Chauncey Billups coaching and basketball stuff ONLY!

[andalusian]

it’s very clear Nurk wasn’t a big fan of Stotts, or at least his system/approach.

Nurk was very happy with Stotts when he arrived here - but once things did not go his way he started to be upset at the system. It's exactly what happened in Denver and I suspect will happen with Billups after an initial love affair. The problem with Nurk seems to be that he believes he knows best and when it is proven wrong - it is someone else's problem.

I am calling it right now, he will have a great start, contract year + new stuff, he will be over the moon and when things stop going his way - he is going to sulk.

Prove me wrong Nurk, I really want to love you, but it is so hard to do...

 

[Scalma]

Nurk was very happy with Stotts when he arrived here - but once things did not go his way he started to be upset at the system. It's exactly what happened in Denver and I suspect will happen with Billups after an initial love affair. The problem with Nurk seems to be that he believes he knows best and when it is proven wrong - it is someone else's problem.

I am calling it right now, he will have a great start, contract year + new stuff, he will be over the moon and when things stop going his way - he is going to sulk.

Prove me wrong Nurk, I really want to love you, but it is so hard to do...

Sulk or not, it didn’t affect his production. He was better this past season than when he initially got to Portland. He has always played hard, but he’s also human and wants to feel included. I love that he believes in his skill set....he shouldn’t get knocked for wanting more responsibility. He’s just never had that consistent belief from a coach (the two he’s played for aren’t necessarily known for their inclusiveness) It also must’ve been frustrating being relegated to screen setter/handoff guy while Dame/CJ/Melo launched dumb shot after dumb shot.

He has a past relationship with Billups (instant trust) and Chauncey hasn’t talked up anyone more than him this offseason. I think he realizes just how much of a game changer an engaged Nurk is. I think I’d be more surprised if he didn’t have a career year than if he did. Just stay relatively healthy please.

 

[BonesJones]

Nurk was very happy with Stotts when he arrived here - but once things did not go his way he started to be upset at the system. It's exactly what happened in Denver and I suspect will happen with Billups after an initial love affair. The problem with Nurk seems to be that he believes he knows best and when it is proven wrong - it is someone else's problem.

I am calling it right now, he will have a great start, contract year + new stuff, he will be over the moon and when things stop going his way - he is going to sulk.

Prove me wrong Nurk, I really want to love you, but it is so hard to do...

The problem in Denver was he got benched.

The problem with Stotts was that he sucked.

Don't see either being an issue with Billups and Nurkic.

 

[andalusian]

Time will tell. All I am saying is great players bend the situation in their favor, be it Jokic in Denver or Dame and to a lesser degree CJ under Stotts. With Nurk it is always the coach's fault. We will see if it changes under Billups. I hope it does. I do not have that much hope tho unless he grows up. My worry is he will start great, hit some kind of obstacle and wilt / sulk. It's the pattern we have seen before.

I would love to be proved wrong.

 

[Mr. Robot]

id be pissed too if my role was what nurks role was last season

blazers played like a 3-point shooting team and nurk was a non factor, setting screens & doing handoffs and then occasional pnr

unlike terry stotts, chauncey billups will use players to the best of their abilities and all chauncey has said so far about how our offense is going to look, fits nurks game perfectly and therefore you will get the best out of nurk

make no mistake, next season will be the continuation of that 18/19 season, when nurk was well on his way to become an all-star caliber player!

 

[Scalma]

I do not have that much hope tho unless he grows up..

What does this even mean? He seems like a top human being to me and a great teammate. Has never shown up Stotts either. He’s allowed to feel upset.

 

[riverman]

Nurk is excited about Chauncey and he loved Stotts...he said so when Terry left...Nurk gets upset with refs....so do I...he's going to beast and his goal is to become an allstar center...he's young and I think he can do that. Chauncey and Roy Rogers are going to be eye openers for Nurk...I can't wait

 

[andalusian]

What does this even mean? He seems like a top human being to me and a great teammate. Has never shown up Stotts either. He’s allowed to feel upset.

Of course he is allowed to be upset. My belief is that the main thing in his way was never the coaching but his willingness to better understand what he should and should not do and what to work on.

 

[Pinwheel1]

id be pissed too if my role was what nurks role was last season

blazers played like a 3-point shooting team and nurk was a non factor, setting screens & doing handoffs and then occasional pnr

unlike terry stotts, chauncey billups will use players to the best of their abilities and all chauncey has said so far about how our offense is going to look, fits nurks game perfectly and therefore you will get the best out of nurk

make no mistake, next season will be the continuation of that 18/19 season, when nurk was well on his way to become an all-star caliber player!

