Game Thread 2024-25 GAME #5 - BLAZERS @ CLIPPERS - OCTOBER 30, 2024 - WED - 7:30 PM - KATU 2.2 - BLAZERVISION

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SharpeScooterShooter said:
again simply your opinion. if you think there is zero benefit, i cant read anything else. You are simply wrong.
Hell i saw grant walking out with walker talking to him. You have no clue what they work on, off the court aNd to imply you do makes it tough to take you serious on this. you don't know that Grant isn't showing walker how to position himself with the back to the basket, etc.

You dont know that ant isn't working with scoot on his shot. You dont know that Ayton isnt working with Klingon.

Take a break. Breathe. It will all be fine. It seems you are letting a small issue turn into the end of the world in your head.
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Wrong.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Wrong.
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Curious. What makes you think im wrong? You have witnessed the practices? Off court conversation?

Or are you saying im wrong in what i saw with Grant and Walker?

Please post some video of the practices you go to that prove that my opinion is wrong. if not, this “wrong” post is just silly…

Do the words, “that could be possible, but i doubt it”, exist in your vocab?
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
Curious. What makes you think im wrong? You have witnessed the practices? Off court conversation?

Or are you saying im wrong in what i saw with Grant and Walker?

Please post some video of the practices you go to that prove that my opinion is wrong. if not, this “wrong” post is just silly…

Do the words, “that could be possible, but i doubt it”, exist in your vocab?
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You aren't going to learn beneficial things from players who are getting by on their god-given talents alone.

Both Simons and Grant have been gifted their abilities. They choose not to do the hard thing and just get by on their naturally gifted abilities.

I don't want any of our young players learning those habits.

I'd much prefer they learn habits from a player who has average athleticism and average size but whose habits have allowed them to play in the NBA.

Those players typically make far less money. Those players never play the way Simons & Grant play.

If you get players with the talents of Scoot and Sharpe to learn from those kinds of players you wind up with championship caliber players.
 
Phatguysrule said:
You aren't going to learn beneficial things from players who are getting by on their god-given talents alone.

Both Simons and Grant have been gifted their abilities. They choose not to do the hard thing and just get by on their naturally gifted abilities.

I don't want any of our young players learning those habits.

I'd much prefer they learn habits from a player who has average athleticism and average size but whose habits have allowed them to play in the NBA.

Those players typically make far less money. Those players never play the way Simons & Grant play.

If you get players with the talents of Scoot and Sharpe to learn from those kinds of players you wind up with championship caliber players.
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There are far too many assumptions in thos to rake seriously.
Like athletes make it to this level without working hard?
You seriously think Ant and Grant arent doing anything to try to improve thier game?
Id likely say you are wrong on that.
 
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SharpeScooterShooter said:
There are far too many assumptions in thos to rake seriously.
Like athletes make it to this level without working hard?
You seriously think Ant and Grant arent doing anything to try to improve thier game?
Id likely say you are wrong on that.
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Well, I didn't say they aren't doing anything to improve their games. Both of them very clearly put in work on the offensive side of the ball. And I didn't say they don't work hard.

Ant is definitely not working hard on defense. Grant is definitely not working hard on rebounding.

That indicates that they aren't trying to fix their glaring weaknesses. And haven't done so even after 7 plus years in the league.

Those aren't assumptions. Both of those guys are perfectly capable of doing those incredibly important tasks. They are among the worst in the league at them because they don't care about them.

And they are being rewarded by being able to dominate our whole offense and get the most minutes on the team.

No, I don't want our young players learning that.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
Well, I didn't say they aren't doing anything to improve their games. Both of them very clearly put in work on the offensive side of the ball. And I didn't say they don't work hard.

Ant is definitely not working hard on defense. Grant is definitely not working hard on rebounding.

That indicates that they aren't trying to fix their glaring weaknesses. And haven't done so even after 7 plus years in the league.

Those aren't assumptions. Both of those guys are perfectly capable of doing those incredibly important tasks. They are among the worst in the league at them because they don't care about them.

And they are being rewarded by being able to dominate our whole offense and get the most minutes on the team.

No, I don't want our young players learning that.
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This is 100% an assumption.
Check out websters…
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
This is 100% an assumption.
Check out websters…
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Okay, if you're using Webster's overly broad definition then literally any statement can be viewed as an assumption. And what I'm saying is an assumption based on facts and data.

Either way, your point is completely invalid, and you're now just arguing for the sake of arguing.

They are literally each among the worst in the league at these things that they are uniquely physically and athletically capable of doing (Ant defense in general. Grant, rebounding in general). These are facts.

They are being rewarded both financially and with maximum playing time and maximum offensive opportunity for being uniquely bad at the aforementioned critical aspects of basketball.
This is a fact.

I do not want our young players to learn that this is an acceptable path.

None of that is an assumption, as is commonly used.

Feel free to argue any of that if you like.
 
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The problem with Grant/Ayton/Ants contributions to this team is even with them we're a bottom 5 NBA offense. They are earning $90 million. So what benefit does that really provide this team or show our youth to watch veterans lead us to such a poor performance?

If we had more of our youth taking some of their roles and developing would we be worse? Almost certainly, but being 2nd worse or 5th worse just doesn't matter much in a season like this. It doesn't matter much for the next 2 years.

