Dame in Milwaukee thread

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kjironman1 said:
Giving up after one isn’t really trying?
New chemistry and a fired coach midway with injuries to all three Middleton Giannis and Lillard didn’t give them much a chance.
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Not saying they should give up, but they really need to get some better help around them (boy that sounds familiar).

The last 3 years for Damian have included incredible scoring seasons but also nagging injuries (including the not so nagging injury that required surgery), and he has a lot of miles on his legs. At least 2 years in a row of Achilles issues/strains, is not a good sign.

Last year he tied his 2nd worst shooting % (non injury year), 2nd lowest 3pt FG% (non injury year), lowest PER since his 2nd year (not counting injury year)...had arguably the best helper he's ever had (to take the stress off of him) so he should've had an average or above average season for him. He did not.

Yeah, he has to deal with changes (moving across the country, getting a divorce, the fear of his penis falling off), but he still ended the season with an injury concern that could keep him out of the rest of the this series or potentially finish what little chance they had to finish the season strongly. And he played the fewest minutes per game in his career, which should've lowered his chances to injury.

But he's getting old, and for the Bucks to just rinse and repeat this roster as it for next year, is more likely going to lead to the same results.
 
riverman said:
Hate to say it but looks like we may have dodged a bullet with Dame given his contract situation and recent injury history.
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Almost $49,000,000 next season at age 34. In a pivotal game 3, he shot 6-20 while Kris Middleton carried them. Dame wasn't even the best guard on the floor. It's a harsh reality, but Father Time is undefeated. Hopefully he doesn't suffer a debilitating injury and can come back and finish his career in Portland on a much lower salary. The Bucks have very solid players still with Dame, Mid, BP and Bro-Lo, but you can just see Indiana seems fresher, younger, and just a step quicker. Bucks have the experience, but without Giannis, it might not be enough.
 
TBpup said:
Almost $49,000,000 next season at age 34. In a pivotal game 3, he shot 6-20 while Kris Middleton carried them. Dame wasn't even the best guard on the floor. It's a harsh reality, but Father Time is undefeated. Hopefully he doesn't suffer a debilitating injury and can come back and finish his career in Portland on a much lower salary. The Bucks have very solid players still with Dame, Mid, BP and Bro-Lo, but you can just see Indiana seems fresher, younger, and just a step quicker. Bucks have the experience, but without Giannis, it might not be enough.
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The sad truth is, and I think most of us Blazer fans know it (either now, or all along), his window closed a while ago. He'd be better off being the 2nd or 3rd best player on a team with 4-6 solid players (not like a stacked team, but a solid team). Instead, in Portland he languished away as the by far best player on a team with 1 decent player, and now he's the 2nd best player on a team with a superstar (who still can't shoot outside of 15 feet), and a modicum of talent around him.

In a way, it's too little, too late.
 
The bucks failing, with an MVP candidate and all-star player + support roster next to dame, should put to rest any claims Cronin should have been more aggressive in trying to put everything around dame with the meager assets retained from the NeO regime.

Like it or not, Cronin has played it like a champ, he gave it a try with Grant next to Dame and when it was clear that's not even close to enough, he stripped it down for a painful, but necessary rebuild.
 
kjironman1 said:
Giving up after one isn’t really trying?
New chemistry and a fired coach midway with injuries to all three Middleton Giannis and Lillard didn’t give them much a chance.
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Look at Minnesota. Had they given up after a disastrous first postseason of the twin tower experiment, they wont be where there are now. With a legit chance to win it all
 
He played it like a champ -- really ??

Blazers had there worst season ( in a long time ) and even failed at making the young guys better for the most part how is this -- playing like a champ ????

We have a HC who should not be a HC in the NBA and a owner who not sure what the hell she really wants and a GM who even IF better then I make him out to be is getting NO help from the owner and the HC. This team needs another top 3 pick and an act of god and something else for this team to be on the right track. It's such a mess I am not even sure WHO to blame at this point cause the blame is so fruitful and can be hung on SO SO many people it's not even funny.

