Free Agent Chinanu Onuaku, Cameron Oliver, Gary Payton II agree to Training Camp Deals with Portland

[Chris Craig]

I'm liking Cam Oliver

 

[lawai'a]

as one of those advocating more ball movement/assists, and josef in the high post, i liked very much the passing, vision and willingness to make the extra one displayed by Onuaku in his g league highlights.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Dope! Haha. YouTube's great man. If you want, you can get notifications when we drop videos by clicking the bell next to it

Hey was watching the mailbag video about evan turner, and I had a wanted to make a couple comments. I 'might' trade ET and Simons basically to get rid of ET, even without a deal in place. My reasoning is I think they're better when he's not playing but if he's here apparently they're going to keep playing him. Most of your arguments as to why they shouldn't do that are good ones. I just really think they're better without him. Now simons is interesting and it'd hurt but he's not going to make them better this year either. Just throwing it out there, been watching the video's good stuff.

 

[Chris Craig]

Hey was watching the mailbag video about evan turner, and I had a wanted to make a couple comments. I 'might' trade ET and Simons basically to get rid of ET, even without a deal in place. My reasoning is I think they're better when he's not playing but if he's here apparently they're going to keep playing him. Most of your arguments as to why they shouldn't do that are good ones. I just really think they're better without him. Now simons is interesting and it'd hurt but he's not going to make them better this year either. Just throwing it out there, been watching the video's good stuff.

ET will be with the Blazers another year. He will become tradeable next season (19-20) when he is expiring. Until then the Blazers are trying to make the best of it. Put a bunch of shooters around him, and let him be the playmaker.

 

[tester551]

ET will be with the Blazers another year. He will become tradeable next season (19-20) when he is expiring. Until then the Blazers are trying to make the best of it. Put a bunch of shooters around him, and let him be the playmaker.

ET could be tradeable...
It would have to be an equally bad contract, but hopefully a better fit. I'm thinking someone like Ryan Anderson

 

[riverman]

Just because we signed shooters doesn't mean it's wise to start shedding our best defenders....

 

[Scalma]

ET could be tradeable...
It would have to be an equally bad contract, but hopefully a better fit. I'm thinking someone like Ryan Anderson

I could see why Portland would do it, but not Phoenix. Anderson expires after this season.

Edit. Nevermind. Was wrong. But he’d still be making less next year than Turner.

 

[Scalma]

The one team I keep going back to as the only hope, when it comes to trading Turner, is Minnesota.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I could see why Portland would do it, but not Phoenix. Anderson expires after this season.

Edit. Nevermind. Was wrong. But he’d still be making less next year than Turner.

If he plays, he makes more than Turner. It's only his guarantee that is less than Turner's salary, and only by three million, and that's only relevant if they waive him.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Models his game after draymond and millsap.

Me too!

 

[blue9]

He's never going to be a guy you look to for scoring, but at least he's efficient and opportunistic and seems to know his limits. Snd, yes, he's a very good rebounder and a pretty decent shot blocker.

So basically Ed Davis...but not undersized.

 

[Boob-No-More]

So basically Ed Davis...but not undersized.

I think Onuaku's upside is a potential Ed Davis type of back up center. His advanced stats from his two years in the G League compare favorably to Ed's two best NBA seasons. Of course, that's against G League competition, but Onuaka is only 21 and Ed didn't reach his full potential until he was 25 - 26 years old.

I like both Onuaku and Oliver as camp invites. I suspect at least one, and maybe both, are legitimate potential 2-way signings.

BNM

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

Two more raw big men with decision making problems; wouldn't it help to have a second big man coach?

 

[Boob-No-More]

Two more raw big men with decision making problems; wouldn't it help to have a second big man coach?

Or even a first one?

BNM

 

[Scalma]

Two more raw big men with decision making problems; wouldn't it help to have a second big man coach?

Or even a first one?

BNM

A lot (maybe even most) teams don’t have a specialized big man coach. It’s usually a collective effort. A coach should be able to coach all types of players. Popovich is the main guy off the top of my head with this philosophy.

