Dame in Milwaukee thread

[Predator]

Really? Do you think that if you swapped out Dame for Walton, Clyde, or Sheed in that “fluke” WCF series against the Warriors in Dame’s era, the results would have been any different?

What the fuck kind of hypothetical is this?

If we “swapped” them out, the team would be built completely differently.

If you did a straight swap of Dame for Walton for instance, what happens with Nurk? Who is our PG? Would the roster construction still be the same? I mean it just makes no sense as a hypothetical.

So many unknowns which makes this a horseshit question.

And cherry-picking a single playoffs is disingenuous at best. Look at a 5 year window.

And I’d argue it would certainly be easier to build around Drexler or Walton given their height and they aren’t complete traffic cones on defense — which my opinion on height is well documented, supported by Kobe and Jordan both admitting that height is a key part of greatness.

 

[Everything Beagle]

Dame playing SG behind Giannis at PG... he looks bored (I mean, it's pre-season lol) now that he doesn't have to work so hard.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Walton is the greatest Blazer ever. Dame could've been but it's Walton

The Blazers have only had one NBA MVP award winner, and that was the year after he won the NBA Finals MVP.
If people want to include longevity in the equation then I get it, but you and I saw him play and it is hard not to rank him #1.

 

[Phatguysrule]

No. Nope. Nuh uh. Not even close. Dame hit so many game winners it’s insane.

So did Roy. But they were contact finishes and he hit the ft.

Dame hit more from distance because that's what he had and he had far more opportunities.

But I was far more confident down one in the last possession with Roy than I ever was with Dame. Dame missed as many as he made.

 

[Strenuus]

But he demanded to be traded AND SUED THE TEAM after being traded.

If Lillard demanding to be traded from an obviously built-to-tank team prevents him from being considered the greatest Blazer ever, then how can we consider Walton the greatest Blazer ever who not only demanded to be traded, he demanded to be traded from a team that was still strongly in a championship window, led by our greatest coach, and one of our best GMs? And to top it off, sued the damn team!

Who did more damage going out the door, Lillard or Walton?

Game.

Set.

Match.

 

[inconceivable]

What happens after Dame wins 4 rings with Giannis?

 

[andalusian]

So did Roy. But they were contact finishes and he hit the ft.

Dame hit more from distance because that's what he had and he had far more opportunities.

But I was far more confident down one in the last possession with Roy than I ever was with Dame. Dame missed as many as he made.

Based on clutch performance percentages from NBA.com, your feeling were right.

Brandon by year:
39%, 47%, 48%, 46%, 31% (*)
Dame:
41%, 47%, 34%, 37%, 36%, 46%, 35%, 40%, 51%, 27% (*), 38%

(*) injury year.

Like most other things we have seen with the Roy vs. Dame, Dame had much more variance - because he relied a lot more on the long ball.

 

[Everything Beagle]

What happens after Dame wins 4 rings with Giannis?

He comes back here for a final contract, doesn't win a ring in 4 years, retires at 40.

 

[Pinwheel1]

What happens after Dame wins 4 rings with Giannis?

Tough call. Hard to bet against the ex-Blazer in that case. 5 rings is lot........ for Connaughton

 

[wizenheimer]

Based on clutch performance percentages from NBA.com, your feeling were right.

Brandon by year:
39%, 47%, 48%, 46%, 31% (*)
Dame:
41%, 47%, 34%, 37%, 36%, 46%, 35%, 40%, 51%, 27% (*), 38%

(*) injury year.

Like most other things we have seen with the Roy vs. Dame, Dame had much more variance - because he relied a lot more on the long ball.

not sure that's a complete picture though. Last season, according to 82games Dame averaged 15.3 FT's made per/48 in clutch time. I'd assume that translates to 1.3 FT's made per clutch period. I'd wonder if Roy matched that. I'd also wonder if NBA.com defines clutch the same way 82 games does

 

[andalusian]

not sure that's a complete picture though. Last season, according to 82games Dame averaged 15.3 FT's made per/48 in clutch time. I'd assume that translates to 1.3 FT's made per clutch period. I'd wonder if Roy matched that. I'd also wonder if NBA.com defines clutch the same way 82 games does

I have no idea, I just went by nba.com for a very simple stat, so no one would complain about how one puts weights on things. If you want to go by the total number of points in the clutch, They both seem to be in the 140+ in their best years, Dame's highest is 183, Roy's 150, but again, long ball and all that jazz.

