OT Anthem Politics

[dviss1]

80+ million natives didn't just die for this country.... they died for Canada and Mexico and Guatemala and Brazil and Argentina and Chile and Peru and I can go on and on.

You are so consumed with your hatred, you'll believe anything to justify it.

Minimizer... Newsflash:

Being pro black doesn't mean you're anti white.

But you can continue to paint whatever picture you want about me. IDGAF what you think about me. You don't know me.

 

[dviss1]

slavery is illegal.

Did it make everything okay? Hello no... but this country has done more than any other in trying to rectify its mistakes and to end slavery here and across the globe. Shit doesn't change overnight as everyone knows. Things take time and Kaperprick is acting as if nothing has improved and nobody is doing anything. As a matter of fact, in one interview he sounded as if he thinks the average american doesn't know there even is a race problem.

Y'all don't even know that slavery is still legal... Mass incarceration is the new slavery. Take 3 minutes of your time and try to gain perspective.

 

[Natebishop3]

I disagree that the all lives matter croud wants to end the status quo. How many survivors (and their families) do we tell to get over the holocaust? That's right. Not one. Yet we're told everyday to get over slavery, Jim Crow, mass incarceration, and killing of unarmed blacks. Every day we're told this. Not only did America commit slavery she also committed genocide. Yet Hitler still sucks and Germans still has that as a stain on their past but America

"should not be held to this.... "we owned slaves, so we suck" type of spot."

Must be nice....

There are still people alive TODAY who endured the Holocaust.

Do you know anyone who was a slave? Do you know anyone who owned slaves? For you to compare something that happened 150+ years ago to something that happened so recently that there are STILL SURVIVORS is absurd and extremely callous.

 

[Natebishop3]

Minimizer... Newsflash:

Being pro black doesn't mean you're anti white.

But you can continue to paint whatever picture you want about me. IDGAF what you think about me. You don't know me.

All you do is rant about white people. I probably know you better than most people that see you face to face on a daily basis because you say what you're actually thinking on here. You say the things that you would never say to my face if you just met me.

You clearly have some deep seeded hatred towards white people because of what has happened to you in your lifetime, and I guess that's understandable, but for you to constantly deny that you have those feelings is what annoys me. You rant and you rail against white people and white privilege, but you don't see any problem with that. And the fact that you DON'T see a problem with that is the very reason why it's a problem.

 

[dviss1]

There are still people alive TODAY who endured the Holocaust.

Do you know anyone who was a slave? Do you know anyone who owned slaves? For you to compare something that happened 150+ years ago to something that happened so recently that there are STILL SURVIVORS is absurd and extremely callous.

Disconnected from reality...

My mother was born in 55'. My oldest aunt was born 49'.

Jim Crow ended in 65'...

WELL AFTER The Holocaust...

My mother still remembers the dogs, firehoses, beatings, unlawful imprisonment, and segregation. We've only had "equality" since then...

 

[dviss1]

All you do is rant about white people. I probably know you better than most people that see you face to face on a daily basis because you say what you're actually thinking on here. You say the things that you would never say to my face if you just met me.

You clearly have some deep seeded hatred towards white people because of what has happened to you in your lifetime, and I guess that's understandable, but for you to constantly deny that you have those feelings is what annoys me. You rant and you rail against white people and white privilege, but you don't see any problem with that. And the fact that you DON'T see a problem with that is the very reason why it's a problem.

Fuck SlyPokerDog. No edit needed.

 

[riverman]

The Chinese were the first to actually abolish slavery for a period of time...221 bc to 206 bc....The Pope abolished the holding of Christian slaves in the 12th century....the French were the first European nation to grant total equality to former African slaves and allow them to vote and have all the rights of Caucasian French people

 

[dviss1]

All you do is rant about white people. I probably know you better than most people that see you face to face on a daily basis because you say what you're actually thinking on here. You say the things that you would never say to my face if you just met me.

You clearly have some deep seeded hatred towards white people because of what has happened to you in your lifetime, and I guess that's understandable, but for you to constantly deny that you have those feelings is what annoys me. You rant and you rail against white people and white privilege, but you don't see any problem with that. And the fact that you DON'T see a problem with that is the very reason why it's a problem.

And there is NEVER a time when I don't say exactly what I think. I don't sugarcoat shit for anyone. Get your mind right on that one.

 

[Natebishop3]

Disconnected from reality...

My mother was born in 55'. My oldest aunt was born 49'.

Jim Crow ended in 65'...

My mother still remembers the dogs, firehoses, beatings, unlawful imprisonment, and segregation. We've only had "equality" since then...

So you're going to compare segregation and racism with the Holocaust? I'm pretty sure everyone would agree that the way this country treated black people was horrible and shameful, but you're SERIOUSLY going to compare those things to the systemic rounding up of Jews over a span of less than ten years and the gassing/mass murder of entire families? The Nazis murdered 11 million people in the span of only a few years in some of the worst ways imaginable. They wiped out essentially 2/3 of the Jews in Europe.

Nobody is asking you to get over racism. I think people would agree that racism still exists, but for you to keep bringing up the Holocaust is just....... wow....... come on man.

 

[dviss1]

So you're going to compare segregation and racism with the Holocaust? I'm pretty sure everyone would agree that the way this country treated black people was horrible and shameful, but you're SERIOUSLY going to compare those things to the systemic rounding up of Jews over a span of less than ten years and the gassing/mass murder of entire families? The Nazis murdered 11 million people in the span of only a few years in some of the worst ways imaginable. They wiped out essentially 2/3 of the Jews in Europe.