 

[Boob-No-More]

A lot (maybe even most) teams don’t have a specialized big man coach. It’s usually a collective effort. A coach should be able to coach all types of players. Popovich is the main guy off the top of my head with this philosophy.

Yeah, and how's that working for POR? Stotts <> Popovich.

Name one big man who has shown significant improvement in POR since Kim Hughes was fired, especially on the offensive end. How's Meyer's doing (regressed after Hughes was fired)? How did Vonleh do (never developed a single, repeatable low post move)? How much better did Collins and Swanigan look on the offensive end in their second summer league that their first (Collins still struggled offensively and Swanigan regressed)? Nurk regressed offensively in his first full season in POR. He looked much better during Nurk Fever as an out of shape DEN cast off. I'm not seeing any success stories here, are you?

Yes, not everyone thinks a dedicated big man coach is required, but when what you're doing isn't working, it's time to try something new. Terry and Neil thought hiring Kim Hughes was a good idea at the time. So, why is a proven dedicated big man coach verboten now, especially when we have a roster full of young big men who continue to struggle, especially on the offensive end?

In addition to Kim Hughes turning Chris Kaman and DeAndre Jordan into all stars (yeah, I know Jordan didn't become an all star until after Hughes left, but it was Hugh's work with DeAndre Jordan that set the foundation and turned a 2nd round pick into a legitimate NBA starting center), Bob Thorton in MEM turned Marc Gasol, another 2nd round pick, into a multi-time all star, DPOY and one of the best big men in the game. He also helped a veteran Zach Randolph become a more complete player.

I guess I just don't understand what the downside would be (other than Neil admitting he shouldn't have fired Kim Hughes). No cap hit, no tax hit, you can have an many coaches as you want and pay them whatever you want. So, why not hire a proven big man coach to teach some of our young bigs some solid, dependable low post moves and a few more tricks of the trade. They clearly aren't getting that from the current coaching staff. Our staff has done a GREAT job developing guards, but they have failed miserably when it comes to developing our big men. Time (past time, actually)to try a different approach.

BNM

 

[Scalma]

Yeah, and how's that working for POR? Stotts <> Popovich.

Name one big man who has shown significant improvement in POR since Kim Hughes was fired, especially on the offensive end. How's Meyer's doing (regressed after Hughes was fired)? How did Vonleh do (never developed a single, repeatable low post move)? How much better did Collins and Swanigan look on the offensive end in their second summer league that their first (Collins still struggled offensively and Swanigan regressed)? Nurk regressed offensively in his first full season in POR. He looked much better during Nurk Fever as an out of shape DEN cast off. I'm not seeing any success stories here, are you?

Yes, not everyone thinks a dedicated big man coach is required, but when what you're doing isn't working, it's time to try something new. Terry and Neil thought hiring Kim Hughes was a good idea at the time. So, why is a proven dedicated big man coach verboten now, especially when we have a roster full of young big men who continue to struggle, especially on the offensive end?

In addition to Kim Hughes turning Chris Kaman and DeAndre Jordan into all stars (yeah, I know Jordan didn't become an all star until after Hughes left, but it was Hugh's work with DeAndre Jordan that set the foundation and turned a 2nd round pick into a legitimate NBA starting center), Bob Thorton in MEM turned Marc Gasol, another 2nd round pick, into a multi-time all star, DPOY and one of the best big men in the game. He also helped a veteran Zach Randolph become a more complete player.

I guess I just don't understand what the downside would be (other than Neil admitting he shouldn't have fired Kim Hughes). No cap hit, no tax hit, you can have an many coaches as you want and pay them whatever you want. So, why not hire a proven big man coach to teach some of our young bigs some solid, dependable low post moves and a few more tricks of the trade. They clearly aren't getting that from the current coaching staff. Our staff has done a GREAT job developing guards, but they have failed miserably when it comes to developing our big men. Time (past time, actually)to try a different approach.

BNM

“Nurk regressed.”

Where? His stats were almost identical, he just played fewer minutes. His post all star numbers this year were actually superior, on both ends, to his “Nurk fever” run the previous season.