If Nurk can stay away from the injury bug and can finish better around the basket, he will be in line for a raise. I would expect him to come back in excellent condition and hopefully having added a new offensive weapon. Something he did not do the previous year.

 

[Mr. Robot]

If Nurk can stay away from the injury bug and can finish better around the basket, he will be in line for a raise. I would expect him to come back in excellent condition and hopefully having added a new offensive weapon. Something he did not do the previous year.

he did improve his 3-point shot and from what ive been seeing in his workouts, he keeps working on it

it looks like stars have aligned for him (coach that really likes and trusts him, contract year and hes fully healthy)

 

[riverman]

Nurk probably more than most centers in the league feeds off the crowd....he's not a guy who's going to get pumped up for playing in an empty gym....after a couple years of setbacks he finally got on the court and broke his hand swiping at a ball...Nurk will benefit from fans in the stands and a training camp with the same starters playing more than a few games together....we had something like 19 starting lineups last season....it's time to have a starting five that are the Blazers identity and not searching for that identity all regular season...Nurk is pumped for Chauncey's coaching and I'm pumped for Nurk to beast again. Nurk is also in a contract year and this is the time to work towards a bigger payday

 

[wizenheimer]

id be pissed too if my role was what nurks role was last season

blazers played like a 3-point shooting team and nurk was a non factor, setting screens & doing handoffs and then occasional pnr

unlike terry stotts, chauncey billups will use players to the best of their abilities and all chauncey has said so far about how our offense is going to look, fits nurks game perfectly and therefore you will get the best out of nurk

make no mistake, next season will be the continuation of that 18/19 season, when nurk was well on his way to become an all-star caliber player!

it isn't like he was frozen out of the offense:





he shot at the same frequency that Powell did, and had a higher usage rate

 

[andalusian]

it isn't like he was frozen out of the offense:

View attachment 40196

View attachment 40197

he shot at the same frequency that Powell did, and had a higher usage rate

And unfortunately at a terrible efficiency for a big guy. Just look at the difference to EK.

I remember the first full year he was on the roster when the team tried to force feed him down low. It was a disaster. They had to go away from it.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Until i see Nurkic start to take the ball to the hoop with authority and dunk instead of his soft Euro finger rolls i would just as soon see him get less touches.
Seriously how many times have every one of us screamed at the TV for Nurk to play like a true 7 footer instead of a soft Euro trash player.
Now if he actually made all those finger rolls i would have to shut up but we all know that isn't the case.

 

[JoshuaHall]

1) I think that Nurk will have more respect for Billups. If Billups has to have that conversation with Nurk, “look, you’re just not as good as you think you are” I think Nurk will take that a little more seriously given Billups reputation, respect and he is a championship point guard in his own right.


2) Agree with the above. He needs to stop with the soft foo foo stuff and start postering people. It’s ridiculous.

 

[Scalma]

1) I think that Nurk will have more respect for Billups. If Billups has to have that conversation with Nurk, “look, you’re just not as good as you think you are” I think Nurk will take that a little more seriously given Billups reputation, respect and he is a championship point guard in his own right.


2) Agree with the above. He needs to stop with the soft foo foo stuff and start postering people. It’s ridiculous.

 

[Scalma]

 

[Labinot41]

Wow we have a Coach for the first time in years

 

[stampedehero]

What really matters is the first win Billups achieves when the REAL season is day number one.

 

[stampedehero]

C'mon everybody: Lets get Nurkified.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Billups talking about the ball moving through Nurk. I question this as well.

We watched the last time the team tried this through Nurk. He passes the ball way too lazy and they end up with turnovers. Teams will cruise the lanes looking for Nurk to flip pass instead of Zip Pass. It ends up being the only way nurk can facilitate is through the hand off pass or the wide open shooter. The other issue is he still doesn't make the shot from three enough to warrant enough attention from outside.
You absolutely do not want Nurk trying to make cute passes.
Then you will begin to see him sulk when they start to move away from him and his lazy ways on the court.
Sorry. Not trying to be negative about everything but we all watched this over and over again. We watched the last coach chew him out on the sideline for this. How will Billups change Nurkic? Lets see that happen.

 

[Mr. Robot]

Billups talking about the ball moving through Nurk. I question this as well.