I thought that FG% is a pretty good indicator of clutch performance. Unfortunately, nba.com does not give you a TS% and I am too lazy to do the math myself. NBA.com does give you FT% in clutch and Brandon's numbers are 3 years in the 90%, 1 in the 80% and one 75%, I have looked at Dame's last 5 years, 3 in the 90% range, 2 in the 80% range, I would think that Dame is a better shooter than Roy, but Roy was probably able to score in more ways than Dame. Either way, Roy was elite in the clutch, just as Dame was, but like I said, variance was smaller with Roy, for better and worse.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

What happens after Dame wins 4 rings with Giannis?

Dame comes back to Portland, retires a Blazer, then runs for Governor in a few years.

 

[Phatguysrule]

not sure that's a complete picture though. Last season, according to 82games Dame averaged 15.3 FT's made per/48 in clutch time. I'd assume that translates to 1.3 FT's made per clutch period. I'd wonder if Roy matched that. I'd also wonder if NBA.com defines clutch the same way 82 games does

Roy got clutch buckets from everywhere, though. And was such a threat he was able to make an easy pass post opposite for a bunny.

Dude was clutch. I knew we were going to win every clutch game with Roy. We were going to get a good look, and if it ended up being in the paint Roy would be shooting free throws to seal it.

Again. Dame is great. But so was Roy. I'd personally take healthy Roy over healthy Dame. I'd take both over Drexler. And Walton over all 3.

 

[BIG Q]

But he demanded to be traded AND SUED THE TEAM after being traded.

If Lillard demanding to be traded from an obviously built-to-tank team prevents him from being considered the greatest Blazer ever, then how can we consider Walton the greatest Blazer ever who not only demanded to be traded, he demanded to be traded from a team that was still strongly in a championship window, led by our greatest coach, and one of our best GMs? And to top it off, sued the damn team!

Who did more damage going out the door, Lillard or Walton?

Walton left as a free agent. He did demand a trade but everyone knew he was injured and unable to play. Nobody was giving up anything for him. To even request a trade was ludicrous with that injury and knowing he was out for the entire season and about to be a free agent. He did no damage to Portland at all. And suing the Blazers doctors was legitimate. He just simply packed up and left as his contract had expired. He did not leave after signing a super max contract and having four years left on said contract. And because he was a free agent he did not tank Portlands leverage in a trade scenario, nor was he able to demand a trade to only one team since he was in fact a free agent. Then there is the question of did Dame demand a trade after Grant agreed to a 5/$150 mil contract, a contract many believe Portland would not have agreed to had Dame asked out earlier. It seemed Dame was waiting for Grant to get paid. With all this, I am happy everything worked out for Dame and Portland in the end.

 

[andalusian]

Again. Dame is great. But so was Roy. I'd personally take healthy Roy over healthy Dame. I'd take both over Drexler.

I don't think we ever really saw a fully healthy Roy in the NBA. He had his big injuries that led to his early retirement from the NBA in college. There was a reason he was not taken in the first 3 in the draft.

 

[Phatguysrule]

I don't think we ever really saw a fully healthy Roy in the NBA. He had his big injuries that led to his early retirement from the NBA in college. There was a reason he was not taken in the first 3 in the draft.

True.

 

[inconceivable]

How did roy ended up a blazer? We drated thomas at 4 then traded him for #2 la with chicago. Minny got roy at 6

 

[andalusian]

True.

This, btw, I think that I am most excited for Shae's development in the NBA. He has the tools to be a healthy Roy if he continues to develop as we hope he can. I do not know if he will have the killer attitude that Roy had, but we see glimpses. It's important to remember how young he is, Roy was 22 when he was drafted and Shae is still just 20...