Zach spent one season in college, as a backup, and turned into a contributor on a playoff squad as a 19 year old. But let me guess, coaches don’t get credit for that right?

Swanigan barely played, I don’t know how you can come to any sort of conclusion on him. And athletically speaking, maybe he just doesn’t belong in the NBA. Coaches aren’t magicians.

SUMMER LEAGUE though? That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that.

Meyers is mental midget, he’s probably the only one that needed a babysitter.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

“Nurk regressed.”

Where? His stats were almost identical, he just played fewer minutes. His post all star numbers this year were actually superior, on both ends, to his “Nurk fever” run the previous season.

Zach spent one season in college, as a backup, and turned into a contributor on a playoff squad as a 19 year old. But let me guess, coaches don’t get credit for that right?

Swanigan barely played, I don’t know how you can come to any sort of conclusion on him. And athletically speaking, maybe he just doesn’t belong in the NBA. Coaches aren’t magicians.

SUMMER LEAGUE though? That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that.

Meyers is mental midget, he’s probably the only one that needed a babysitter.

Nurk didn’t regress overall but the first of the year we wasn’t good, he came back to form by the end of the year and looked like the same guy they got last year. Ed Davis came to Portland with the same exact skill set he left with. Meyers well he’s Meyers. Plumlee didn’t get better here. Zach might be good someday, and he has contributed on defense but his stats are about as unimpressive as they get, were all hoping he gets better.
Vonleh has a couple good months with Nurkic last year.

However I don’t believe since Hughes was fired there’s a single big we can look at and say he’s gotten noticeably better at something during his time here.

 

[Scalma]

and if Kim Hughes is so good, why is he unemployed?

Who is the best big man coach in the NBA? Is there one? Can you name him without google?

 

[blue9]

“Nurk regressed.”

Where? His stats were almost identical, he just played fewer minutes. His post all star numbers this year were actually superior, on both ends, to his “Nurk fever” run the previous season.

Zach spent one season in college, as a backup, and turned into a contributor on a playoff squad as a 19 year old. But let me guess, coaches don’t get credit for that right?

Swanigan barely played, I don’t know how you can come to any sort of conclusion on him. And athletically speaking, maybe he just doesn’t belong in the NBA. Coaches aren’t magicians.

SUMMER LEAGUE though? That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that.

Meyers is mental midget, he’s probably the only one that needed a babysitter.

So rather than naming a big that showed significant improvement, or offering an answer in regards to the downside of a big-man coach, your argument rests on questioning tangential evidence?
To quote someone: "That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that."

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

and if Kim Hughes is so good, why is he unemployed?

Who is the best big man coach in the NBA? Is there one? Can you name him without google?

Hakeem is the obvious answer but he’s not available. There’s are a ton of ex players and bigs who have made careers out of coaching young bigs. Patrick Ewing was doing it for a while too.

 

[Scalma]

So rather than naming a big that showed significant improvement, or offering an answer in regards to the downside of a big-man coach, your argument rests on questioning tangential evidence?
To quote someone: "That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that."

I could easily ask the opposite; name one big that went elsewhere and improved.

I prefer to dig a little deeper though. Our staff has done fine with the “quality” they’ve been given.

 

[Scalma]

Hakeem is the obvious answer but he’s not available. There’s are a ton of ex players and bigs who have made careers out of coaching young bigs. Patrick Ewing was doing it for a while too.

That’s my point. Hakeem, Grgurich, etc. The best specialized coaches are guys not employed by an NBA team. Olshey has always mentioned that the Spurs are his model franchise. Popovich has always been ahead of the curve, and that includes his coaching staff. I don’t see anything wrong with not wasting a spot on a guy that can only coach one thing, especially when there isn’t any solid evidence that he makes a significant impact with that one thing.

 

[Boob-No-More]

“Nurk regressed.”

Where? His stats were almost identical, he just played fewer minutes. His post all star numbers this year were actually superior, on both ends, to his “Nurk fever” run the previous season.