We watched the last time the team tried this through Nurk. He passes the ball way too lazy and they end up with turnovers. Teams will cruise the lanes looking for Nurk to flip pass instead of Zip Pass. It ends up being the only way nurk can facilitate is through the hand off pass or the wide open shooter. The other issue is he still doesn't make the shot from three enough to warrant enough attention from outside.
You absolutely do not want Nurk trying to make cute passes.
Then you will begin to see him sulk when they start to move away from him and his lazy ways on the court.
Sorry. Not trying to be negative about everything but we all watched this over and over again. We watched the last coach chew him out on the sideline for this. How will Billups change Nurkic? Lets see that happen.

he should sulk if they do that to him

like, im supposed to play defense while other motherfuckers dont even try and then im supposed to set screens and do handoffs while other motherfuckers chuck three after three... yeah, that shit wont fly and nurk already said it

terry stotts diminished his role and made him a role player so badly that people will be suprised when they see him killin it next season

 

[Fairly-Hard]

he should sulk if they do that to him

like, im supposed to play defense while other motherfuckers dont even try and then im supposed to set screens and do handoffs while other motherfuckers chuck three after three... yeah, that shit wont fly and nurk already said it

terry stotts diminished his role and made him a role player so badly that people will be suprised when they see him killin it next season

Going to happen again if he doesn’t improve his play.
Nurkic tries to be flashy and cute with his shots and passes. It rarely ends well. This isn’t on Stotts or Billups. This is on Nurkic. He has to perform or his role will diminish.

 

[wizenheimer]

about Nurkic passing, 82games tracks assists, bad passes, and, maybe most important: assist/bad-pass ratio:

Sabonis:



Vucevic':



Adebayo:



Jokic:



Plumlee:



KAT:



Nurkic:



I'm not against the Blazers trying to give Nurkic a bigger role in the offense. They sure need to develop more options than hoping Dame goes supernova, and CJ pounding the air out of the ball. And Billups may be, in part, motivated to give Nurkic a bigger role because he already knows Olshey won't get him a backup PG or another facilitator

but I look at those numbers while recalling how much all of those other guys participate in the offense, and question if Nurkic's high passing turnover rate will bring as much bad as it does good. And there is also the factor that of those other bigs, the only two that may be worse perimeter shooters than Nurkic are Adebayo and Plumlee....and both of those guys have much better handles and are better at dribble-drives

which brings up, in my muddled mind at least, a couple of other stats: average shot distance and TS% (same order as above):

Sabonis: avg FGA distance 8.4....TS% .581

Vucevic: avg FGA distance 10.1....TS% .540

Adebayo: avg FGA distance 5.7....TS% .608

Jokic: avg FGA distance 10.3....TS% .613

Plumlee: avg FGA distance 3.7....TS% .597

KAT: avg FGA distance 11.4....TS% .620

Nurkic: avg FGA distance 5.3....TS% .533

I'm thinking that a low post offense for Nurkic won't accomplish much for what Billups wants to run. It might actually result in more three's and the biggest factor for making a low post work is a player that is great at finishing near the rim. That's not Nurkic. So then, optimally it would be Nurkic in a high post set...maybe foul line extended, hitting back cutters off of screens.

But Nurkic does not have the perimeter shooting efficiency that most of these other guys have. And looking at his average career shot distance, running more high post will be a fairly significant change in his offense. It would also mean he'd tend to be further from the hoop for offensive rebound opportunities

as I said, sure, why not. But I'm a little skeptical how effective it will be. Also, while I'm all for taking the ball out of CJ's hands more often, I don't think it's a good idea to take the ball out of Dame's hands

 

[riverman]

he should sulk if they do that to him

like, im supposed to play defense while other motherfuckers dont even try and then im supposed to set screens and do handoffs while other motherfuckers chuck three after three... yeah, that shit wont fly and nurk already said it

terry stotts diminished his role and made him a role player so badly that people will be suprised when they see him killin it next season

Pretty hard to diminish the role of someone who for two seasons waived a towel after his leg snapped off, then came back and broke his hand swiping at a ball...Terry Stotts didn't make any of that happen. Nurk feeds off a crowd...when he could play he had some careless foul trouble...Nurk needs a training camp, a crowd and health to get back to beasting....I think he will but the coach didn't bench him...injuries did...if Nurk is pissed about his role he should talk with CJ and Dame....the guys who didn't pass it to him much..fact is Nurk was really rusty joining the team mid season and not in great shape. I think this is his contract season to really play at an allstar level and hope he does...I don't care if he ever shoots a 3 again but I want him to be deadly shooting off the glass in the paint...Nurk wants to be Jokic and he has some work to do to get there...good news is Nurk is only 26

 

[crandc]

The test of a coach is how they rebound after bad loss. Easy to look good after a win.

