OT Coronavirus: America in chaos, News and Updates. One million Americans dead and counting (1 Viewer)

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Idog1976 said:
His doctor said without a doubt it came from vaccine and that he has a genetic predisposition to have this result. Believe what you want. I know what’s happened to friends and family and I’m sick and tired of those saying its not happening.
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its funny that any study or numbers that doesn't fit the vaccine mandate crowd is dismissed, but all the studies and numbers that do, are 100% correct.

This is what one calls blind belief.

its scary to me how many people stick to a hardline when its likely some of both?

but everyone wants to make it political…

shame on everyone for not being impartial and pushing a political agenda over common sense.
And common sense says both sides’ numbers have flaws…
 
My co-worker and good friend just died. Came down with Covid-19 on Friday and his heart gave out early this morning. 35 years old. Antivaxxer.

Fuck.
 
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crandc said:
No. It is not one on one but strong correlation. And if you look at anti mask, antivax governors, all Republican.
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I will make sure I inform my wife in California who is as liberal as it gets, that all her Hispanic non vaccinated patients that died of Covid in the last 3 months were mostly republican. Same with my client in Mississippi who had to treat their unvaccinated patients (The vast majority who were black) in the parking lot because their ER was full.

For the record, I am not Republican, Democrat or Libertarian. Just someone who hates the media and the politicians who puts politics over lives. Also for the record, I already have my booster shot
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I will make sure I inform my wife in California who is as liberal as it gets, that all her Hispanic non vaccinated patients that died of Covid in the last 3 months were mostly republican. Same with my client in Mississippi who had to treat their unvaccinated patients (The vast majority who were black) in the parking lot because their ER was full.

For the record, I am not Republican, Democrat or Libertarian. Just someone who hates the media and the politicians who puts politics over lives. Also for the record, I already have my booster shot
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Do you read first? I said correlation. There is. If you look at states with high/low vaccination rates they align with Biden/Trump. If you look at antivax governors, all Republican. If you look at legislatures banning mask/vaccine mandates, all Republican controlled. That is putting politics over lives, my friend.
 
crandc said:
Do you read first? I said correlation. There is. If you look at states with high/low vaccination rates they align with Biden/Trump. If you look at antivax governors, all Republican. If you look at legislatures banning mask/vaccine mandates, all Republican controlled. That is putting politics over lives, my friend.
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okay but a map would show Oregon voted dem. But thats just the metro. Tons of right leaners in the smaller places that could skew things.

so take a republican state. Most of the large metros are still democratic and thats where this is happening… in the bigger cities, that are mostly democratic.

Follow the cities. Not the states. States are too vast to make such a comparison.

what cities show the most pushback on vaccines and are those cities democratic or republican in majority?
 
Orion Bailey said:
okay but a map would show Oregon voted dem. But thats just the metro. Tons of right leaners in the smaller places that could skew things.

so take a republican state. Most of the large metros are still democratic and thats where this is happening… in the bigger cities, that are mostly democratic.

Follow the cities. Not the states. States are too vast to make such a comparison.

what cities show the most pushback on vaccines and are those cities democratic or republican in majority?
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The correlation also exists if you look at county-level data.
It's also that case that surveys of individuals show the correlation.
The single strongest predictor of whether someone is anti-covid-vax is their voter registration.

barfo
 
barfo said:
The correlation also exists if you look at county-level data.
It's also that case that surveys of individuals show the correlation.
The single strongest predictor of whether someone is anti-covid-vax is their voter registration.

barfo
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counties still have large areas that dont distinguish one sect. Clackamas county covers most smaller towns but also butts right up to multnomah and overlaps many.
So even though Clackamas may have an overall republican stance, how do we not know the antiprotesters are dems living closer to multnomah county?
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I will make sure I inform my wife in California who is as liberal as it gets, that all her Hispanic non vaccinated patients that died of Covid in the last 3 months were mostly republican. Same with my client in Mississippi who had to treat their unvaccinated patients (The vast majority who were black) in the parking lot because their ER was full.