I feel sorry for Dame but at least he is out of this shit show of a franchise that I still love but can also be honest about the state it's in atm

BTW -- Hello and going to try and be more chill towards others
 
Ripcity4life77 said:
He played it like a champ -- really ??

Blazers had there worst season ( in a long time ) and even failed at making the young guys better for the most part how is this -- playing like a champ ????

We have a HC who should not be a HC in the NBA and a owner who not sure what the hell she really wants and a GM who even IF better then I make him out to be is getting NO help from the owner and the HC. This team needs another top 3 pick and an act of god and something else for this team to be on the right track. It's such a mess I am not even sure WHO to blame at this point cause the blame is so fruitful and can be hung on SO SO many people it's not even funny.

I feel sorry for Dame but at least he is out of this shit show of a franchise that I still love but can also be honest about the state it's in atm
BTW -- Hello and going to try and be more chill towards others
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Since this was the first real year of the rebuild post Lillard I'm willing to give things more time to see how things shake out over the next few years. Rebuilds take time but I see some encouraging signs with some of the young guys. I'm anxious to see what parts they can add through the draft and trades during this off season.
 
Like most teams that need one more piece, and get that piece, they are suffering for the loss of what they paid to get that piece. We have to face facts, you can’t (without tons of collusion) make a champion through trading. The missing piece can’t be Dame-level; you end up paying too much for him and change the delicate balance too much to fully recover.
 
Hey, are the Bucks still paying Mike Budenholzer? Cuz if so, then there's no harm in canning Doc Rivers and begging Bud to come back. You're already paying him, you just have to admit you were stupid to fire him.
 
Have to admit that it’s a little hilarious that Dame and Nurk will both be unceremoniously knocked out in the first round.
 
i wouldn't be surprised if Giannis is starting to get injured more often in the future. His athleticism will start to decline in the future and he wont be dominating. We have their unprotected picks from 28 to 30
 
julius said:
But he's getting old, and for the Bucks to just rinse and repeat this roster as it for next year, is more likely going to lead to the same results.
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Well that was the point. They won't do that. players will go there to win. They will tweak the roster this summer and move forward.
 
Everything Beagle said:
Too many games in middle school, high school, college… too much training, too much pressure. The mileage on players by the time they hit the NBA is closer to a ten year vet from 1984. There’s too much money flowing in and out of the league for it to get better. It will only get worse.
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Same reason you're seeing so many injuries in baseball as well. I know I'll sound like the old guy but in our day it was one sport at a time, fall was football/soccer, winter was hoops and spring was baseball. Now I see my friends kids playing baseball, hoops and flag football all at the same time and pretty close to year round. Seems like tackle football is the only sport that hasn't figured out how to make itself year round to take even more $$$ from parents.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Have to admit that it’s a little hilarious that Dame and Nurk will both be unceremoniously knocked out in the first round.
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As far as I know, Nurk didn’t ask to be traded to the Suns, so I don’t get why him getting bounced is funny. Suns management were stupid in making the Beal trade. It bit them in the ass…hard.

Dame asked to be traded, but not to the Bucks. With Dame and Giannis sidelined by injuries, a first round exit doesn’t make any big statement on the wisdom of the Bucks making that trade. They need an offseason to tweak the roster to support their two main stars. That said, I’m never going to find humor in Dame missing out on a chance at a championship due to injuries.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
If you're a Blazers fan laughing at ANY OTHER TEAM, this is a pretty extreme case of pot/kettle.
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Only those that still pine for the days the team built around that old roster. That is someone else's problem now... at least the Blazers realized that that old roster is not the way forward. That's something. They might not have hit on the solution to contend yet, but admitting you have a problem is the first step... and the Blazers finally admitted it in the last couple of years and started looking for an alternate solution.
 
