Bust a Scoot?

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THE HCP said:
Nobody credible was calling him generational. Please stop, I’m begging you.
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Cronin told us the 3 new rookies are uber talented, on great contacts, and could really take us to another level. The GM wasn't kidding, the new level of Blazer ball has been historically bad.
 
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THE HCP said:
LOL, not a chance huh? You must not have taken the time to see the level of “talent” that is available this year.
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You know? Statements like this have a tendency to come back and haunt those who say them. 2 of the last 3 MVP's of the league were not worth a top 10 pick according to the people that took the time to evaluate talent in their respective draft classes.
Got another couple kids from France and one from Serbia in the top 5 that might surprise. Also got the big from Lithuania that is moving up. We just watched a couple kids show some fire in the NCAA tourney and they ain't done yet.

I am absolutely NOT a specialist on mock drafts or player prospects but I been around a very long time. Never under estimate players that work hard and are smart. I watched Wes Mathews become the very heart and soul of the Blazers.
 
Whyachi said:
Cronin told us the 3 new rookies are uber talented, on great contacts, and could really take us to another level. The GM wasn't kidding, the new level of Blazer ball has been historically bad.
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Good to know they're done progressing and have finished their improvement
 
Here's a question for those with time on their hands: is turnover rate something a player can usually reduce substantially over their career? I think of Russell Westbrook - did his turnovers change much after his rookie year? Because, while I can occasionally see flashes in Scoot, and the opposing team certainly seems to regard him as more dangerous than players like Banton, he just can't stop throwing the ball away. He is remarkably versatile in his turnovers, too - he passes them to the opposing team; he falls over out of bounds; he gets stripped laughably easily... and everything in between. Having a point guard who can't stop coughing up the ball places severe restrictions on what style of game your team can play.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Here's a question for those with time on their hands: is turnover rate something a player can usually reduce substantially over their career? I think of Russell Westbrook - did his turnovers change much after his rookie year? Because, while I can occasionally see flashes in Scoot, and the opposing team certainly seems to regard him as more dangerous than players like Banton, he just can't stop throwing the ball away. He is remarkably versatile in his turnovers, too - he passes them to the opposing team; he falls over out of bounds; he gets stripped laughably easily... and everything in between. Having a point guard who can't stop coughing up the ball places severe restrictions on what style of game your team can play.
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turnover rate last column

Westbrook:

upload_2024-4-4_13-36-18.png

James Harden:

upload_2024-4-4_13-37-44.png

Steve Nash:

upload_2024-4-4_13-38-52.png

Dame:

upload_2024-4-4_13-40-17.png

Tyrese Haliburton:

upload_2024-4-4_13-42-15.png

John Stockton:

upload_2024-4-4_13-44-19.png

I just selected PG's I knew had high turnovers, and Dame, for comparison. Doesn't really look like there is wide variance. Some PG's reduced their career rate compared to their rookie mark but it doesn't seem like there were major reductions

but I'm not sure if looking at just the turnover rate is a good gauge...maybe. I'd think you'd need to look at playing time + role and the career ratio of assist-rate/turnover-rate vs rookie ratio:

Haliburton - 2.77 (career) --> 1.97 (rookie)
Dame 2.63 --> 1.99
Westbrook - 2.56 --> 1.56
Stockton - 2.41 --> 1.36
Harden 2.17 --> .918
Nash - 2.13 --> 1.22

Scoot - ??? --> 1.48

the ratio comparison offer some optimism for Scoot, but I'm not sure how valid it is to compare Scoot to the early versions of 6 players who have combined for 48 all-star games, 51 all-NBA teams and 4 MVP's
 
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wizenheimer said:
the ratio comparison offer some optimism for Scoot, but I'm not sure how valid it is to compare Scoot to the early versions 6 players who have combined for 48 all-star games, 51 all-NBA teams and 4 MVP's
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Good job. Very good answer.
I agree with this last statement. Maybe it would be best to revisit this in a few years?
 
sheed30 said:
Just because he works for Sports Illustrated doesn’t mean he is credible, come on
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I agree. That would be like saying Canzanao is credible because he is a 14-time Associated Press Sports Editors (APSE) award winner. Or that Jason Quick is credible because he wrote for The Athletic. Not disputing that either is a good writer because they are. I am just saying I respect the opinions of those on this message board more than I respect either of them. And that is saying a lot.
 
