2025 Playoffs

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You have to give Edmonton a ton of credit; they are explosive man. To comeback and tie it at 3 was huge. Going to be a heck of a 3rd period, an extremely important period, you could say the winner of the 3rd is the favorite to win the Cup.
 
Bennett's going to get paid, would love to see him in a Rangers jersey but Drury needs to move a few more pieces . Hard to argue against Bill Zito being the best GM in the NHL, 3 straight Cup appearances and the ability to improve the team each year.
 
I love to see Bennett here, but I don’t think he’s a New York guy, but I don’t know.
 
Dominant win for the Cup, the Oilers looked tired and overmatched. I don't doubt they will make a strong offer to Connor to keep him July 1st, the question is whether he'll sign it or not. Bennett would be a great addition but Florida has the money to resign him, I'd be shocked if they let him go. Time for Drury to wake up and accomplish something maybe by starting off resigning Rempe and Robertson.
 
Despite our douchebag commissioner denying it. The tax thing is real and it’s a huge advantage. Also, the bullshit of putting players on injured reserve so you can sign more guys at the deadline needs to come to a fucking end.
 
The tax “advantage” has been there forever and yet it’s not til recently that the FL teams started winning. No one mentioned it when they sucked for years. Texas and Nevada also don’t have personal income taxes but no one says anything about that the Stars or Knights.
 
You sound like Bettman. Means nothing. Those teams tanked for a while. Both got corner stone pieces by tanking. Then after they had them they built the team up and the tax break is a big deal. Knights won a cup and the Stars have made the conference finals what? Three years in a row.
 
The Stars have been around more than 30 years and have 1 cup. Panthers are the same age and took them decades to win their first playoff series. It all comes down to strong management, something we should be very aware of given the shitshows we have lived through with the Rangers.
 
The no tax thing didn't matter until the cap came into place, because teams couldn't spend whatever they wanted to anymore. And it's been even more pronounced the past few years with the cap not really going up at all, it gave no tax teams a little bigger edge. It should get a bit more even with larger cap jumps the next few seasons. I do think it's an advantage, 5 of the past 6 champs come from a no tax state.

With that said, as with most things it isn't the only factor. To your point 31, if you run a sh*t organization, you will suck, no tax state or not, so management/leadership matters most of all of course. But there is an edge for the no tax state teams, Brooks has written about that advantage for a few years now.
 
It is an advantage, but hardly a big one. The states with the highest tax rates are around 10%, so those teams in non-income tax states have a 10% cap advantage over some teams, but not all. Some states like CO only pay 4.4%. Would not consider that a difference maker, and certainly not going to make up for incompetent management.

Is a player who's going to make $10M a year really going to choose Florida over NY because of $1M?

The advantage may be even less. Certainly don't know how it works in the professional sports world, but with the whole work from home and people relocating, states complained and when i was at my last company, they launched this tracking tool where you had to enter the dates you were traveling to certain states (ie. income tax states) and if your spent more than X days in a state (forget how many it was), you would have income tax withheld from that state. Al being a tax guy may know more on that process.
 
You get taxed in the state you earn income...so Florida players still get taxed for the games played in states that have a income tax..ny players are taxed on all their income as a NY resident..they do get a credit for taxes paid in other states


So when the rangers play say San jose..they pay California income tax for 2 games worth of their salary...they also pay NY income tax but on their NY return they get credit for the California tax they pay..

Not fun doing their tax returns
 
Agreed, but when you play for a Florida team, that means more than half your games have no state income tax (the games in Florida and the games in other no income tax states). I think we all agree it appears, it is an advantage, but it certainly isn't more important than having a well-run organization that makes the correct decisions on players and staff etc.

And I maintain it was made worse by having essentially a flat cap, which to me means it will become a little less impactful as we move forward and the cap starts to rise at solid levels the next few seasons.
 
Point is, no matter what advantage they have, it needs to be eliminated. The injured reserve crap is beyond stupid. Bettman is a terrible commissioner. I supported him for years but he's getting worse and worse. Parros is an inept dumbass. The fact Bettman keeps him employed is pathetic.
 
It doesn’t need to be eliminated because it’s not a significant one. It’s an advantage they have by nature of the states they are based out of, just like the teams in the northeast have the advantage of having a large cluster of teams in the area so they do a lot less travel than the west coast or Florida teams.
 
