Chad Ford's Mock 2.0

[RoyToy]

LOL Wow RoyToy. Nice choice of stat.

You tell me which is which, hombre...
Power Forward A: PER of 20.7, TS% of 55%, eFG% of 48%. 33% 3pt, 81%FT, 13.6 reb/36
Power Forward B: PER of 18.2, TS% of 53%, eFG of 50%, 31% 3pt, 75% FT, 7.7 reb/36.

Yes, I want PF A. For 7M less a year.

I don't treat PER as the be all end all stat like a lot of you.

Instead, I look at the stuff that is right in front of my face. When I do that, I see a guy that didn't start for one of the worst teams in the NBA, 45% FG% which is terrible for a PF, and a guy that is trying to improve his 3PT shot. Imagine if Aldridge started shooting more 3PT shots, he'd be killed for it. Sorry, I'll take Aldridge.

Your whole less than $7M argument only works until Love signs a new contract, so that means little because it's going to change. If he had just signed a contract and was locked into it for the next 5 years it'd make sense.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Power Forward A: Bench player for a 15-win team
Power Forward B: Starter for 50-win team who was missing starting center for much of season.

And when his team needed him to really step up his game with all the injuries to the frontcourt his numbers stayed virtually the same as his previous two seasons. Power Forward B has topped out.

 

[RoyToy]

And when his team needed him to really step up his game with all the injuries to the frontcourt his numbers stayed virtually the same as his previous two seasons. Power Forward B has topped out.

Power Forward A's ceiling isn't too terribly high.

 

[BGrantFan]

And when his team needed him to really step up his game with all the injuries to the frontcourt his numbers stayed virtually the same as his previous two seasons. Power Forward B has topped out.

Maybe Power Forward A can have a 25 PER next season, start, and win 30 games instead of 15.

I've never seen a fanbase so intent on criticizing their own assets while hyping up bench players on losing teams. I've read other threads where people want Sessions to come in and be the future PG. Fucking brilliant. Let's get rid of Bayless, Aldridge, Rudy, and #22 pick for two bench players on a 15-win team and the #4 pick in the draft. I'd want Pritchard fired if he did what some are asking of him.

 

[BGrantFan]

Power Forward A's ceiling isn't too terribly high.

Power Forward B has a higher offensive rating and a lower defensive rating than Power Forward A.

 

[BrianFromWA]

and if they swapped, Player A would be a starting PF for 50-win team (or more), and PF B could keep putting up 18 and 8 as a finesse player in MIN. Win Win.

 

[BGrantFan]

and if they swapped, Player A would be a starting PF for 50-win team (or more), and PF B could keep putting up 18 and 8 as a finesse player in MIN. Win Win.

I bolded the portion that makes your entire post irrelevant to reality.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I don't treat PER as the be all end all stat like a lot of you.

It's not end-all be-all, but it's a pretty good indicator that perhaps what you're not seeing is important. Case in point:

Instead, I look at the stuff that is right in front of my face. When I do that, I see a guy that didn't start for one of the worst teams in the NBA,

Behind Al Jefferson, who also is better than Aldridge.

45% FG% which is terrible for a PF

look at the advanced shooting percentages I showed to see how much more horrible a shooter Love is than LMA

, and a guy that is trying to improve his 3PT shot. Imagine if Aldridge started shooting more 3PT shots, he'd be killed for it. Sorry, I'll take Aldridge.

LMA already takes way too many long jumpers. Most on here wish he'd take a step back, so that shooting 41% on jumpers would be not the horribly inefficient drag on us that it is.

Your whole less than $7M argument only works until Love signs a new contract, so that means little because it's going to change. If he had just signed a contract and was locked into it for the next 5 years it'd make sense.

It makes sense now, just not if you have a LMA bias.

 

[LittleAlex]

I don't treat PER as the be all end all stat like a lot of you.

Instead, I look at the stuff that is right in front of my face. When I do that, I see a guy that didn't start for one of the worst teams in the NBA, 45% FG% which is terrible for a PF, and a guy that is trying to improve his 3PT shot. Imagine if Aldridge started shooting more 3PT shots, he'd be killed for it. Sorry, I'll take Aldridge.

Your whole less than $7M argument only works until Love signs a new contract, so that means little because it's going to change. If he had just signed a contract and was locked into it for the next 5 years it'd make sense.

Since LMA's favorite shot is the least efficent shot in basketball I would be happy as hell if he took one more step backwards and took a three.

I suspect his scoring would go up a couple of points per game and his rebounding would remain about where it is now.

If he is going to be a stretch 4 (and that is sure what it looks like) then he should really stretch the floor and become a rich man's Channing Frye. Or Chocolate Nowitzki if you prefer.

 

[HailBlazers]

That's just stupid^^^^ The stretch 4 is worthless in the playoffs and were seeing that now.