 

[andalusian]

I'm thinking that a low post offense for Nurkic won't accomplish much for what Billups wants to run. It might actually result in more three's and the biggest factor for making a low post work is a player that is great at finishing near the rim. That's not Nurkic. So then, optimally it would be Nurkic in a high post set...maybe foul line extended, hitting back cutters off of screens.

But Nurkic does not have the perimeter shooting efficiency that most of these other guys have. And looking at his average career shot distance, running more high post will be a fairly significant change in his offense. It would also mean he'd tend to be further from the hoop for offensive rebound opportunities

as I said, sure, why not. But I'm a little skeptical how effective it will be. Also, while I'm all for taking the ball out of CJ's hands more often, I don't think it's a good idea to take the ball out of Dame's hands

Thanks for this. It gives us numerical analysis that confirms my gut feeling that any idea of Nurkic being misused is unlikely.

The options are:

1. Billups is an offensive genius that will run a scheme that will make Nurkic a much more efficient offensive player (impossible to tell with him being a first year coach)
2. Nurkic takes a giant leap forward going into year 8 in the league (unlikely)
3. Nurkic is the same player we have seen so far, above average defensively, below average offensively, the team's offense takes a dive with more emphasis on Nurkic in the offense until a correction is made and we return to him being option #4/5 on offense as he is now (likely).

 

[julius]

Thanks for this. It gives us numerical analysis that confirms my gut feeling that any idea of Nurkic being misused is unlikely.

The options are:

1. Billups is an offensive genius that will run a scheme that will make Nurkic a much more efficient offensive player (impossible to tell with him being a first year coach)
2. Nurkic takes a giant leap forward going into year 8 in the league (unlikely)
3. Nurkic is the same player we have seen so far, above average defensively, below average offensively, the team's offense takes a dive with more emphasis on Nurkic in the offense until a correction is made and we return to him being option #4/5 on offense as he is now (likely).

The team was at it's best when Nurk is engaged, involved and taking an active role in the flow off the offense (with passes, etc).

Instead, stotts went with one of the easiest to predict offenses (pnr/help us Obi Dame, you're our only hope!).

 

[andalusian]

The team was at it's best when Nurk is engaged, involved and taking an active role in the flow off the offense (with passes, etc).

Instead, stotts went with one of the easiest to predict offenses (pnr/help us Obi Dame, you're our only hope!).

If you go by playoffs success, the team was actually at it's best without Nurkic, but with a mobile big (Zach Collins) and Kanter.

We have heard that Dame is excited about playing with a mobile big. There is a good reason for that. The success the Blazers had with Nurkic being a big part of the offense was before the league realized they should just invite him to take low-efficiency shots near the basketball. Once this happened - Terry correctly realized that the offense tanked. Let me remind you that that year the Blazers were #15 in offensive efficiency. They made their money (surprisingly) on the defensive end (#8 in the league) - and Nurkic was a big part of this, but so was Zach Collins and so were Aminu and Harkless.

Nurkic as a big part of the offense has not stood the test of time. Would it be great if it happened? Sure. Is it likely? Not in my opinion.

 

[illmatic99]

If you go by playoffs success, the team was actually at it's best without Nurkic, but with a mobile big (Zach Collins) and Kanter.

We have heard that Dame is excited about playing with a mobile big. There is a good reason for that. The success the Blazers had with Nurkic being a big part of the offense was before the league realized they should just invite him to take low-efficiency shots near the basketball. Once this happened - Terry correctly realized that the offense tanked. Let me remind you that that year the Blazers were #15 in offensive efficiency. They made their money (surprisingly) on the defensive end (#8 in the league) - and Nurkic was a big part of this, but so was Zach Collins and so were Aminu and Harkless.

Nurkic as a big part of the offense has not stood the test of time. Would it be great if it happened? Sure. Is it likely? Not in my opinion.

I don't think it's as black and white with Nurk. There's more nuance to this. While his efficiency in shooting around the basket is suspect, he's REALLY streaky. There were games when he first came to Portland when he made all those weird hook shots, and others when he airballed everything. I think a lot of his game has to do with his general mindset. He's also a lot more engaged defensively when he's involved on offense. He was borderline elite at P&R defense before he broke his leg, and I think a lot of his engagement on that end stemmed from the fact that he was consistently getting 10-15 shots and initiating offense from the high post. I think we need to see what Chauncey can do to unlock him.

While he is in his 8th year, he's never had a consistent stretch of play without injuries/trades/etc. I don't think it's THAT unfathomable that he has a career year.