For the record, I am not Republican, Democrat or Libertarian. Just someone who hates the media and the politicians who puts politics over lives. Also for the record, I already have my booster shot
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There are two major groups that have strong resistance to the vaccine--Trump supporters/arch-right conservatives and minorities who have traditionally been exploited in this country (largely, but not entirely, blacks and Latinos).

Those minorities who are against or skeptical of the vaccine do so because they trace a through-line between generations of abuse against their ethnicity and believe that this vaccine is, or may be, a part of that. While I disagree with that sentiment and think that the facts of this case don't support such a concern, I can at least understand the paranoia birthed from those generations of abuse.

The conservatives who are agitating against the vaccine have no such history of abuse to lead them to the wrong answer. They're uncritically swallowing conspiracy theories about mass genocide, mind control, genetic experiments and rushed, untested medicine. The governors know better, they're simply using anti-vaccine rhetoric to manipulate those easily-manipulated conspiracy theorists.

So, you're right that all these anti-vaxxers aren't Trump supporters or ultra-right-wing conservatives. But one of the groups at least has a basis for fearing being told to do something and the other really doesn't (aside from the standard "don't tread on me" nonsense that popped up for the original vaccines or for seat belts or for other common sense safety measures).
 
Orion Bailey said:
counties still have large areas that dont distinguish one sect. Clackamas county covers most smaller towns but also butts right up to multnomah and overlaps many.
So even though Clackamas may have an overall republican stance, how do we not know the antiprotesters are dems living closer to multnomah county?
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It's certainly possible that Clackamas county is an exception - but I think you previously advocated for using 'common sense', maybe that should be applied here, given that we have no specific data to examine in this particular case.

barfo
 
barfo said:
It's certainly possible that Clackamas county is an exception - but I think you previously advocated for using 'common sense', maybe that should be applied here, given that we have no specific data to examine in this particular case.

barfo
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yep and common sense tells mw numbers can and often are skewed. From both sides.

common sense tells me the anti protests are largely in bigger cities that are largely democratic.

Certainly possible its only republicans in these cities, but common sense tells me that is not likely.
Sure, a state like Texas may be an exception to the rule, but by and large, metro areas are democratic and metro areas are the ones dealing with protests.
 
crandc said:
Do you read first? I said correlation. There is. If you look at states with high/low vaccination rates they align with Biden/Trump. If you look at antivax governors, all Republican. If you look at legislatures banning mask/vaccine mandates, all Republican controlled. That is putting politics over lives, my friend.
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I don't disagree with that. But you are missing the main point. The media and the Whitehouse for months were both saying the problem was due to Republican-controlled states. And I am telling you that in southern CA that is not true. Early on this year, my wife was working 6 days a week dealing with a sudden increase in ICU patients with Delta/Covid. (And deaths) The vast majority were "overweight Hispanics who refused to be vaccinated." (Her words not mine) If they were better educated on the issue lives would have been most definitely saved. But early on the narrative was focused on "white right-winged " southern states.

Can not see the problem with that? They finally had to get Obama to beg many black to get the shot, which was great for those who had not died yet. But by not acknowledging a large part of the population who were reluctant to get the Vax.......more people died than should have. This was idiotic.
 
Orion Bailey said:
yep and common sense tells mw numbers can and often are skewed. From both sides.

common sense tells me the anti protests are largely in bigger cities that are largely democratic.

Certainly possible its only republicans in these cities, but common sense tells me that is not likely.
Sure, a state like Texas may be an exception to the rule, but by and large, metro areas are democratic and metro areas are the ones dealing with protests.
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That's actually not common sense. That's the opposite of Common Sense.

Common Sense would tell you that when the best medical professionals in the world suggest you wear masks and get a vaccine that you freaking do it.
 
MARIS61 said:
09/27/21

7,800+ Doctors, Scientists Accuse COVID Policymakers of ‘

Crimes Against Humanity’
The Physicians Declaration, created by physicians and scientists during the Rome COVID Summit, accused policymakers of forcing a “one-size-fits-all” treatment strategy, resulting in “needless illness and death.”

By
Children's Health Defense Team
EDITOR’S NOTE: Since The Defender on Monday first reported on the Physicians Declaration, the number of signatories has grown from 4,600 to more than 7,800 as of 8 a.m. ET, Thursday, Sept. 30.

