Allen doesn't work for the Blazers or even cover them anymore.

 

[Chris Craig]

We kinda did luck into to Toumani. If Cronin knew how good he was but decided to draft Murray and/or not trade a future 2nd to pick him, he's an idiot.

Regarding Ayton, I agree. There is pretty much zero chance he'll be making $30m/year when this team is good enough to contend. If he is, that means he got a lot better than he is now, which would be awesome too!

I hope he gets better. Because right now, he is hardly even worth having on the court. Duop Reath plays better than he does..

 

[Chris Craig]

Looks like Simons was 5-8 from the field in the 4th, a +1, 13 points. 1 steal, 1 TO, 1 rebound. Guessing we're not bringing up his 4th quarter production tonight?

We're supposed to forgive him for fucking us the other three quarters?

 

[Tince]

One thing I'm going to be eyeing the next few games is Shaedon.

He's so laid back that it's hard to get a read on him, but I thought I detected an expression on his face in the middle of the fourth quarter that I've seen before when players are disgusted or feel they're being treated dismissively.

He's been so visibly invisible the last couple of games, and three potentialities come to mind.

1. Chauncey isn't involving him in the offense.

2. Shaedon's not hunting shots because he feels he's not on the level of guys like Ant and Jeremi and doesn't want to upset the apple cart.

3. He's been made to feel like a second-class citizen by one of the team's top dogs and his lack of initiative on the offensive end it a show of rebellion or displeasure with how he's being treated.

I'd love to know how these guys personality's mesh and what it's like in the locker room.

We'll probably never know exactly what the deal is, but I know Billups pubically expressed frustration with Sharpe because they would go out of their way to put him in advantageous positions and Sharpe would more or less refuse to be aggressive and take advantage. If that's how Billups feels (it somewhat matches up with what I see), then I can understand why he's not putting a ton of effort to get him the ball in those positions.

I find it hard to believe any of the coaches or front office guys want anything but for Sharpe to be THE GUY

 

[illmatic99]

overrated by a whole bunch of people here before and after the trade. I know because I had plenty of arguments with them. I seem to remember a thread were some people were predicting 22-23 points/game, lots of double-doubles and strong defense

Hindsight is nice but he averaged 18/10 on a team with other high usage guards. Expecting him to slightly outplay that is not as ridiculous as you are intimating. He is underperforming by every standard. And that's unexpected.

 

[Tince]

I hope he gets better. Because right now, he is hardly even worth having on the court. Duop Reath plays better than he does..

I'm not as low on him as you, but I am bummed that he's not producing at a consistent level or near what he's skillset suggests he could.

 

[OneSport3]

We're supposed to forgive him for fucking us the other three quarters?

GSW goes up by 22 points with 10:14 left in the 3rd quarter. Ant proceeds to score or assist on 15 points to cut the lead to single digits.

GSW goes up by 11 points with 4:30 left in the 4th quarter. Ant proceeds to score 10 points to cut the lead to 1 point, giving us a chance to win the game.

Ant has 7 assists in this game. Second to Curry and CP3 with 8 each.

But this dude is awful, let’s trade or bench him.

 

[Whyachi]

Jay Allen doesn't work for the Blazers or even cover them anymore.

oh thank god ... see, the Blazers are making some real progress towards the future.

 

[Natebishop3]

GSW goes up by 22 points with 10:14 left in the 3rd quarter. Ant proceeds to score or assist on 15 points to cut the lead to single digits.

GSW goes up by 11 points with 4:30 left in the 4th quarter. Ant proceeds to score 10 points to cut the lead to 1 point, giving us a chance to win the game.

Ant has 7 assists in this game. Second to Curry and CP3 with 8 each.

But this dude is awful, let’s trade or bench him.

Ant isn't awful. The TEAM has ben awful since he came back. At least more awful than they were before.

 

[illmatic99]

Ant isn't awful. The TEAM has ben awful since he came back. At least more awful than they were before.

I think the problem (on defense) has been DeAndre. Ant is playing both ends very hard.

