OT Coronavirus: America in chaos, News and Updates. One million Americans dead and counting

[andalusian]

Is anybody holding China responsible? Asking for a friend...

I can assure you that I am not going to write in Xi Jinping in the upcoming election.

 

[andalusian]

President Covfefe might vote for him tho...

 

[wizenheimer]

Is anybody holding China responsible? Asking for a friend...

I don't think anybody is giving China a pass. Whether it's their blind-eye toward their irresponsible wet-markets or the fact they shut down information getting of their borders without shutting down people traveling to other countries...they have a lot of responsibility for this crisis

but they don't have responsibility for how other nations have handled the spread of the pandemic. The leadership of South Korea gets credit for their response; the leadership of the USA gets blame for their response.

 

[BigGameDamian]

Trump just said that we are leading the world in testing by far. Another bullshit statement. Fake news!

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

I don't need the government to save me, I need it to do it's job. Spinning my globe, my eyes gaze upon South Korea, New Zealand and other countries as examples of governments that did fantastic job - the Trump administration did some things right, it is just a shame that they did it a month or 2 too late when it was obvious they had no other chance - but they certainly fucked big and should be held responsible.

Heck, I don't even need to go that far, all I need to do is look at the government of my residence where early action has shown low infection and death rates despite the fact that California had early cases and has some of the most dense areas in the country.

You think any President in our lifetimes would have enacted a country wide lockdown in January? Or even February?

No fucking way. The lack of medical equipment is entirely because of our decades of reliance on China.

I went to a Knights game on March 1st. We have a Democrat governor. We don't have massive numbers and the shutdown.....they are going to act like it saved the world no matter what.

The poor kids are still going to schools to get free meals and there are lines of people outside of costco and other grocery stores. Quite a few of the store employees are getting sick.

Which they clearly have to have spread to others in public. And their families, who probably include children that go to get free lunches who take it home to their moms and dads and grandparents.

Our state government can't even predict a basic question or two when it comes to unemployment.

My coworker who got furloughed was just here. He tried to file for unemployment a week ago and made a mistake on the website that locked him out. He had to call them to get it fixed. Good luck with that. He couldn't.

Finally yesterday our office manager got through for him and they fixed it.

This whole thing is hindsight. I can say I've said we need to stop relying on China for years. How about you liberals?

The way I remember it is that the leftists here said tought shit, global economy. We can't manufacture stuff these days. I realize that is a simple way of describing the stance of the left but you get the gist of it.

 

[jonnyboy]

I don't need the government to save me, I need it to do it's job. Spinning my globe, my eyes gaze upon South Korea, New Zealand and other countries as examples of governments that did fantastic job - the Trump administration did some things right, it is just a shame that they did it a month or 2 too late when it was obvious they had no other chance - but they certainly fucked big and should be held responsible.

Heck, I don't even need to go that far, all I need to do is look at the government of my residence where early action has shown low infection and death rates despite the fact that California had early cases and has some of the most dense areas in the country.

Your eyes gaze upon two or three smaller countries with a decimal point of the international travel and commerce as the United States. Sorry, a few unusual anecdotal examples don’t set a precedent for the rest of the world and make our leadership a complete failure. I know the political agenda you adhere to screams foul with the help of 95% of the bought and paid for media, but money can’t buy truth. In fact most of the time it buries it.

I don’t know if you noticed, but the United States is a pretty popular place. As in, it’s the hub of world travel. We are a unique case. Every country with citizens who travel here en mass has some culpability. If Trump would have closed the border in January you and the media would be shitting your pants and screaming xenophobia.

In January 95% of this forum was cracking jokes and calling bullshit in this very thread.

Now it’s turned into a fucking Captain Hindsight convention.

 

[riverman]

I have a feeling that if somebody dies from an virus like this, they can’t be released to the families.

reminds me of the Pink Floyd album "wish you were here"

 

[andalusian]

You think any President in our lifetimes would have enacted a country wide lockdown in January? Or even February?

No fucking way. The lack of medical equipment is entirely because of our decades of reliance on China.

In March 4 there were 14 confirmed cases of the virus in the state of California - and it instituted a state of emergency. In March 14, 149 confirmed cases - a shelter in place order was issued. This is for a local government that does not have advance intel that the federal government has. The state has worked tirelessly since to build the PPE and ventilator reserves - and has enough to send extras to other states at this point.

I am sorry, but if a local government was able to do it without the resources and intel that the federal government had - and the federal government has yet to issue a shelter in place at the national level - I am not buying this argument. The federal government could have done so much better and have repeatedly provided bad, inaccurate and harmful information.