Now I do think we should keep ONE of them on this team. It's nice to have a veteran who they can turn to if we have a deer in the headlights moment and need someone to lead the way. But we don't need ALL THREE of them when were in this deep rebuild.

Also, having some youth in those roles would let us go all out to win with 100% effort instead of doing these fake injuries to tank for the 4th year. That is as damaging if not more so to our young players development. We need a culture of at least trying 100% to win, that has not been the case at all since Olshey was fired.
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
There are far too many assumptions in thos to rake seriously.
Like athletes make it to this level without working hard?
You seriously think Ant and Grant arent doing anything to try to improve thier game?
Id likely say you are wrong on that.
Click to expand...

"Star" players know they will play long minutes and play accordingly.

Billups treats Grant like he's a Star.

Grant was really bad last game and played more minutes than Walker, Murray, and Rupert combined.

The message there is that you can have a completely shitty game, and all is well. You can sleep tight after the game. No worries.

There's no way Billups would allow one of Rupert, Walker, or Murray to play 34 minutes

AND shoot 3-14 with only 3 rebounds. No Way. Not if everyone is healthy.

GRANT IS NOT A STAR.

Billups immediately needs to STOP treating Grant like he's anything more than a good-at-times veteran role player.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Okay, if you're using Webster's overly broad definition then literally any statement can be viewed as an assumption. And what I'm saying is an assumption based on facts and data.

Either way, your point is completely invalid, and you're now just arguing for the sake of arguing.

They are literally each among the worst in the league at these things that they are uniquely physically and athletically capable of doing (Ant defense in general. Grant, rebounding in general). These are facts.

They are being rewarded both financially and with maximum playing time and maximum offensive opportunity for being uniquely bad at the aforementioned critical aspects of basketball.
This is a fact.

I do not want our young players to learn that this is an acceptable path.

None of that is an assumption, as is commonly used.

Feel free to argue any of that if you like.
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You refer far too often as if you know whats in their heads for a fact. That has nothing to do with numbers and data. Do you converse with them daily?

No, there is no arguing to argue, but nice attempt at defering….
You are the one claiming you know what they think, which has nothing to do with data.
Do you know how many players have weaknesses they are unable to significantly improve upon but still have good careers?
Do you really think it’s because they don't care? That they don't want to be better and don't work hard to do so?

im sorry, you are just off base on this.
Hate on them because they are inconsistent, like most non all star players…
but to question their heart, desires and off court effort to improve and want them gone in part, because you believe you know what’s in their head?
That’s where you lose me…
 
SharpeScooterShooter said:
You refer far too often as if you know whats in their heads for a fact. That has nothing to do with numbers and data. Do you converse with them daily?

No, there is no arguing to argue, but nice attempt at defering….
You are the one claiming you know what they think, which has nothing to do with data.
Do you know how many players have weaknesses they are unable to significantly improve upon but still have good careers?
Do you really think it’s because they don't care? That they don't want to be better and don't work hard to do so?

im sorry, you are just off base on this.
Hate on them because they are inconsistent, like most non all star players…
but to question their heart, desires and off court effort to improve and want them gone in part, because you believe you know what’s in their head?
That’s where you lose me…
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None of that has anything to do with what I said. You're just arguing to argue.
 
blazerfan11 said:
"Star" players know they will play long minutes and play accordingly.

Billups treats Grant like he's a Star.

Grant was really bad last game and played more minutes than Walker, Murray, and Rupert combined.

The message there is that you can have a completely shitty game, and all is well. You can sleep tight after the game. No worries.

There's no way Billups would allow one of Rupert, Walker, or Murray to play 34 minutes

AND shoot 3-14 with only 3 rebounds. No Way. Not if everyone is healthy.

GRANT IS NOT A STAR.

Billups immediately needs to STOP treating Grant like he's anything more than a good-at-times veteran role player.
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One game.
28/5 and 34/6 in two of the five games. Another game he got 8 rebounds.
It feels like you are cherry picking the negative and dismissing when he is good.
He is a star player. He is not an all star. Stars are less consistent than all stars or they would be just that.
And i would bet my house if you asked around the league, overwhelming majority would say he is not just a role player, but is a star.

There is also something to be said about allowing players to shoot/play through poor play. Grant can be streaky with his shooting. Need to let players play through to the next streak.

with that said, if Grant is playing poor on both ends, id prefer quicker sub outs to jabari.

But Billups wants to win and you cant blame him. He knows Grant is by far a better option than anyone on the bench currently, so he is gonna likely stick with him until Cronin trades him.
What im not is upset about it. There is more time than people seem to think, like a trade now vs at the deadline is going to make or break the learning curve of the team?
Like a few more wins is going to provide drastically worse odds in the lotto?

People be freaking likes its a mountain when its a molehill.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
None of that has anything to do with what I said. You're just arguing to argue.
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Lol. Sure. If you aren't able to address what you said, then i get it. But don't claim I am trying to argue. You clearly made statements that you know what they think in regards to their weaknesses and whether they care about improving them. Now you cop out like this?

Thats a rhetorical question not needing an answer cause i no longer care. i thought you could be on the up and up enough to clarify what you said or man up to the wild assumptions.
I was clearly wrong. ;)
 
Phatguysrule said:
Yet here you are... Still trying to argue...
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who's arguing? Im having fun! But i love how you use that statement for anything when you aren't able to answer questions. Its entertaining. It’s like taking your ball and going home. Funny stuff man!
 
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