LMA needs to establish a KG like low post game, bottom line. If he is this good at the "least efficient shot in basketball" than imagine how good he would be if he actually gained position and had some low post moves. This is what LMA needs to work on this summer, his fade can be lights out if he gets good position. LMA get your ASS IN THE GYM!

 

[Cake]

Maybe Power Forward A can have a 25 PER next season, start, and win 30 games instead of 15.

I've never seen a fanbase so intent on criticizing their own assets while hyping up bench players on losing teams. I've read other threads where people want Sessions to come in and be the future PG. Fucking brilliant. Let's get rid of Bayless, Aldridge, Rudy, and #22 pick for two bench players on a 15-win team and the #4 pick in the draft. I'd want Pritchard fired if he did what some are asking of him.

Minnesota is a terrible franchise that continues to make inexplicably bad decisions. The fact that Kevin Love comes off the bench is more of an indictment of Minnesota than it is of Kevin Love. If Minnesota had a brain, they'd put Al Jefferson at the C and start Kevin Love at the PF. But then again, this is a franchise that drafted approx. 15 point guards last season.

Let's not forget that Kevin Pritchard traded a starter and future all star (Zach Randolph) to create room for a bench player (LaMarcus Aldridge) a couple years ago. Did you want him fired for that? Nope.

 

[BGrantFan]

Let's not forget that Kevin Pritchard traded a starter and future all star (Zach Randolph) to create room for a bench player (LaMarcus Aldridge) a couple years ago. Did you want him fired for that? Nope.

The end result is 2 straight 50-win seasons. Meanwhile, Zach has yet to play in a playoff game.

Odd post.

 

[Nikolokolus]

The end result is 2 straight 50-win seasons. Meanwhile, Zach has yet to play in a playoff game.

Odd post.

You mean like back in 2003 when he averaged 14 pts and 9 rebounds in under thirty minutes per game and a 21.7 PER against Dallas?

 

[RoyToy]

Minnesota is a terrible franchise that continues to make inexplicably bad decisions. The fact that Kevin Love comes off the bench is more of an indictment of Minnesota than it is of Kevin Love. If Minnesota had a brain, they'd put Al Jefferson at the C and start Kevin Love at the PF. But then again, this is a franchise that drafted approx. 15 point guards last season.

Let's not forget that Kevin Pritchard traded a starter and future all star (Zach Randolph) to create room for a bench player (LaMarcus Aldridge) a couple years ago. Did you want him fired for that? Nope.

They did that, and then stopped, because that frontline provides absolutely no defense between the two of them..

 

[BGrantFan]

You mean like back in 2003 when he averaged 14 pts and 9 rebounds in under thirty minutes per game and a 21.7 PER against Dallas?

I mean since the trade.

 

[Cake]

The end result is 2 straight 50-win seasons. Meanwhile, Zach has yet to play in a playoff game.

Odd post.

*Sigh*

You said that trading 2 bench players, a mid 1st round pick and a starter for two bench players and a likely starter level pick is grounds for firing. I pointed out that KP already did basically that and it worked out pretty well for us. You use hindsight to repeat my point, that we enjoyed success after making that trade. Well played.

Aldridge is slightly above average. Love is slightly above average as well. It doesn't matter if he starts or not, just like it didn't matter that Aldridge didn't start when we traded Zach Randolph.

And it almost sounds as if you believe that good players can't play on bad teams, which is absurd.

 

[BGrantFan]

*Sigh*

You said that trading 2 bench players, a mid 1st round pick and a starter for two bench players and a likely starter level pick is grounds for firing. I pointed out that KP already did basically that and it worked out pretty well for us. You use hindsight to repeat my point, that we enjoyed success after making that trade. Well played.

Aldridge is slightly above average. Love is slightly above average as well. It doesn't matter if he starts or not, just like it didn't matter that Aldridge didn't start when we traded Zach Randolph.

And it almost sounds as if you believe that good players can't play on bad teams, which is absurd.

If you don't understand the difference between building a team versus improving an already good team, then I can't help you. There was almost no risk in dumping Zach since the team was terrible with him. Dumping Aldridge for a rookie carries much more risk. Suppose the team regresses.

 

[RoyToy]

Interesting that Randolph is brought up in that he finally made the AS team at 28 after having arguably the best season of his career, yet at 24 Aldridge is finished progressing and is a bust for not making the AS team by now.

 

[BGrantFan]

Interesting that Randolph is brought up in that he finally made the AS team at 28 after having arguably the best season of his career, yet at 24 Aldridge is finished progressing and is a bust for not making the AS team by now.

Portland players level out in their early 20s. The rest of the league progresses because they have better coaching.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Interesting that Randolph is brought up in that he finally made the AS team at 28 after having arguably the best season of his career, yet at 24 Aldridge is finished progressing and is a bust for not making the AS team by now.

If you believe LMA's problems stem from a need for greater maturity, that analogy makes sense.

 

[tlongII]

I see no way that Cousins goes lower than #3. If I were a GM I would probably take him at #2 behind Wall. Quality centers are hard to find and I think he has the physical gifts to be a top level center. It just depends on his work ethic.