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wizenheimer said:
turnover rate last column

Westbrook:

View attachment 64273

James Harden:

View attachment 64274

Steve Nash:

View attachment 64275

Dame:

View attachment 64276

Tyrese Haliburton:

View attachment 64277

John Stockton:

View attachment 64278

I just selected PG's I knew had high turnovers, and Dame, for comparison. Doesn't really look like there is wide variance. Some PG's reduced their career rate compared to their rookie mark but it doesn't seem like there were major reductions

but I'm not sure if looking at just the turnover rate is a good gauge...maybe. I'd think you'd need to look at playing time + role and the career ratio of assist-rate/turnover-rate vs rookie ratio:

Haliburton - 2.77 (career) --> 1.97 (rookie)
Dame 2.63 --> 1.99
Westbrook - 2.56 --> 1.56
Stockton - 2.41 --> 1.36
Harden 2.17 --> .918
Nash - 2.13 --> 1.22

Scoot - ??? --> 1.48

the ratio comparison offer some optimism for Scoot, but I'm not sure how valid it is to compare Scoot to the early versions of 6 players who have combined for 48 all-star games, 51 all-NBA teams and 4 MVP's
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Heck, I don't want to foist too high of expectations on the kid. If Scoot just gets 1 MVP I'll be happy.
 
im trying to see if scoot can get up to 40% shooting from the field for the season.

he's currently 280 for 723, for 38.7%.

if he goes 4o for 77 in the last 5 games (~52%), he gets to 40% exactly.

lofty goal, but still statistically possible.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I don't know how anyone could watch this and not see the potential.

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I don't really see how you could assume anything from that?
He's throwing the ball to Ayton vs quite possibly the worst team they have played all season.
Don't bother with a video collection from the game vs the Celtics. They won't be playing real NBA level basketball either. From this point on the teams playing the Blazers that might actually play hard are the Kengs, Pelicans and Warriors.
The Warriors might rest as well because they are pretty much locked into 10th. By the time they play the Kings that might not really count either but those teams probably want the 7th seed?
 
kjironman1 said:
I don't really see how you could assume anything from that?
He's throwing the ball to Ayton vs quite possibly the worst team they have played all season.
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The Blazers have been horrid at feeding bigs for some time, its not crazy to assume Scoot could excel at it, from what I've seen.
 
kjironman1 said:
I don't really see how you could assume anything from that?
He's throwing the ball to Ayton vs quite possibly the worst team they have played all season.
Don't bother with a video collection from the game vs the Celtics. They won't be playing real NBA level basketball either. From this point on the teams playing the Blazers that might actually play hard are the Kengs, Pelicans and Warriors.
The Warriors might rest as well because they are pretty much locked into 10th. By the time they play the Kings that might not really count either but those teams probably want the 7th seed?
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It's the same thing you're looking for in summer league. You're looking for big league plays and I see Scoot make these kinds of plays at least a few times a game.

The pass to Rupes at 27 seconds is really nice.

The entry pass to Ayton at 45 second is clean. I was listening to a podcast earlier this season about how the entry pass into the post is a lost art in the modern NBA.

At 4:56 he makes a bad pass and it should be an easy fast break for the Wiz but he makes a hell of a play to steal the ball back.

These are just a few plays that are encouraging to me.
 
Natebishop3 said:
It's the same thing you're looking for in summer league. You're looking for big league plays and I see Scoot make these kinds of plays at least a few times a game.

The pass to Rupes at 27 seconds is really nice.

The entry pass to Ayton at 45 second is clean. I was listening to a podcast earlier this season about how the entry pass into the post is a lost art in the modern NBA.

At 4:56 he makes a bad pass and it should be an easy fast break for the Wiz but he makes a hell of a play to steal the ball back.

These are just a few plays that are encouraging to me.
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Some of this is exactly why he was thought of so highly in the G league. The problem is he's doing it against mediocre players. The Wizards are not good at all.
I'm patient enough to wait though. He needs a full summer and another full season under him. The talent is there. Now the head needs to catch up.
 
kjironman1 said:
Some of this is exactly why he was thought of so highly in the G league. The problem is he's doing it against mediocre players. The Wizards are not good at all.
I'm patient enough to wait though. He needs a full summer and another full season under him. The talent is there. Now the head needs to catch up.
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It will be interesting today to see how he and Banton do against better defenders.
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
It will be interesting today to see how he and Banton do against better defenders.
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But even that isn’t a great gauge.
The Celtics will not play all their starters. They will rest people and they won’t take this game seriously. They don’t need to win.
 
kjironman1 said:
But even that isn’t a great gauge.
The Celtics will not play all their starters. They will rest people and they won’t take this game seriously. They don’t need to win.
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we are basically locked into 5 so who cares, play hard and play to win
 
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