As great as Scoot could potentially be, the one player that could, one day, be proven to be a generational talent on the team, imho, is more likely than not Shae.

 

[andalusian]

How did roy ended up a blazer? We drated thomas at 4 then traded him for #2 la with chicago. Minny got roy at 6

Traded with Minni for Randy Foye who was drafted 7, iirc.

 

[inconceivable]

Traded with Minni for Randy Foye who was drafted 7, iirc.

Damn, two high profile top ten draft day trades in same year ending with aldridge and roy. . And got durant the following year. Wow!

 

[Natebishop3]

Dame playing SG behind Giannis at PG... he looks bored (I mean, it's pre-season lol) now that he doesn't have to work so hard.

Dame always looks so bored in preseason or all star games. His juices definitely don’t start flowing unless it counts.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Walton left as a free agent. He did demand a trade but everyone knew he was injured and unable to play. Nobody was giving up anything for him. To even request a trade was ludicrous with that injury and knowing he was out for the entire season and about to be a free agent. He did no damage to Portland at all. And suing the Blazers doctors was legitimate. He just simply packed up and left as his contract had expired. He did not leave after signing a super max contract and having four years left on said contract. And because he was a free agent he did not tank Portlands leverage in a trade scenario, nor was he able to demand a trade to only one team since he was in fact a free agent. Then there is the question of did Dame demand a trade after Grant agreed to a 5/$150 mil contract, a contract many believe Portland would not have agreed to had Dame asked out earlier. It seemed Dame was waiting for Grant to get paid. With all this, I am happy everything worked out for Dame and Portland in the end.

1. That supermax contract did no harm to the Blazers and was very much earned and deserved by Lillard.

2. Not signing Grant to that contract would have hurt the Blazers far more than letting him walk for nothing.

 

[Idog1976]

Dame comes back to Portland to win two more rings with Sharpe and Scoot, then retires a Blazer, then runs for Governor in a few years.

Fixed it for ya!

 

[Idog1976]

This, btw, I think that I am most excited for Shae's development in the NBA. He has the tools to be a healthy Roy if he continues to develop as we hope he can. I do not know if he will have the killer attitude that Roy had, but we see glimpses. It's important to remember how young he is, Roy was 22 when he was drafted and Shae is still just 20...

As great as Scoot could potentially be, the one player that could, one day, be proven to be a generational talent on the team, imho, is more likely than not Shae.

Yes, Sharpe is our most likely generational talent, top-5 in the league guy. He has the most sheer athleticism since Drexler (and in fact a bit more!!!) and he just has unlimited talent. Does he have the will to win? As you mention we've seen it in flashes and it really is the single most important thing for him to develop. I couldn't be happier that we have Scoot and that he has such a dominant personality with endless desire to win. I hear Rupert is similar. These are the kind of guys I want in spades to be around Ayton and Sharpe so they can reach their potential.

 

[Natebishop3]

1. That supermax contract did no harm to the Blazers and was very much earned and deserved by Lillard.

2. Not signing Grant to that contract would have hurt the Blazers far more than letting him walk for nothing.

I’m pretty sure there’s a rule against you posting serious comments.

 

[andalusian]

Yes, Sharpe is our most likely generational talent, top-5 in the league guy. He has the most sheer athleticism since Drexler (and in fact a bit more!!!) and he just has unlimited talent. Does he have the will to win? As you mention we've seen it in flashes and it really is the single most important thing for him to develop. I couldn't be happier that we have Scoot and that he has such a dominant personality with endless desire to win. I hear Rupert is similar. These are the kind of guys I want in spades to be around Ayton and Sharpe so they can reach their potential.

Well, I also hope we both are doing a disservice to scoot. We have seen that elite athletic small guards are not enough to take a team to a ring (see Russell, Westbrook) and the same is true for smart, supremely skilled small guards ( see Paul, Chris). Maybe scoot can be a combination of both and prove us wrong, but shae's path seems easier to that lofty goal.