 

[LittleAlex]

That's just stupid^^^^ The stretch 4 is worthless in the playoffs and were seeing that now.

LMA needs to establish a KG like low post game, bottom line. If he is this good at the "least efficient shot in basketball" than imagine how good he would be if he actually gained position and had some low post moves. This is what LMA needs to work on this summer, his fade can be lights out if he gets good position. LMA get your ASS IN THE GYM!

Of course your suggestion would be the best of all possible worlds.


Too bad we live here on Earth where things are far from optimal.

Given LMA's lack of desire to go into the post Portland needs to make the best of a bad situation.

And that is to allow LMA to play on the perimeter a fair portion of the time since that is exactly what he is going to do much of the time anyway.

 

[HailBlazers]

Lack of desire is subjective my friend.

Maybe he just needs some practice...?? Rome wasn't built in a day, nor was MJ

 

[Minstrel]

Or maybe he just doesn't have the talent/skills to be a low post player. All player failings aren't lack of desire/heart/toughness.

 

[BGrantFan]

Or maybe he just doesn't have the talent/skills to be a low post player. All player failings aren't lack of desire/heart/toughness.

Why is it even a 'failing'? The idea behind drafting Oden was to have a low post and high post combination. Sure, I wish LA had the post game of Wes Unseld, the rebounding of Dennis Rodman, and the ability to create his own perimeter shots like Karl Malone. Knowing he never will doesn't mean I view him as a failure, though.

I'd like Andre Miller to make 40% of his three pointers next year. I don't consider his lack of an outside shot a 'failing', though, because I know he is a very limited shooter.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Why is it even a 'failing'? The idea behind drafting Oden was to have a low post and high post combination.

I'd like Andre Miller to make 40% of his three pointers next year. I don't consider his lack of an outside shot a 'failing', though, because I know he is a very limited shooter.

though I agree with the premise, I don't think the analogy's true. Jason Kidd couldn't hit a barn when he was younger (he had 3 seasons out of his first 11 where he had >33% 3pt). Now he's gone 38%, 41%, 42% in his last three years. I imagine that if Andre got into the gym this summer with a shooting coach he might be able to up the percentage a bit.
And if he's going to keep playing PG-off-of-Roy, maybe he should.
Likewise, if we're going with the premise that LMA is a high-post complement to Oden...he already has that skillset. But if he's going to be the most skilled big in the lineup b/c of injuries or fouls, it kind of behooves him (and helps the team) to work on some other aspects of the game...like offense in the painted area, for instance?

 

[BGrantFan]

though I agree with the premise, I don't think the analogy's true. Jason Kidd couldn't hit a barn when he was younger (he had 3 seasons out of his first 11 where he had >33% 3pt). Now he's gone 38%, 41%, 42% in his last three years. I imagine that if Andre got into the gym this summer with a shooting coach he might be able to up the percentage a bit.

Miller has never even cracked 30%. I don't need him working hard to get to 35% this summer. I'd just rather he never shoot a three.

 

[Minstrel]

Why is it even a 'failing'? The idea behind drafting Oden was to have a low post and high post combination. Sure, I wish LA had the post game of Wes Unseld, the rebounding of Dennis Rodman, and the ability to create his own perimeter shots like Karl Malone. Knowing he never will doesn't mean I view him as a failure, though.

I'd like Andre Miller to make 40% of his three pointers next year. I don't consider his lack of an outside shot a 'failing', though, because I know he is a very limited shooter.

There's a difference between a player being "a failure" and having failings. Almost all players have failings...the things they're not good at. I absolutely consider Miller's lack of an outside shot a failing of his. And Aldridge's inability to consistently play well in the low post is a failing. My point was not criticism of Aldridge but that just because he doesn't do the things some posters want him to do, that doesn't mean he has a "lack of desire."

 

[BGrantFan]

There's a difference between a player being "a failure" and having failings. Almost all players have failings...the things they're not good at. I absolutely consider Miller's lack of an outside shot a failing of his. And Aldridge's inability to consistently play well in the low post is a failing. My point was not criticism of Aldridge but that just because he doesn't do the things some posters want him to do, that doesn't mean he has a "lack of desire."

Nice out.



I kid. I agree with what you're saying. I was more addressing the make wine out of water crowd.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Miller has never even cracked 30%. I don't need him working hard to get to 35% this summer. I'd just rather he never shoot a three.

HE didn't shoot a 3 in Game 2 or Game 6--and we lost my a combined 38. He only shot 1 in the two games we won, and when he shot more than one we lost by a combined 38. What does that mean? Absolutely nothing. But I thought I'd mention it anyway.

If it's b/c he's glued to the bench that he's not shooting 3's, then I can see it. If he's on the floor, in the offense as constructed, with the players he played with this year? I'd like to see him in the gym with his picked-out 'fro and keeping the pounds off by shooting a few hundred 3's a day.