 

[PCmor7]

We'll probably never know exactly what the deal is, but I know Billups pubically expressed frustration with Sharpe because they would go out of their way to put him in advantageous positions and Sharpe would more or less refuse to be aggressive and take advantage. If that's how Billups feels (it somewhat matches up with what I see), then I can understand why he's not putting a ton of effort to get him the ball in those positions.

I find it hard to believe any of the coaches or front office guys want anything but for Sharpe to be THE GUY

I'm sure.

And yet it's undeniable that he's very willing to look for his offense when certain guys aren't playing. I'm speculating that it might not be an issue with the coaches. The issue might be more along the lines of stronger or more aggressive personalities in the locker room marking their territory in Shaedon's mind.

 

[Tince]

Again, what does that have to do with whether he sucks? I can hate iso ball and still agree that someone doesn’t suck, no? I have been frustrated with Simons but I don’t think he sucks.

I'm honestly trying to understand what you're getting at.

I'm confident you don't want Ant at PG.
I can't tell if you want Brogdon at PG or not.

 

[TBpup]

GSW goes up by 22 points with 10:14 left in the 3rd quarter. Ant proceeds to score or assist on 15 points to cut the lead to single digits.

GSW goes up by 11 points with 4:30 left in the 4th quarter. Ant proceeds to score 10 points to cut the lead to 1 point, giving us a chance to win the game.

Ant has 7 assists in this game. Second to Curry and CP3 with 8 each.

But this dude is awful, let’s trade or bench him.

That was the good. Him going at least 5 no-pass possessions late in the 2nd quarter led to a big deficit and his teammates were left standing around not doing anything and getting completely out of rhythm. Those 5 possessions led to 2 missed shots, 2 turnovers and a charge. It was brutal. 1-on-5 while COMPLETELY ignoring his entire team. And you could visibly see the defensive effort go down as 4 of 5 players on the Blazers were being asked to stand around on offense and then have to just play defense on the other end.

Ant can be brilliant offensive talent, but the Blazers defense has visibly suffered since he came back and Shaedon has basically disappeared because he ends up standing in the corner on possession after possession.

 

[BankTeller]

We kinda did luck into to Toumani. If Cronin knew how good he was but decided to draft Murray and/or not trade a future 2nd to pick him, he's an idiot.

Regarding Ayton, I agree. There is pretty much zero chance he'll be making $30m/year when this team is good enough to contend. If he is, that means he got a lot better than he is now, which would be awesome too!

I don’t think he’s going to be seeing that kind of money again. But by the time the guards are ready to compete, he won’t be here.

 

[Tince]

I'm sure.

And yet it's undeniable that he's very willing to look for his offense when certain guys aren't playing. I'm speculating that it might not be an issue with the coaches. The issue might be more along the lines of stronger or more aggressive personalities in the locker room marking their territory in Shaedon's mind.

If we have to surround Sharpe with a bunch of G-League guys for him to be aggressive, that's a problem because we're never going to contend with Sharpe and a bunch of G-League guys.

Dame didn't wait for the approval of LMA, Batum, and Matthews.
Roy didn't wait for the approval of Z-Bo and Miles

If he's going to be an all-star for this club, Sharpe needs to be willing to assert himself with other good players on the floor.

 

[Whyachi]

GSW goes up by 22 points with 10:14 left in the 3rd quarter. Ant proceeds to score or assist on 15 points to cut the lead to single digits.

GSW goes up by 11 points with 4:30 left in the 4th quarter. Ant proceeds to score 10 points to cut the lead to 1 point, giving us a chance to win the game.

Ant has 7 assists in this game. Second to Curry and CP3 with 8 each.

But this dude is awful, let’s trade or bench him.

It's not up to us whether Ant gets traded. He's an exciting scorer on a decent contract. That front office phone might ring, and if there's draft picks on the other line, then Cronin can't say no. 1 good Blazer has to go to make room for more rookies. It's not like Jody Allen is going to pay luxury tax for this Blazers farm system team.