As expected, Afflalo is going to opt out

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riverman said:
Afflalo wasn't here long enough to develop team chemistry, understand the playbook, acclimate at all. Then he's thrown into a starting role going into the playoffs with a bum shoulder..I think he was a good trade that had some bad luck and given a training camp, he'd be a great backup with the second unit. If he moves on I wish him well. Always liked his game.
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THANK YOU. It's really that simple.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I guess I'm confused... are we underwhelmed with the part where he was thrust into a role that he wasn't intended to fill, or the part where he hurt his shoulder and many didn't expect him to play again this season? Or maybe it was when he came back from said shoulder injury and tried to help the team in the playoffs? I guess I missed the part where he was brought in to be the starting shooting guard and develop immediate chemistry with the starters while also simultaneously playing through a shoulder injury.
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It's very simple. I'm underwhelmed with the player completely. If you go back and look at his time with he Nuggets & Magic, he was a marginal player on a bad team.

Will Barton is a better player than Afflalo as evidenced by comparing both their time in Denver playing similar roles.
 
Strenuus said:
Would have been the perfect 6th man if Wes didn't get hurt.

You all seem to forget what he came here for. Typical for some, though. Blame no matter what scenario plays out.
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Right. How dare people suggest results matter! :rolleyes2:
 
JFizzleRaider said:
Yes, I understand that. In theory it sounds great. In the real world, it's not gonna happen. You think rolo, Wes and lma are gonna want to wait around for the blazers to figure out if they wanna renounce them while they go after someone else? That's a dumb move.

And I believe kamans decision has to come before free agency starts
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It's pretty simple, actually..you don't force them to wait. On July 1st you make a phone call - LMA and your TOP FA. If LMA is in, do you wanna join us? We need to know now since we will have to renounce someone.

Next call - LMA - player X is going to sign with us if you're going to resign with us as well. What should we do? We will have to renounce someone to make it work.

OR the very likely possibility of LMA taking his sweet ass time getting courted by these teams and listening to pitches and if he says, hopefully unlike LeBron, 'hey I'm going to leave so, renounce my rights so you guys aren't fucked', that would help him keep his image as a blazer in tact while still leaving.

There are ways, think outside the box.
 
ThugginPaulyGAllen said:
It's pretty simple, actually..you don't force them to wait. On July 1st you make a phone call - LMA and your TOP FA. If LMA is in, do you wanna join us? We need to know now since we will have to renounce someone.

Next call - LMA - player X is going to sign with us if you're going to resign with us as well. What should we do? We will have to renounce someone to make it work.

OR the very likely possibility of LMA taking his sweet ass time getting courted by these teams and listening to pitches and if he says, hopefully unlike LeBron, 'hey I'm going to leave so, renounce my rights so you guys aren't fucked', that would help him keep his image as a blazer in tact while still leaving.

There are ways, think outside the box.
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We will see how that goes with Wes. If that dude found out he wasn't a priority, see you later.

In theory it sounds great, but it hardly works out that way.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I guess I'm confused... are we underwhelmed with the part where he was thrust into a role that he wasn't intended to fill, or the part where he hurt his shoulder and many didn't expect him to play again this season? Or maybe it was when he came back from said shoulder injury and tried to help the team in the playoffs? I guess I missed the part where he was brought in to be the starting shooting guard and develop immediate chemistry with the starters while also simultaneously playing through a shoulder injury.
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AA was a starter much of his career. He was thrust into a role he had filled before and on paper was quite capable of filling again. That argument doesn't hold up.

If the injury was legit, that is a valid point - but the timing was sure convenient.
 
Update on the Blazers CAP situation -

Here are the Blazer salaries for 2016:

Damian Lillard $4,236,287
Nicolas Batum $12,235,750
Meyers Leonard $3,075,880
CJ McCollum $2,525,160
Steve Blake $2,170,465 (Opted In)
Allen Crabbe $947,276
Chris Kaman $5,016,000 (team option, $1M guaranteed)

Mid Level Exception $5,465,000 (CAP Hold)
Draft Choice #23 $1,112,900 (CAP Hold)
12-man roster minimum CAP Hold, $525,093
12-man roster minimum CAP Hold, $525,093

LaMarcus Aldridge $20,130,000 (CAP Hold)

Assuming (big assumption) that LaMarcus re-signs, and the CAP is $67.1M, that gives the Blazers $9,136,096 of CAP space.