Nobody is asking you to get over racism. I think people would agree that racism still exists, but for you to keep bringing up the Holocaust is just....... wow....... come on man.

That was our holocaust. You've just showed your hand...

This is literally the last time you and I discuss this.

 

[Natebishop3]

That was our holocaust. You've just showed your hand...

This is literally the last time you and I discuss this.

Showed my hand lol

Like anyone is ever going to talk you down from the hatred that you feel towards white people. You're a bigot. I don't hold any bad feelings towards black people at all, but you clearly hold bad feelings towards "white people."

 

[riverman]

Showed my hand lol

Like anyone is ever going to talk you down from the hatred that you feel towards white people. You're a bigot. I don't hold any bad feelings towards black people at all, but you clearly hold bad feelings towards "white people."

I've met dviss....he doesn't hate me or my son...he hates white priviledge..not white people. I'm sure plenty of Jews hated Nazis but not necessarily all German people as they were also German people just as we are all Americans. The practice of racial superiority is alive in the world even if slavery is abolished. What dviss brings to the conversation keeps a new generation of American subculture from backsliding into old white priviledge habits and attitudes. We all sensationalize our passions from time to time but I celebrate the fact that I can have these conversations with people from different demographics and cultures to try to find some balance in our common homeland. dviss bitching about white priviledge is like me bitching about Donald Trump or Raymond Felton....I have strong opinions about both of them.

 

[riverman]

He isn't talking about white privilege in this one. He's talking about white people murdering "80 million natives and 5 million black slaves."

His understanding of history is rudimentary, at best. He refuses to look at actual facts and chooses instead to make anecdotal comparisons between events in history. He uses memes as references in his arguments. I'm totally willing to debate a topic, and I'm willing to listen to facts, but he uses neither facts, nor actual evidence, and when I provide evidence he gets mad, calls subtly calls me a racist, and "disengages" from the discussion.

I think you are being extremely defensive about this for the sake of debate.....those historical travesties were in fact the product of white privilege and power

 

[riverman]

I don't agree with personal insults from either side...calling a forum member a racist or a bigot is a personal insult...that door swings both ways but it's also a signal that two people are blowing up a problem, talking about each other and not really the issue at hand...that's not unusual but there's a lesson to learn from it.

 

[riverman]

for the record...armies are composed of several sub groups....people joining for a cause..people who are joining for citizenship....people who join for money or spoils...mercenaries.....any of these folks can stem from multiple racial backgrounds. Armies conquered and enslaved but it was more about haves and have nots than racial hatred....Chinese, Indians, Africans and Europeans all kept slaves and practiced genocide at one time or another throughout history....our own history is just a more recent wound

 

[dviss1]

I don't agree with personal insults from either side...calling a forum member a racist or a bigot is a personal insult...that door swings both ways but it's also a signal that two people are blowing up a problem, talking about each other and not really the issue at hand...that's not unusual but there's a lesson to learn from it.

The problem is people would rather call the people who call out privilege, racism, and systemic white supremecy racists instead of actually dealing with said isms. These people are what perpetuates the problem.

 

[Natebishop3]

I think you are being extremely defensive about this for the sake of debate.....those historical travesties were in fact the product of white privilege and power

He and I have been arguing about this for a long time. It's not a recent thing. I'm not disputing that slavery was a product of white privilege and power, but I'm going to argue that the death of 80 million (that's not even a verified number) American Indians was "murder," because that number represents the indigenous population across the Americas as a whole. A large portion of that number had died from disease before most of the white settlers had even gotten here. I have read books that said most of the original settlers got to North America and found land that was cleared and fertile, but nobody to be found. Empty villages. They had no idea what had happened. They actually thought that God had provided these lands for them. It's not like it was some huge effort by white settlers to wipe out all the natives, which is how he is presenting it.

The way that this country treated the natives that remained was horrible and unforgivable. Hell, the way that we're treating the native people in North Dakota is horrible and shameful. I have never said otherwise. Similarly, slavery and segregation were horrible horrible things that were done with government consent. Again, I'm not excusing that or condoning it in any way. They were awful things that need to be taught and remembered.

But I'm going to disagree with anyone who tries to compare almost any other horrible event with the Holocaust. In terms of horrible events in history, few things rival the Holocaust. Over a span of just a few years, Hitler and the Nazis were able to almost completely wipe out an entire race of people in Europe. They gassed and shot and starved and burned and hung 11 million people between 1941-1945. And this was so recent that there are still people alive who experienced it.

 

[dviss1]

What dviss brings to the conversation keeps a new generation of American subculture from backsliding into old white priviledge habits and attitudes.

It also clearly separates those who care and those who really don't give a shit. If you call someone a racist for exposing racism you're part of the problem.

 

[Denny Crane]

I've met dviss....he doesn't hate me or my son...he hates white priviledge..not white people. I'm sure plenty of Jews hated Nazis but not necessarily all German people as they were also German people just as we are all Americans. The practice of racial superiority is alive in the world even if slavery is abolished. What dviss brings to the conversation keeps a new generation of American subculture from backsliding into old white priviledge habits and attitudes. We all sensationalize our passions from time to time but I celebrate the fact that I can have these conversations with people from different demographics and cultures to try to find some balance in our common homeland. dviss bitching about white priviledge is like me bitching about Donald Trump or Raymond Felton....I have strong opinions about both of them.

Well said.

Any honest discussion of our racial problems has to start with understanding there are two sides to the discussion. Ideally, you learn from what the other side presents. If it's about privilege, it's in the conversation. It has to be or there is no honest discussion.

 

[Natebishop3]

I don't care if Sly deletes every word that I post. I'm going to call it like I see it.

You missed a few sly. You're slipping.