andalusian said:
but admitting you have a problem is the first step... and the Blazers finally admitted it in the last couple of years and started looking for an alternate solution.
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maybe....but I'm not convinced they have

it's kind of looking like Cronin wants to reboot to a 2017-19 version of the Blazers with Ant-Grant-Ayton. It's a negative-image version, possibly with more offensive skill, but even worse defense. Biggest difference is the yesteryear Blazers had an elite #1 option, a top-10ish player and all-star. Next year's version could be a trio of high-paid 3rd options pretending to be 1st options. That doesn't look like a lesson learned to me. Maybe Cronin is hiding his cards well and has an ace or two up his sleeve, bit it does look like he might bet on his 3-of-a-kind, at least as the opener
 
wizenheimer said:
maybe....but I'm not convinced they have

it's kind of looking like Cronin wants to reboot to a 2017-19 version of the Blazers with Ant-Grant-Ayton. It's a negative-image version, possibly with more offensive skill, but even worse defense. Biggest difference is the yesteryear Blazers had an elite #1 option, a top-10ish player and all-star. Next year's version could be a trio of high-paid 3rd options pretending to be 1st options. That doesn't look like a lesson learned to me. Maybe Cronin is hiding his cards well and has an ace or two up his sleeve, bit it does look like he might bet on his 3-of-a-kind, at least as the opener
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Depends on how lucky we get in the draft. Sharpe at SG, Grant at SF, Sarr at PF, and Ayton at C are not worse defensively, especially with Camara backing up Grant. Who knows what happens with Thybulle, Williams, and Brogdon, but those are solid defenders off the bench. Rupert might be a year away but he adds D off the bench and Scoot will more than likely improve defensively as well.
 
wizenheimer said:
maybe....but I'm not convinced they have

it's kind of looking like Cronin wants to reboot to a 2017-19 version of the Blazers with Ant-Grant-Ayton. It's a negative-image version, possibly with more offensive skill, but even worse defense. Biggest difference is the yesteryear Blazers had an elite #1 option, a top-10ish player and all-star. Next year's version could be a trio of high-paid 3rd options pretending to be 1st options. That doesn't look like a lesson learned to me. Maybe Cronin is hiding his cards well and has an ace or two up his sleeve, bit it does look like he might bet on his 3-of-a-kind, at least as the opener
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I think Scoot and Shaedon play better together and with Deandre than either Ant or Jerami do and I think both Ant and Jerami ruin the good things that Scoot and Shae do. Tou, Kris and Bari look like really nice glue guys who are either in the rotation or fifth starter glue guys. This roster is screaming for the established players besides Deandre to be traded for other young prospects and/or future draft considerations along with almost unusable NBA vets just to match contracts.

Take our lumps, figure out who fits together and move forward. I've heard a lot of people say there are a bunch of ways to rebuild but I think the way with the best chance of building a contender in a small market is going really young. The vet filler can be our Earl Watson types like Dame says teams need but for meaningful minutes I hope Deandre is our oldest guy getting them and Ant is gone. Neither Ant or Jerami play the way the team says they want their offense to work and it just kills everything on that end... then Ant is just shit on defense. I think both guys would benefit from being coached by someone who sees them differently and will demand different things from them.
 
As far as the Bucks seemingly impending exit from the playoffs, I guess we'll have to wait and see. For the majority of this season they were playing Dame like a bunch of fucking morons and still had one of the best records in the league. If they can figure out how to maximize their offense, they already have guys that cover well for Dame on D and Dame has been better on that end under Doc. They are a legit contender especially if they can add even a couple more good fits in the rotation.

They only have a few more seasons at the most but over the next few seasons they could definitely make a run. I thought this would be a year to figure things out and that they'd be better next year and that was before the coaching change. I know Doc can make them a regular season top 2-4 team, I don't know if that guy can get out of his own way in the playoffs. Should be interesting going forward and I'm rooting for Dame.
 
wizenheimer said:
maybe....but I'm not convinced they have

it's kind of looking like Cronin wants to reboot to a 2017-19 version of the Blazers with Ant-Grant-Ayton. It's a negative-image version, possibly with more offensive skill, but even worse defense. Biggest difference is the yesteryear Blazers had an elite #1 option, a top-10ish player and all-star. Next year's version could be a trio of high-paid 3rd options pretending to be 1st options. That doesn't look like a lesson learned to me. Maybe Cronin is hiding his cards well and has an ace or two up his sleeve, bit it does look like he might bet on his 3-of-a-kind, at least as the opener
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I think they understood that Dame as the fulcrum is not enough, especially at this point in his career. The rest is just experimenting while accumulating assets and spend the money they had to spend in a way they can trade if they need to and have the flexibility when they have to commit to the young players. That's all it is.