 

[Idog1976]

Well, I also hope we both are doing a disservice to scoot. We have seen that elite athletic small guards are not enough to take a team to a ring (see Russell, Westbrook) and the same is true for smart, supremely skilled small guards ( see Paul, Chris). Maybe scoot can be a combination of both and prove us wrong, but shae's path seems easier to that lofty goal.

Thank god we have both!

 

[riverman]

This thread sure got off topic. Personally I hope Lillard's trade demand to play for a ring fails in Milwaukee. Sends a msg to stars who sign max deals with 4 years left that the grass isn't always greener. I like the Bucks and they've been my favorite eastern conf team for a while now. I just want the Blazers to win one before the Bucks or Heat can get another one.

 

[Everything Beagle]

This thread sure got off topic. Personally I hope Lillard's trade demand to play for a ring fails in Milwaukee. Sends a msg to stars who sign max deals with 4 years left that the grass isn't always greener. I like the Bucks and they've been my favorite eastern conf team for a while now. I just want the Blazers to win one before the Bucks or Heat can get another one.

I can respect this sort of honest pettiness!

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Reading stuff like this hurts. If only we could have gotten someone great to pair with Lillard.

'We can do this all night': Dame-Giannis pairing off to impressive start

LOS ANGELES -- It didn't take long for Giannis Antetokounmpo to realize just how different life would be for him playing alongside seven-time All-Star Damian Lillard compared to the rest of his 11-year NBA career.

It was all but one possession into the pair's first preseason game together Sunday against the Los Angeles Lakers when things became crystal clear for the two-time MVP.

"I'll be very honest," Antetokounmpo said after the Bucks' 108-97 win, "I've never been this open. And first of all, I've never seen anybody being double-teamed from the first possession of the game."

Lillard, acquired by the Bucks as part of a three-team deal with the Phoenix Suns and the Portland Trail Blazers last month, said that pairing with a player like Antetokounmpo made the Lakers' defensive schemes easy to digest.

"Having another guy out there that's just dominant," Lillard said after Antetokounmpo scored 16 points in 15 minutes on 7-for-10 shooting. "He can dominate a game and win you a game. ... First couple plays, they blitz me, they trap me and the guy that I'm releasing the ball to is Giannis. So I'm just like, 'Uh, we can do this all night.' You know what I mean?"

The duo officially logged their partnership in the scorebook midway through the first quarter when Lillard stole the ball from Lakers center Christian Wood and sped up court, delivering a bullet of a pass to rack up an assist on an Antetokounmpo transition dunk. Lillard didn't attempt his first shot until the next possession, with 6:24 remaining in the first, when he got fouled by D'Angelo Russell beyond the 3-point line.

They ran pick-and-roll together in the half court. Sometimes Lillard handled the ball and Antetokounmpo set the screen; sometimes the roles were reversed and Lillard used his 6-foot-2, 195-pound frame to spring the Bucks star.

"We're going to have a lot of options," Lillard said. "There's going to be times where he's willing to make the play to me, and vice versa, as we saw today."

Milwaukee held a 56-53 lead at the half when Bucks coach Adrian Griffin gave Antetokounmpo the rest of the night off. Lillard finished with 14 points on 3-for-10 shooting, including going 6-for-6 on free throws, and added four steals and three assists. He started the second half, giving him a chance to control the action without Antetokounmpo on the floor, before resting in the fourth quarter.

As limited as the dress rehearsal might have been, with Antetokounmpo and Lillard finally sharing the court for only a couple of quarters in the third game of the Bucks' five-game exhibition slate, Griffin was impressed with what he saw.

"Today was a great first step in the right direction," Griffin said. "You can see those guys love playing together already. And not just Dame and Giannis, but everyone was just pulling for each other."

The 28-year-old Antetokounmpo praised the 33-year-old Lillard as much for the person he is as he lauded him as a player.

"I feel like it's like a little version of me," Antetokounmpo. "A guard version. ... Quiet. Goes about his business. Takes care of his family. Shows up. Practices really hard. Helps his teammates when he needs to be vocal. ... And when the game starts, he's just a killer."

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id...-antetokounmpo-bucks-pairing-impressive-start