To get that CAP space, the Blazers would have to renounce the rights to:
Wesley Matthews $10,868,460 (CAP Hold)
Robin Lopez $9.187,092 (CAP Hold)
Dorell Wright $4,075,500 (CAP Hold)
Joel Freeland $3,766,890 (CAP Hold - Qualifying Offer)
Alonzo Gee $947,276 (CAP Hold)
Tim Frazier $845,069 (CAP Hold)
Aaron Afflalo $11,625,000 (CAP Hold - Bird Rights)

If the Blazers don't pick up the option on Kaman, (and assuming they renounce the rights to the players above) they would be below the 12-man roster minimum (and therefor require the 12-man roster minimum CAP hold) and also still owe Kaman $1M. That would give the Blazers $12,627,003 of CAP space.

A CAP hold is removed if the free agent signs with another team, or the Blazers renounce their rights. The Blazers could wait until the moment before they sign a free agent to renounce the rights to a player.
 
They'd also have to renounce any available exceptions. But would have a room exception if they did end up with cap space.
 
JFizzleRaider said:
They'd also have to renounce any available exceptions. But would have a room exception if they did end up with cap space.
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Good call. The Blazers could renounce the MLE exception ($5,465,000), but would then need to add in the 12-man roster minimum CAP Hold, $525,093. That could potentially free up an additional $4,939,907, making the total available CAP space $17,565,910. The rest of the roster would then have to be filled up with vet minimum salaries.
 
JFizzleRaider said:
We will see how that goes with Wes. If that dude found out he wasn't a priority, see you later.

In theory it sounds great, but it hardly works out that way.
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Doesn't matter because a) free agents can't sign FIRST thing..B) if we strike out on our targets, we call Wes on July 1st as well with an offer.

Pretty much, it all hinges on the ability of.our targets to immediately give us a yes/no, which is ..ambitious, I admit.

Also, if.I were Olshey, I'd tamper with free agents to figure out where we stood. I'd rather get fined a Second rounder and a few hundred thousand and not fuck over the future of the franchise, in order to possibly build a championship team. That said, this could all go up in smoke come draft night.
 
tester551 said:
It's very simple. I'm underwhelmed with the player completely. If you go back and look at his time with he Nuggets & Magic, he was a marginal player on a bad team.

Will Barton is a better player than Afflalo as evidenced by comparing both their time in Denver playing similar roles.
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He just missed being on the allstar team in Orlando..he had a great season there. Barton played for a different coach in Denver, they fired Shaw and Afflalo in his trade interview said it was a train wreck lockerroom..be underwhelmed but understand the history
 
riverman said:
Afflalo wasn't here long enough to develop team chemistry, understand the playbook, acclimate at all. Then he's thrown into a starting role going into the playoffs with a bum shoulder..I think he was a good trade that had some bad luck and given a training camp, he'd be a great backup with the second unit. If he moves on I wish him well. Always liked his game.
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He had the same problem in Denver; only 11.7 PER there.

Look, his career PER is 12.7; CJ's already showing he can do better than that. I liked Arron a lot as a person and as a team member, but I can see where we wouldn't pick him up.
 
I think we should be able to agree that when Wes was healthy, Arron's presence made the team bette (and if not, look at the analytics of the team's performance when Wes and Arron played together). Does a good trade become a bad trade because a player who was not involved in the trade got injured?

I was hoping we could bring everyone back for one more shot at seeing what this group could do if healthy, with CJ and Meyers contributing as 6/7th men all year, but it seems like it's just going to cost too much. Afflalo really shouldn't be the first domino, but I'm really starting to feel like a rebuild is coming. Perhaps it's time to prepare for a starting lineup that involves CJ, Crabbe, and Leonard.

I think I want to cry.
 
Dame/Wes/Afflalo/Batum/Aldridge lineup to close games was fuckimg awesome while it lasted. People forget that. We won like 4 straight with that crew and were on a roll before Wes went down. Then people criticize Afflalo during playoffs but he was HURT.
 
santeesioux said:
The team is going to have a lot of money to work with now, I wonder if they could convince Wes and LMA to hang on for a little while while they work on Hibbertt and DeAndre?
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+>That would be a powerhouse line up if LMA wants a team over $$$$.
 
Strenuus said:
Exactly. Some people around here who hate the trade forget why we got him in the first place, to help their view of seeing how the team is bad in some way. It was a great trade, and AAA was a great piece.
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In exactly the same way that Oden was a great draft pick. Because in some possible world he would've been GREAT.
 