You have a strange definition of "almost identical:




PER = better, TS% = better, FTr = better, ORB% = better, DRB% = better, TRB% = better, AST% = better, STL% = better, BLK% = better, USG% = lower, WS/48 = better, OBPM = better, DBPM = better.

Other than TOV%, he wasn't better at anything in 2o17-18 than he was during Nurk Fever (his OWS, FWS amd VORP were only higher, not better, because they are a function of minutes played).

Zach spent one season in college, as a backup, and turned into a contributor on a playoff squad as a 19 year old. But let me guess, coaches don’t get credit for that right?

He beat out Meyers Leonard and Noah Vonleh for minutes. He did so because of his defense. He had a HORRIBLE season offensively. But, he's young and there is still time to get him the help he needs.

Swanigan barely played, I don’t know how you can come to any sort of conclusion on him. And athletically speaking, maybe he just doesn’t belong in the NBA. Coaches aren’t magicians.

The fact that he barely played isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of our coaching staff. A lot of guys less athletic than Swanigan have had successful NBA careers. I don't expect him to ever be a starter, but with his skill set and motor, he could develop into a solid back up - with the right coaching...

SUMMER LEAGUE though? That’s your argument? Won’t even entertain that.

I'm pretty sure there was more to my argument than that, but when guys like Collins show no improvement year over year on the offensive end and Swanigan looks great one year and shitty the next, that's not called progress.

Meyers is mental midget, he’s probably the only one that needed a babysitter.

Or maybe someone to work with him on his game.

Again, name one POR big man that improved significantly, especially on the offensive end, since Kim Hughes was fired. Go ahead, just one, that's all I ask.

Meyers - nope, he was showing improvement under Hughes but immediately backslid after Hughes was fired.

Vonleh - nope. Never developed a single reliable offensive move while here.

Plumlee - nope. Never developed a single offensive move while here.

Ed Davis - nope. Left here as the same player he was when he arrived here.

Nurk - see above.

Collins - a work in progress, it's not too late.

Swanigan - no improvement, yet.

And, again, I also ask - what's the downside of hiring a proven big man coach?

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

and if Kim Hughes is so good, why is he unemployed?

Who is the best big man coach in the NBA? Is there one? Can you name him without google?

Of the top of my head, Bob Thorton. Roy Rogers is another good one. There are more, but you said I can't use google, and it's not like they are household names.

BNM

 

[Scalma]

And, again, I also ask - what's the downside of hiring a proven big man coach?

BNM

You ignored what I said about Nurk, and how he played post all star, so I’m going to ignore you as well.

As for this question, I don’t know, ask all the other coaches in the NBA with the same philosophy.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I don’t see anything wrong with not wasting a spot on a guy that can only coach one thing

How is it "wasting a spot"? There is no limit on how many assistant coaches you can have. There are, in effect, an infinite number of spots. It's not like we need to fire someone else if we hire a dedicated, proven big man coach.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

You ignored what I said about Nurk, and how he played post all star, so I’m going to ignore you as well.

As for this question, I don’t know, ask all the other coaches in the NBA with the same philosophy.

It's split about half and half. But, name another team that has so many young big men on their current roster that also has a bad track record of developing young big men?

Again, what's the downside? Are you happy with the way our big men have developed?

BNM

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

That’s my point. Hakeem, Grgurich, etc. The best specialized coaches are guys not employed by an NBA team. Olshey has always mentioned that the Spurs are his model franchise. Popovich has always been ahead of the curve, and that includes his coaching staff. I don’t see anything wrong with not wasting a spot on a guy that can only coach one thing, especially when there isn’t any solid evidence that he makes a significant impact with that one thing.

I don’t know the answer to this but is there a limit to coaching spots? I don’t consider it wasting a spot. I’ve always thought that if Paul Allen could buy one thing it should be having as good of a coaching staff as money could buy.

I mean chances are pop isn’t available, I’m not that out of the real word lol.

 

[Scalma]

Of the top of my head, Bob Thorton. Roy Rogers is another good one. There are more, but you said I can't use google, and it's not like they are household names.

BNM

Yeah Thorton did wonders with Papagiannis. Or wait, maybe Papagiannis just wasn’t good enough on his own?