An international group of physicians and scientists signed a declaration Friday accusing COVID-19 policy-makers of “crimes against humanity” for preventing the use of life saving treatments on their patients.

As of Monday morning, the Physicians Declaration had garnered more than 4,600 signatures. The signers accused policymakers of forcing a “one-size-fits-all” treatment strategy, resulting in “needless illness and death,” rather than “upholding fundamental concepts of the individualized.”

According to Global COVID Summit, the declaration was created by physicians and scientists during the Rome COVID Summit. The signatories are professionals, many of whom are on the front lines of treating COVID patients.

The Global COVID Summit reported:

“Though the declaration’s signatories are diverse in their specialties, treatment philosophies and medical opinions, they have risen up to take a collective stand against authoritarian measures by corporations, medical associations, and governments and their respective agencies. The objective of the declaration is to reclaim their leadership role in conquering this pandemic.”

The Declaration states:

“The Physicians’ Declaration was first read at the Rome COVID Summit, catalyzing an explosion of active support from medical scientists and physicians around the globe. These professionals were not expecting career threats, character assassination, papers and research censored, social accounts blocked, search results manipulated, clinical trials and patient observations banned, and their professional history and accomplishments altered or omitted in academic and mainstream media.

“Thousands have died from COVID as a result of being denied life-saving early treatment. The Declaration is a battle cry from physicians who are daily fighting for the right to treat their patients, and the right of patients to receive those treatments — without fear of interference, retribution or censorship by government, pharmacies, pharmaceutical corporations, and big tech.”

The signatories created a “doctors- and scientists-only” COVID information platform so citizens can make informed decisions for their families “without interruption, manipulation, politicization or profiteering from external forces outside of the doctor-patient relationship.”
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Phatguysrule said:
That's actually not common sense. That's the opposite of Common Sense.

Common Sense would tell you that when the best medical professionals in the world suggest you wear masks and get a vaccine that you freaking do it.
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lol at you…
 
Orion Bailey said:
counties still have large areas that dont distinguish one sect. Clackamas county covers most smaller towns but also butts right up to multnomah and overlaps many.
So even though Clackamas may have an overall republican stance, how do we not know the antiprotesters are dems living closer to multnomah county?
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It doesn’t, though. Clackamas County is a blue county.
 
Orion Bailey said:
Okay then the next county over.
Point being metro areas are typically blue and metro areas are where the protestors are causing “problems”
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I dunno. Pretty sure most of the folks protesting in Salem are Republicans. Same for the insurrection at the White House.

Seems to me that both sides are protesting all sorts of things. I personally find the protests involving Republicans more troubling than those that Dems are leading.

This is obviously a general statement, but that’s the consensus in my own mind. Still seems more reasonable than a lot of shit being flung both ways. And I was Republican until recent events - the Republican Party should be ashamed of themselves and I can’t in good faith be connected to them after what has transpired over the past year.
 
BigGameDamian said:
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/dallas-mayor-tests-positive-covid-19-mild-symptoms-80798641

Dallas mayor tests positive for COVID-19, has mild symptoms

Dallas Mayor Eric Johnson says he has tested positive for COVID-19 after being fully vaccinated against the coronavirus
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wait what?? A texas politician fully vaccinated?

i thought that txans and repub….


Ahh never mind. Like pissin in the wind to get people to actually see both sides’ concerns…

just easier to blame the republicans….
 
BLAZINGGIANTS said:
I dunno. Pretty sure most of the folks protesting in Salem are Republicans. Same for the insurrection at the White House.

Seems to me that both sides are protesting all sorts of things. I personally find the protests involving Republicans more troubling than those that Dems are leading.

This is obviously a general statement, but that’s the consensus in my own mind. Still seems more reasonable than a lot of shit being flung both ways. And I was Republican until recent events - the Republican Party should be ashamed of themselves and I can’t in good faith be connected to them after what has transpired over the past year.
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two years. Registered independent now.
But both sides are playing the same stupid game of blindly following those that align with their political stance instead of acknowledging both sides are mostly saying whatever they can just to make the other side look bad, whether its true or false, instead of standing up for truth even if it doesn't align with thier views.
 
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