Your eyes gaze upon two or three smaller countries with a decimal point of the international travel and commerce as the United States. Sorry, a few unusual anecdotal examples don’t set a precedent for the rest of the world and make our leadership a complete failure. I know the political agenda you adhere to screams foul with the help of 95% of the bought and paid for media, but money can’t buy truth. In fact most of the time it buries it.

I gave you a local, 40 million people example of a state with tons of international travel that you choose to ignore as well. I am not sure how money can't buy truth when it is clear when the data comes directly from the state and federal levels and shows how bad the pandemic is in this country.

 

[jonnyboy]

In March 4 there were 14 confirmed cases of the virus in the state of California - and it instituted a state of emergency. In March 14, 149 confirmed cases - a shelter in place order was issued. This is for a local government that does not have advance intel that the federal government has. The state has worked tirelessly since to build the PPE and ventilator reserves - and has enough to send extras to other states at this point.

I am sorry, but if a local government was able to do it without the resources and intel that the federal government had - and the federal government has yet to issue a shelter in place at the national level - I am not buying this argument. The federal government could have done so much better and have repeatedly provided bad, inaccurate and harmful information.



I gave you a local, 40 million people example of a state with tons of international travel that you choose to ignore as well. I am not sure how money can't buy truth when it is clear when the data comes directly from the state and federal levels and shows how bad the pandemic is in this country.

How about New York? They seem to be getting a lot of sympathy (as they should) for their horrendous death toll...with no finger pointing at their leadership. In fact, the media has decided Andrew Cuomo needs to have his dick sucked 24/7, along with his dipshit brother in the corporate press corps.

Excuse me for not being able to pinpoint the disconnect between good and bad leadership. I didn’t receive the handbook.

 

[yankeesince59]

reminds me of the Pink Floyd album "wish you were here"
View attachment 30679

Shine On You Crazy Diamond !

 

[BigGameDamian]

Notice Trump just called on Debra Birx to explain the wide spread testing when Fauci is at the briefing.

 

[crandc]

When I say Joe Biden, what I really mean is whoever gets chosen as the nominee for you once Joe Biden is deemed unfit (no voting will be necessary). Hopefully whoever that person is can actually present thoughts and ideas coherently without forgetting where they are mid-sentence or losing their place on the teleprompter nine times per minute.

Trump doesn't get to decide who is unfit.

 

[andalusian]

How about New York? They seem to be getting a lot of sympathy (as they should) for their horrendous death toll...with no finger pointing at their leadership. In fact, the media has decided Andrew Cuomo needs to have his dick sucked 24/7, along with his dipshit brother in the corporate press corps.

Excuse me for not being able to pinpoint the disconnect between good and bad leadership. I didn’t receive the handbook.

Let me help you.

New York was too late to institute a stay in shelter at a state level. The City was even worse than the state. But, the state, nor the city have national or international shelter in place authority, only the federal government has it - and NY is one of the biggest international ports in the country. the federal government did not institute travel restrictions from Europe until March 12 (Italy has 15,000 confirmed cases at this point already). However, given that New York, as a state, does not have the intel and resources that the federal government has - I really do not think they had much chance of doing anything about it before mid-March (first case in NY was confirmed March 1st). At least, once they figured it out they started to work quickly to secure PPE and ventilators - something the federal government that had the intel much earlier with them still claimed was unnecessary.

So, if we had to grade them, my grades would be as follows:

SF Bay Area local Government: A+
CA State Government: A ( thought it took them to long to close the schools, I would have closed them 3 days before they did, they waited for the weekend so people can make plans for the upcoming weeks, that's why they do not get an A+)
NY State Government: C for recognizing it quickly, B- since
NY City government: D
Federal Government: F for recognizing it quickly. D for response since.

You are welcome.

 

[yankeesince59]

Rupert Murdock and Fox News only have 5% of the news market share?

Also loving the "any other POTUS than Trump would have not done things differently" defense. Not to mention the gross exaggeration ofBiden.

 

[Hoopguru]

My mother used to say "argumentative people are a drag to be around" and there are some people that will argue anything right wrong indifferent.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

In March 4 there were 14 confirmed cases of the virus in the state of California - and it instituted a state of emergency. In March 14, 149 confirmed cases - a shelter in place order was issued. This is for a local government that does not have advance intel that the federal government has. The state has worked tirelessly since to build the PPE and ventilator reserves - and has enough to send extras to other states at this point.

I am sorry, but if a local government was able to do it without the resources and intel that the federal government had - and the federal government has yet to issue a shelter in place at the national level - I am not buying this argument. The federal government could have done so much better and have repeatedly provided bad, inaccurate and harmful information.



I gave you a local, 40 million people example of a state with tons of international travel that you choose to ignore as well. I am not sure how money can't buy truth when it is clear when the data comes directly from the state and federal levels and shows how bad the pandemic is in this country.