KingSpeed said:
Dame/Wes/Afflalo/Batum/Aldridge lineup to close games was fuckimg awesome while it lasted. People forget that. We won like 4 straight with that crew and were on a roll before Wes went down. Then people criticize Afflalo during playoffs but he was HURT.
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Yes, it's unfair to criticize him when he's hurt. It's also unnecessary, because he was crappy long before that.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612757/lineups/advanced/

It won't matter, because any dissenters will just yell "Small sample size!", but in the short amount of time that we got to see a Lillard/Matthews/Afflalo/Batum/Aldridge fourth quarter lineup, they were ridiculously effective.
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Here's some small sample size from the playoffs:

http://bkref.com/pi/shareit/2mprY

There were four 4-man combos that scored more points than Memphis. Three of them included CJ and all four included Meyers. I discount Arron being in the bottom three because he was legitimately injured.

Interesting that "our starters" was one of the worst performing lineups.

I like Afflalo, and if he's fine being backup SF instead of Crabbe, I'm okay with that. But CJ is our backup SG now. He's earned the opportunity. Additionally, Meyers is now our backup PF.
 
Scalma said:
Don't blame olshey for making the deal, it was the right move at the time...
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Yeah, it's a bit like the Jerm for Davis trade. It was the right move at the time.
But man, this one REALLY stinks. I'd rather have just ONE of the pieces we traded away than AAA, but the fact that we gave THREE (?) assets away for him really hurts.
 
Also, we can thank Stotts for forcing Olshey's hand in making that trade. Had Stotts actually spent more time during the regular season developing CJ (and Meyers) then perhaps we wouldn't have felt the need to trade for a back-up SG. But no, Stotts has to stock up on early-season wins in order to survive the mid-season slide his team always goes into once the rest of the league starts rounding into shape.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612757/lineups/advanced/

It won't matter, because any dissenters will just yell "Small sample size!", but in the short amount of time that we got to see a Lillard/Matthews/Afflalo/Batum/Aldridge fourth quarter lineup, they were ridiculously effective.
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How would you like the lineups ranked? PIE? Net rtng?

blue9 said:
Also, we can thank Stotts for forcing Olshey's hand in making that trade. Had Stotts actually spent more time during the regular season developing CJ (and Meyers) then perhaps we wouldn't have felt the need to trade for a back-up SG. But no, Stotts has to stock up on early-season wins in order to survive the mid-season slide his team always goes into once the rest of the league starts rounding into shape.
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Fair point. But then, he did hire Stotts, didn't he?
 
I think Stotts did an incredible job juggling the roster with 9 guys injured. CJ was injured for most of 2 seasons and didn't play great early in his comeback. Meyers didn't play great until late in the season. CJ isn't even in Afflalo's league defensively and CJ has 3 years in the system. Hopefully CJ and Meyers continue to improve and earn rotation minutes but it's not a knock on Afflalo's abilities....he's an unnecessary scapegoat
 
BlazerCaravan said:
There were four 4-man combos that scored more points than Memphis. Three of them included CJ and all four included Meyers. I discount Arron being in the bottom three because he was legitimately injured.
Interesting that "our starters" was one of the worst performing lineups.
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Um, you better discount our starters as well, then, as they included Afflalo.

But anyway, Memphis game-planned for our starters. We actually held them pretty well too, it's just that their great defense was too great.

I like Afflalo, and if he's fine being backup SF instead of Crabbe, I'm okay with that.
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HOW fine are you with him? He just opted out of an over $7M contract. You want to pay a career sub 13 PER guy 8 or 9 mil?
 
riverman said:
I think Stotts did an incredible job juggling the roster with 9 guys injured. CJ was injured for most of 2 seasons and didn't play great early in his comeback. Meyers didn't play great until late in the season. CJ isn't even in Afflalo's league defensively and CJ has 3 years in the system. Hopefully CJ and Meyers continue to improve and earn rotation minutes but it's not a knock on Afflalo's abilities....he's an unnecessary scapegoat
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It would be scapegoating if we blamed ALL our misfortunes on Afflalo. It's not scapegoating to point out that he's a career sub-average NBA player who doesn't rebound or assist AT ALL and is too short to guard most SFs. He did ABYSMALLY as a Blazer, but he didn't do that much better as a Nugget.
 
Of the many guys I'd prefer to Afflalo, Iman Shumpert is one. Paired with Lillard, that would be a nice backcourt . . .
 
Scalma said:
Another reason to package batum Thursday ;)
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NY has the cap space and pick to absorb the salary and give us cap relief.

As much as many in here, including myself, doesn't like Batum's passive offense, he's a great distributor, understands how to play with ball dominant players, plays above average defense and can play 3 positions.

Putting him in with Melo would be a perfect combination IMO.

So, if we could somehow gain about 5 mil with the lop sided trade, we would have a good chunk to offer max, with a few minor moves to get there.
 
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