Trade Dame to Milwaukee

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Bob Dobalina said:
The Athletic Article paints a nasty picture of the Blazers FO. Basically refusing a better deal.
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First of all, this article is written by the same shills that have been pumping Dames agenda for the last three months.

Second, I don’t blame Joe for not taking Goodwin's calls. The guy was actively working against him while he was trying to get a deal done. I’m not sure if I actually believe this shit about Goodwin telling Milwaukee and Brooklyn secretly that they were okay. It sounds like something that they’re saying to save face and make Joe look bad.

There are clearly bad feelings on every side here and I don’t think Mr Goodwin is welcome around these parts anymore.

But that little added bullshit of the offer that Miami was willing to send out… it’s the same deal we had been hearing for months. They weren’t going all in.
 
Bob Dobalina said:
Honestly hard to say at this point as the return for Holiday will be the determining factor.
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I think the picks are a determining factor too. There are no guarantees but Blazers are gambling that odds of Milwaukee bottoming out in 5 years is higher than Miami. Miami is attractive enough of a destination that they can basically choose to not be truly terrible. Milwaukee has less options if/when their team implodes.
 
I will say this and then I plan on dropping this cause it does the fan base no good to keep harping on who is to blame cause it has fractured a fanbase and caused in fighting and more and the time has come to stop and come back together to support the players on this rebuild. We need to get past who is to blame cause both sides of fans are resolute in there beliefs of how it played out and now that Dame is gone it does not matter at least for now. It's possible how this played out MIGHT bite the Blazers in the ass in terms of how other players ( and agents ) see this team when it comes to getting top line free agents but we might not see that for a good two to three years or more down the line. The division this has created has got to end and end RIGHT now cause I am tired of the in fighting and bickering and just down right nastiness ( I was part of it I know ) that this brought out in fans. We have to get back to talking about how this team can get better and move forward without Dame cause it will not be pretty at times and sometimes it might be down right ugly but that is part of rebuilding or even re-tooling of a team. However there will be moments it will come together at least we hope it will and we will see the new vision and go damn maybe there is hope even when the team is losing games and such.

Let's all rally together cause this team is going to need the fanbase to show up for them cause I for one might have my reservations about this front office BUT I will always support the players who go out and bust there ass game in and game out.

Go Blazers !!!
 
It is so funny they still pushing how Blazers lost a golden chance to acquire two future HOFs in Herro and Jovic. Fuckin hilarious.
 
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Bob Dobalina said:
The Athletic Article paints a nasty picture of the Blazers FO. Basically refusing a better deal.
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If true, I salute and support Cronin in his decision. Also, no reporting had anything more than Herro and 2 FRPs for months so I'm skeptical. Milwaukee package of a two way all-star plus what will likely end up as 3 FRP's (two of them swaps much higher, maybe to lottery), plus what we get for Jrue is objectively better. Sounds like butthurt Miami fans, or podcasters trying to create a narrative.
 
It's interesting reading the ESPN Insiders article today about the trade. The panel generally likes the trade for the Bucks, but is on the fence whether it actually makes them better. It's like they're fighting internally between their hearts and their minds... That's going to be a very interesting element to watch this year. Is a flashy offense (heart) better than a balanced offense and stellar defense (mind)?

Some people are pointing to BroLo, as well as the obvious in Giannis, as the reason why Dame's defensive limitations will be covered up. But, BroLo was a mediocre defender much of his career, and perhaps a case could be made that his dramatic improvement on that end came as a result of being paired with Jrue and Giannis. Remove Jrue, and it's not a guarantee that BroLo will be the assumed pillar. (Had BroLo's defense improved much prior to Jrue arriving? I feel like he was transitioning in that direction but hadn't taken the big leap yet.)

As for the garbage that Miami is sour about us not accepting, those trade pieces after Herro are comparable to what we just tossed in the recycling bin (Nas and Keon) for Phoenix. Just because they were drafted, doesn't make them trade cornerstones.
 
Milwaukee going to be deep in the tax huh.
 
The Bucks management. That’s how you make your superstar happy. All-in and paired him with another Superstar. Too bad our old GM can’t do it for Dame.
 
TYDame said:
The Bucks management. That’s how you make your superstar happy. All-in and paired him with another Superstar. Too bad our old GM can’t do it for Dame.
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It starts with ownership. Jody and Bert just wanted to be cheap.
 
TYDame said:
The Bucks management. That’s how you make your superstar happy. All-in and paired him with another Superstar. Too bad our old GM can’t do it for Dame.
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It's harder to make an omelet when the pan is cold, the ingredients are in the wrong container, and some of them are missing....than it is when the pan is warm, you can see where everything is, and the cook is not confused. This is true regardless of how hungry the people are waiting for the food.
 
TYDame said:
The Bucks management. That’s how you make your superstar happy. All-in and paired him with another Superstar. Too bad our old GM can’t do it for Dame.
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If you’re blaming Olshey, agreed. We didn’t have an All-Star to trade, nor did another team have a disgruntled Superstar tanking their own value.
 
julius said:
100%. Although I don't think Miamis offer would've included the Blazers getting Ayton, if they whiff on trading Jrue (I think the idea that they'll get 3 picks for him is delusional), it'll taint the trade.
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Maybe the Suns said no to Herro and Nurk for Ayton but agreed to Grayson Allen. Also Portland may prefer Camara though I'm not sure why?
I also think getting three picks for Jrue is delusional but I could see a solid player and at least one more pick.
 
So Miami's offer was:

2 1sts
2 swaps
Herro to a third team for a protected 1st
Seconds
Jovic

So Holiday needs to fetch more than 2 1sts and a young player.
 
kjironman1 said:
Maybe the Suns said no to Herro and Nurk for Ayton but agreed to Grayson Allen. Also Portland may prefer Camara though I'm not sure why?
I also think getting three picks for Jrue is delusional but I could see a solid player and at least one more pick.
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The framework would have been Herro to a 4th team for protected 1st and rotation player. Rotation player routed to PHX for Ayton.