In March 4 there were 14 confirmed cases of the virus in the state of California - and it instituted a state of emergency. In March 14, 149 confirmed cases - a shelter in place order was issued. This is for a local government that does not have advance intel that the federal government has. The state has worked tirelessly since to build the PPE and ventilator reserves - and has enough to send extras to other states at this point.

I am sorry, but if a local government was able to do it without the resources and intel that the federal government had - and the federal government has yet to issue a shelter in place at the national level - I am not buying this argument. The federal government could have done so much better and have repeatedly provided bad, inaccurate and harmful information.



I gave you a local, 40 million people example of a state with tons of international travel that you choose to ignore as well. I am not sure how money can't buy truth when it is clear when the data comes directly from the state and federal levels and shows how bad the pandemic is in this country.

You don't think Nancy Pelosi had any intel available to her? This was one month after Fauci went on tv and said we had nothing to worry about.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nb...-visits-san-franciscos-chinatown/2240247/?amp

All you've done is convince me that Navarro the economist should be President and Fauci should be retired.

But Joe Biden would have stayed up past 6pm one night and figured out that Fauci was wrong and the Chinese and the WHO were lying and locked the entire country down and put millions of people out of work overnight.

Now I get to see cops harassing people in a park with their wife and kid and a paddle boarder by himself in Ca while the grocery stores are open.

Now I'm reading that in NY 80 percent of the people on ventilators die anyway.

In hindsight, none of what we have done was the right thing to do.

 

[yankeesince59]

Both Dem and GOP politicians implored The White House in January and February to take this threat seriously

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Both Dem and GOP politicians implored The White House in January and February to take this thread seriously

Just not your posts and the other jokes about fucking dead animals.

Fear the flu, not so much the Coronavirus.

From what I've read, the mortality rate from the Coronavirus is around 2%...considerably less than influenza.

 

[andalusian]

You don't think Nancy Pelosi had any intel available to her? This was one month after Fauci went on tv and said we had nothing to worry about.

Pelosi is part of the legislative branch of government, not the executive branch. She would have been a part of the executive branch were Trump and Pence found guilty in the impeachment trial in the Senate. Since they were not - this is really not up to her, she did not have the authority to do anything about it even if she knew.Her responsibilities were with funding the costs - and she certainly was working on it since early March.

All you've done is convince me that Navarro the economist should be President and Fauci should be retired.

I have no knowledge of what Fauci knew when he knew it - but the early report about the issue sure shows that Navarro was doing his job about paying attention.

In hindsight, none of what we have done was the right thing to do.

I disagree with this conclusion. Like everything else, there are always consequences - but proper leadership in several places sure have reduced the overall burden of this disease in the places it was enacted.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Both Dem and GOP politicians implored The White House in January and February to take this thread seriously

I guess they did. Here's more of your posts downplaying this virus.

Coronavirus: China announces drop in new cases for third straight day.

Horseshit! There just not reporting anymore.

^^^and you know this because.....?

https://www.sciencealert.com/large-chinese-study-finds-most-coronavirus-infections-are-mild

Vast Majority of Coronavirus Infections Are Mild, Huge Study Has Revealed

AFP
19 FEB 2020
Most people infected by the new coronavirus in China have mild symptoms, with older patients and those with underlying conditions most at risk from the disease, according to a study by Chinese researchers.


The disease has now killed nearly 1,900 people and infected more than 72,000 in China since it first emerged in the central city of Wuhan late last year.

A paper published in the Chinese Journal of Epidemiology looked at 72,314 confirmed, suspected, clinically diagnosed, and asymptomatic cases of COVID-19 illness across China as of February 11.

It is the biggest study on novel coronavirus patients since the outbreak began in late December.

Here are the main findings from the paper by the Chinese Centre for Disease Control and Prevention (CCDC):

Elderly, sick at risk
Some 80.9 percent of infections are classified as mild, 13.8 percent as severe and only 4.7 percent as critical.

The highest fatality rate is for people aged 80 and older, at 14.8 percent.

The study finds that patients with cardiovascular disease are most likely to die of complications from the novel coronavirus, followed by patients with diabetes, chronic respiratory disease and hypertension.

There were no deaths among children aged up to 9, despite at least two cases of newborn babies infected through their mothers.

Up to age 39, the death rate remains low at 0.2 percent.


The fatality rate increases gradually with age. For people in their 40s it is 0.4 percent, in their 50s it is 1.3 percent, in their 60s it is 3.6 percent and their 70s it is 8.0 percent.

Men are more likely to die (2.8 percent) than women (1.7 percent).

The overall death rate from the virus stood at 2.3 percent.

While the Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) outbreak of 2002-2003 affected fewer people, the fatality rate was nearly 10 percent.