It is going to take time, but the Blazers gave it a try with Dame when they got him Grant and got some vets like Hart, GP2, Nurkic, Winslow with some young guys like Simons and Sharpe. They realized that's way too far and they, rightfully did not want to mortgage the future (#3 pick) for a small upgrade. Not saying that every decision they made since made sense, some of it is mistakes, some of it is giving people time to see if they pop in a primary role (Simons). Some of it is just natural growth.

All I am saying is that it was the right decision not to put all the eggs in the build around Dame basket at this point of his career. That needed to happen in 2016, not 2023.
 

This seems unfair. You could probably say the same thing about Chris Bosh based on his numbers alone, but he was vital for the Heatles.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Depends on how lucky we get in the draft. Sharpe at SG, Grant at SF, Sarr at PF, and Ayton at C are not worse defensively, especially with Camara backing up Grant. Who knows what happens with Thybulle, Williams, and Brogdon, but those are solid defenders off the bench. Rupert might be a year away but he adds D off the bench and Scoot will more than likely improve defensively as well.
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well, I was talking about what I suspect Cronin intends, and a big part of that is Ant at either the starting SG or starting PG. I would agree that simply tossing Ant out of the equation improves the hypothetical defense

I don't think Grant is anywhere close to a good defender, at either forward position. He's certainly not at the level of Aminu, Harkless, or Turner. And Ayton is as good a defender as Nurkic. In the 2017-18 season, Portland ranked 8th in defensive rating at 106.4. Now, a big part of that was the off-the-bench tag-team of Ed Davis & Zach. The next season, without Davis, with Nurkic getting injured, along with the addition of the poor-defense duo of Kanter and Hood, Portland slipped to 16th with a rating of 110.5. This year's team had a rating of 117.5; and that actually improved over the last 20 games or so with Ant-Grant sitting. Even getting close to the 2018-19 mark of 110.5 would require a 7 point improvement. That doesn't seem realistic. And an 11 point improvement is probably out of reach

Sarr seems a pipe-dream at this point and projecting how he'd fit with Ayton seems impossible
 
blazerkor said:
As far as the Bucks seemingly impending exit from the playoffs, I guess we'll have to wait and see. For the majority of this season they were playing Dame like a bunch of fucking morons and still had one of the best records in the league. If they can figure out how to maximize their offense, they already have guys that cover well for Dame on D and Dame has been better on that end under Doc. They are a legit contender especially if they can add even a couple more good fits in the rotation.

They only have a few more seasons at the most but over the next few seasons they could definitely make a run. I thought this would be a year to figure things out and that they'd be better next year and that was before the coaching change. I know Doc can make them a regular season top 2-4 team, I don't know if that guy can get out of his own way in the playoffs. Should be interesting going forward and I'm rooting for Dame.
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again, I wasn't saying what I thought should happen....only what I suspect Cronin intends. I'd be surprised if any of of Ant-Grant-Ayton are traded this summer. I would not be surprised, at all, if Brogdon isn't traded either

by the way, average age of the Blazers:

2015-16 - 24.3
2016-17 - 24.8
2017-18 - 25.6
2018-19 - 26.2
2019-20 - 27.5
2020-21 - 27.4
2021-22 - 25.6
2022-23 - 25.1
2023-24 - 24.1

this year's team, with 6 rookies and 3 other players in their 2nd seasons, was only, on average, a couple of months younger that the 2015-16 Blazer team that had a 44-38 record and made it to the 2nd round
 
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