Think Olynyk to PHX, THT/1st to Portland, Herro to Jazz.
 
Natebishop3 said:
No. That's not what Shams said. He said they were WILLING to make that offer but he didn't say that they actually offered it.
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Sure, but for all intents and purposes we COULD have gotten that. If Joe didn't listen because of bad blood, that's not a good reason.
 
B-Roy said:
The framework would have been Herro to a 4th team for protected 1st and rotation player. Rotation player routed to PHX for Ayton.

Think Olynyk to PHX, THT/1st to Portland, Herro to Jazz.
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That just gets too complex for me and my little world.
I like one player for another player and a Big bag a dollas to make up any needs. Keep it Simple.
 
B-Roy said:
So Miami's offer was:

2 1sts
2 swaps
Herro to a third team for a protected 1st
Seconds
Jovic

So Holiday needs to fetch more than 2 1sts and a young player.
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It said "up to 3 1sts" in the article. Not sure where 2 1sts is coming from. Or I'm misinterpreting this as it does read kind of odd.

For their part, league sources say the Heat were prepared in July and August to offer up to three first-round draft picks — with Tyler Herro going to a third team — and multiple second-rounders and swaps along with expiring contracts and 2022 first-round pick Nikola Jović.
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kjironman1 said:
That just gets too complex for me and my little world.
I like one player for another player and a Big bag a dollas to make up any needs. Keep it Simple.
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It's not complex. Ayton would have been in any deal.
 
B-Roy said:
Sure, but for all intents and purposes we COULD have gotten that. If Joe didn't listen because of bad blood, that's not a good reason.
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I just don't believe it. This sounds like a hypothetical, because there wasn't any reports of Miami reaching out to OKC. There wasn't any reports of them having serious offers for Herro. The last reports that we heard was that Miami had offered Herro/filler/2 picks and now suddenly AFTER the trade we hear that they were willing to offer these assets.
 
Bob Dobalina said:
It said "up to 3 1sts" in the article. Not sure where 2 1sts is coming from.
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I understand it was not "officially" offered.

But who's fault is that? Both the Blazers and the Heat. Blazers never called back and neither did the Heat. All I'm saying is if the Blazers could have gotten that, then Holiday needs to fetch more.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I just don't believe it. This sounds like a hypothetical, because there wasn't any reports of Miami reaching out to OKC. There wasn't any reports of them having serious offers for Herro. The last reports that we heard was that Miami had offered Herro/filler/2 picks and now suddenly AFTER the trade we hear that they were willing to offer these assets.
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If you read it they weren't offering 3 of their own firsts PLUS Herro. It was 2 firsts and Herro to a third team for another protected first, and there was definitely reports about them shopping Herro to other teams.
 
B-Roy said:
If you read it they weren't offering 3 of their own firsts PLUS Herro. It was 2 firsts and Herro to a third team for another protected first, and there was definitely reports about them shopping Herro to other teams.
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It's impossible to compare trades when we don't know what Herro could fetch, but I will say that I think the Milwaukee picks are worth more than Miami. The Bucks could be REALLY bad in 4-5 years. They're not a free agent destination like Miami is. They don't have Spo.

I'm not in love with Jovic and/or Jaquez, but they never mentioned including Jaquez or Martin and someone from their team would have needed to go to Phoenix to complete that trade.

I heard that the picks being offered for Herro were heavily protected. I think Jrue will fetch better picks.
 
Natebishop3 said:
It's impossible to compare trades when we don't know what Herro could fetch, but I will say that I think the Milwaukee picks are worth more than Miami. The Bucks could be REALLY bad in 4-5 years. They're not a free agent destination like Miami is. They don't have Spo.

I'm not in love with Jovic and/or Jaquez, but they never mentioned including Jaquez or Martin and someone from their team would have needed to go to Phoenix to complete that trade.

I heard that the picks being offered for Herro were heavily protected. I think Jrue will fetch better picks.
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Protected 1st and rotation player was consistently thrown out there. I'm don't actually know if the Miami deal is better than the Milwaukee deal. It depends on how they execute this Jrue trade. But I would be pissed if they deliberately end up choosing a lesser deal because of feelings and animosity.

Understand this:



Ayton was coming whether it was the Heat or Bucks or whatever. Look at what they ended up taking for Ayton.
 
This is not a criticism, but an observation. I simply amazes me how humans have regressed in their ability to decipher truth from snake oil cure. There was a time when people travelled through towns on a wagon selling cures and amulets, all purveyed as a way to better their life. These dupable folks spent what little money they had to achieve a shortcut that did not exist. Over time, people seemed to wizen up until the next method came along.

What it ultimately boils down to in my personal view, is that supply and demand will always work with humans. Give them what they want, regardless of the consequences, and they will swallow that shit whole. People seek drama. The eat that shit whole. Professional wrestling is a perfect display of that. That is not real competition. It is dramatic competition.....with a predetermined outcome. The Enquirer? That is not truth, it is dramatic information. What did ESPN do to sports reporting? They made it dramatic.

For me, I do not "follow" anyone regarding sports. I wait until the information becomes....wait for it.....wait for it.....news!
 
B-Roy said:
So Miami's offer was:

2 1sts
2 swaps
Herro to a third team for a protected 1st
Seconds
Jovic

So Holiday needs to fetch more than 2 1sts and a young player.
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That's just noise coming from a fanbase/front office trying to save face. Everything we were hearing before this happened was nowhere close to that. Not to mention I think that still will fall short of the final haul after Holiday is traded.
 
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