The US Centres for Disease Control says between 26 million to 36 million Americans contracted seasonal flu between October 2019 and February 8 this year, and there were between 14,000 to 36,000 deaths - a fatality rate of around 0.1 percent.

'Wuhan exposure'
Nearly 86 percent of those who have contracted the illness had either lived in or travelled to Wuhan, where a seafood market that illegally sold wild animals is believed to be the original source of the virus.

The city in central China's Hubei province has been under lockdown since January 23.

Risk to medical workers
A total of 3,019 health workers have been diagnosed, 1,716 of whom were confirmed cases, and five had died as of February 11, the report said.

An analysis of 1,688 severe cases among medical staff showed that 64 percent of them were working in Wuhan.


"The percentage of severe cases among Wuhan medical staff has gradually decreased from 38.9 percent at the peak (on January 28) to 12.7 percent in early February," the report said.

A hospital director in Wuhan died from the illness on Tuesday.

Earlier this month Wuhan ophthalmologist Li Wenliang, who had been punished by authorities for sounding the alarm about the virus, also died.

'Downward trend'
The epidemic reached its "first peak" between January 24 and 26, the report said.

It suggests there is has been a "downward trend" in the overall epidemic curve since February 11 - meaning the spread of the disease, especially outside Hubei province, was slowing.

On February 13, China broadened its definition of confirmed cases to include those who were clinically diagnosed through lung imaging, in addition to those with a positive lab test result.

The report hints that China's decision to lock down Wuhan - a city of 11 million people - and impose strict transport curbs in other affected areas may have paid off.

'Possible rebound'
The virus spread as millions of people criss-crossed the country for the Lunar New Year holiday in late January.

The authors warn that with many people returning from the holiday, the country needs to brace itself for a "possible rebound of the epidemic".

Coronaviruses may continue to "adapt over time and become more virulent", the report warns and urges doctors to "remain vigilant".

© Agence France-Presse

And literally questioning someone who said China was lying.

You should probably read your old posts before you keep going.

 

[BigGameDamian]

I guess they did. Here's more of your posts downplaying this virus.








And literally questioning someone who said China was lying.

You should probably read your old posts before you keep going.

They are lying.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Pelosi is part of the legislative branch of government, not the executive branch. She would have been a part of the executive branch were Trump and Pence found guilty in the impeachment trial in the Senate. Since they were not - this is really not up to her, she did not have the authority to do anything about it even if she knew.Her responsibilities were with funding the costs - and she certainly was working on it since early March.



I have no knowledge of what Fauci knew when he knew it - but the early report about the issue sure shows that Navarro was doing his job about paying attention.



I disagree with this conclusion. Like everything else, there are always consequences - but proper leadership in several places sure have reduced the overall burden of this disease in the places it was enacted.

Until we can test every citizen of the US to see who has actually had this virus we can't know. I believe it spread through the west coast early this year. I think when Nancy Pelosi was running around Chinatown telling people to come hang out it had already moved through.

NY and the 8 billion people packed into a tiny space are why this seems so terrible.


Explain why Las Vegas isn't a disaster zone right now. Like I said, I was at a Knights game in March 1st. There were thousands of people packed in but we were outdoors. Not on a subway.

I don't have hospital stats from January but there were tons of people I know that were sick that month. My boss is one and he tested neg for the flu.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

They are lying.

Of course they were and are. My posts were because someone just said politicians in jan and feb wanted people to pay attention to this thread.

I have been reading posts from this thread at that time. Few of them seem overly worried about this virus. It was right after their new hero Fauci said we really didn't need to worry.

 

[jonnyboy]

Trump doesn't get to decide who is unfit.

Ok?

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Ok?

She just posted that Trump doesn't run the DNC. Helpful huh?

 

[yankeesince59]

Just not your posts and the other jokes about fucking dead animals.

Time and intelligence allow for a change in judgment...consider it sometime.

"Dead animals"?...what?

 

[jonnyboy]

Time and intelligence allow for a change in judgment...consider sometime.

The longer the time, the lesser the intelligence. Also worth considering.

 

[yankeesince59]

Of course they were and are. My posts were because someone just said politicians in jan and feb wanted people to pay attention to this thread.

I have been reading posts from this thread at that time. Few of them seem overly worried about this virus. It was right after their new hero Fauci said we really didn't need to worry.

"threat"...it was a typo...sue me.

 

[yankeesince59]

I guess they did. Here's more of your posts downplaying this virus.








And literally questioning someone who said China was lying.

You should probably read your old posts before you keep going.

...so you've never been wrong and then reassessed your position and changed course, right?

 

[yankeesince59]

The longer the time, the lesser the intelligence. Also worth considering.

So using your logic, newborn babies are born with the most intelligence?...interesting.