Wrong. No team should have even the slightest advantage. How big or small that advantage is does not matter. Every team financially should be equal with the cap and shit they can do. It's not rocket science.
 
Get rid of the FL and TX teams. Problem solved.
Fucking stupid argument.
 
It's an advantage, and more than just a very slight one IMO, but it is what it is AND if you don't have good ownership and leadership making decisions, that advantage doesn't mean S*IT. A well-run organization is a well-run organization, state income tax or no state income tax. That's the most important aspect of winning teams IMO.
 
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Well run organizations getting up to a 10% advantage on their entire payroll is the difference between an all star and a 4th line player
 
BigDaddyAl1973 said:
Well run organizations getting up to a 10% advantage on their entire payroll is the difference between an all star and a 4th line player
Click to expand...

except you demonstrated it’s nowhere near that as half the games are played in states with income tax that the players pay.
 
If you play for a no state income tax team, that's 1/2 your games. Then you add in road games where there is no state income tax, TX (Stars), FL (Panthers & Lightning), NV (Golden Knights), TN (Preds), WA (Kraken). You could play upwards of 47 or 48 games in no income tax states if you play for one of those six teams, compared to 6 or 7 games if you don't play for any of those teams. Plus, most of these guys are making big salaries, so they pay more raw dollars as well.

That's more impactful than just a slight advantage. Again, it does not outweigh good ownership and leadership, but it is an advantage for those 6 teams, and 5 of the past 6 Cups have been won by those teams, which I would say were the most impactful years due to an essentially flat cap, that may not be a coincidence.
 
it's probably more impactful the advantage east coast teams have with travel. There is a massive difference between what teams like DAL or FL have to travel than what teams like NY do where they can hop on a short bus ride after the game vs. getting on a long flight. Anyone who's traveled knows the impact it has on a person.

 
I don't see how the tax break has anything to do with Bill Zito being the best GM in hockey. He manages to acquire Tkachuk for Huberdeau and Bennett for Emil Heineman to win the Cup last year. Then he gets Marchand this year for a 2nd round pick who is integral to the repeat Cup win. Who knows what he'll be doing this offseason to make another run? I'm not dismissing the tax code as a factor for some but winning the Cup usually becomes a priority for most players as they get older.
 
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NYR31 said:
except you demonstrated it’s nowhere near that as half the games are played in states with income tax that the players pay.
Click to expand...
Except it is....

A NYR pays NY Income Tax or NJ or CT income tax on 100% of their earnings, whether it is earned in NY,NY, CT or not. Where as a player from a Florida team only pays state income tax when playing a game in a state that has income tax. So yes the difference in terms of the entire team salary, the savings can be the difference between a 4th liner and an all star.
 
I imagine with no proof that when most UFAs are deciding between multiple offers, they aren't as concerned with the state income tax rate of the destinations vs the prospect of winning a Cup. Assuming identical offers in terms of years/salary from teams that have different state income tax implications....if a player is more concerned about losing money due to income tax vs getting a legitimate chance to compete for a Stanley Cup, you probably don't want that player on your roster anyway.
 
Greyvtrayn said:
I imagine with no proof that when most UFAs are deciding between multiple offers, they aren't as concerned with the state income tax rate of the destinations vs the prospect of winning a Cup. Assuming identical offers in terms of years/salary from teams that have different state income tax implications....if a player is more concerned about losing money due to income tax vs getting a legitimate chance to compete for a Stanley Cup, you probably don't want that player on your roster anyway.
Click to expand...
if two equal teams have the chance at the Cup, money does play a role in the decision..one of many parts to deciding where a player would go
 
I think it's all of the above. Not sure a player will take similar, or even a little more, money from a bad team in a no income tax state, over a good team in an income tax state, but if things are all reasonably close, I think it can/does make a difference. I don't think anyone is saying players will go to terrible teams solely due to no state income tax, but it's one of the tools in the toolbox teams can use when they don't have state income tax. Like I mentioned, 5 of the past 6 Cups have been won by teams with no state income tax, that is a little bit of a trend IMO.

With all that said, the main factor with regards to winning consistently, is having a well-run organization with good leadership, that's the most important deciding factor. If you make poor decisions and are poorly run, you will not win consistently, state income tax or not.

For what it's worth, Brooks has written a few articles on this, and thinks it is an unfair advantage for the teams with no state income tax.
 
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