Eating Crow about Scoot

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Predator said:
How many elite guards in the modern NBA were this “mediocre” and this inconsistent in year 2?
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This is an excellent point. Scoot may be able to become a role player or even a starter. Or he may be a bust, it's hard to tell.

But it's extremely unlikely he can ever become an elite star. We would have seen more flashes by now.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
But it's extremely unlikely he can ever become an elite star. We would have seen more flashes by now.
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I don't see how anyone thought he was going to be some kind of scoring machine. That wasn't really his strength. He's a floor general. We're hoping he can be like a Chris Paul type of point guard. Not a Dame. Not a Steph Curry. We need him to control the flow of offense and get players involved. I still think he could be a guy who averages 10+ assists per game. I'd be shooting to have him around 16-18 ppg and 10+ assists. That's his sweet spot.
 
wizenheimer said:
I'm not arguing with those observations. Just making a circumstantial case for some hope. It's not like anybody taken after Scoot is standing out from the crowd
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I can appreciate that. Making a case for hope is what we got now.
 
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Game Score was created by John Hollinger to give a rough measure of a player's productivity for a single game. The scale is similar to that of points scored (40 is an outstanding performance, 10 is an average performance).
The formula is PTS + 0.4 * FG - 0.7 * FGA - 0.4*(FTA - FT) + 0.7 * ORB + 0.3 * DRB + STL + 0.7 * AST + 0.7 * BLK - 0.4 * PF - TOV.
 
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SharpesTriumph said:
This is an excellent point. Scoot may be able to become a role player or even a starter. Or he may be a bust, it's hard to tell.

But it's extremely unlikely he can ever become an elite star. We would have seen more flashes by now.
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agree with this, if he can learn to play to his strengths and within himself and improve his shooting over the next few years he could become a solid starter, and he seemed to play some fairly decent defense last night. I'd be happy with that
 
SheedSoNasty said:
How was he wrong about Scoot? I don’t have the Tok.
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he essentially said that he bought into the pre-draft hype on Scoot; that Scoot was going to be an elite athlete at PG like Westbrook or Rose. That the pre-draft noise about Scoot being talented enough to be the #1 pick in a draft that didn't have a player like Wemby was justified. That he though Scoot would be able to drive to the hoop at will. That Scoot would be a multiple time all-star. He bought all of that hype

but now, after seeing Scoot for a season and 10 games this season, he believes all the hype was premature and unjustified. That Scoot's athleticism was overrated and that Scoot has way too much difficulty in beating his man off the dribble and can't create good open driving lanes at any consistent level. That Scoot is a decent passer but with questionable court vision. He's not calling Scoot a bust but he is saying it's looking likely that Scoot's ceiling will be a lot lower than the player we all hoped Portland was getting. And that Scoot probably would never be good enough to alter the trajectory of the Blazers

which is kind of what most of us are seeing right now. I think Scoot was pretty overrated compared to the hype. That's not to say he won't end up a solid player, but we were all hoping for more than solid from a 3rd pick. IMO, Scoot's biggest issue is a non-existent handle on his left hand. The scouting on Scoot is that defenders should hedge to Scoot's right hand...and that's what is happening. That half-step hedge is preventing Scoot from consistently beating men off the dribble. And that takes away and athleticm advantage he may have
 
Thank you, Wize!

As someone who wasn’t big on Scoot from before the draft, this isn’t surprising to me. That being said, he occasionally shows flashes and I’m not giving up on him yet.
 
kjironman1 said:
Not by much? Seems awfully close to where he was last season.
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Yeah, he's not clearly better this year. I also wouldn't put much weight in comparing a seasons worth of stats vs a few games this year. Last year in December we had a few folks convinced Thybulle was a good 3pt shooter based of a 25 game sample.

Would be a good topic to revisit at the end of the year.
 
comparing 1st & 2nd seasons of Scoot to Westbrook & Rose in terms of assist rate and turnover rate

rookie assist rate: Scoot 29.9%....Westbrook 27.5%....Rose 28.8%
2nd season assist rate: Scoot 27.0%....Westbrook 38.6%%....Rose 30.3%

rookie turnover rate: Scoot 19.3%....Westbrook 17.6%....Rose 13.3%
2nd turnover rate: Scoot 18.9%....Westbrook 16.6%....Rose 12.5%

not a very encouraging comparison
 
wizenheimer said:
comparing 1st & 2nd seasons of Scoot to Westbrook & Rose in terms of assist rate and turnover rate

rookie assist rate: Scoot 29.9%....Westbrook 27.5%....Rose 28.8%
2nd season assist rate: Scoot 27.0%....Westbrook 38.6%%....Rose 30.3%

rookie turnover rate: Scoot 19.3%....Westbrook 17.6%....Rose 13.3%
2nd turnover rate: Scoot 18.9%....Westbrook 16.6%....Rose 12.5%

not a very encouraging comparison
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And those guys got the opportunity to be the starting PG and all of the challenges that come with it.

Scoot has had the opportunity to play with Simons.
 
wizenheimer said:
comparing 1st & 2nd seasons of Scoot to Westbrook & Rose in terms of assist rate and turnover rate

rookie assist rate: Scoot 29.9%....Westbrook 27.5%....Rose 28.8%
2nd season assist rate: Scoot 27.0%....Westbrook 38.6%%....Rose 30.3%

rookie turnover rate: Scoot 19.3%....Westbrook 17.6%....Rose 13.3%
2nd turnover rate: Scoot 18.9%....Westbrook 16.6%....Rose 12.5%

not a very encouraging comparison
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Westbrook and Rose (sounds like a law firm) were already 21 years old by the time they started their 2nd seasons. Scoot won't be 21 until late into this season.

Westbrook had 2 years of college basketball (something Scoot *definitely* could've benefited from) too.

NOT saying that he hasn't been a disappointment (overall) or that he wasn't over hyped, but if we're going to compare 2nd year #'s to each other, it's helpful to note that that the above comparisons were after their complete season, and not just 10 games. Although like I said, I don't think we're going to see a drastic improvement from Scoot over that time. It'd be better to compare them by ages, and also both Rose and Westbrook were starters, and the Bulls were a 41 win team (coming off of 41 wins the year before) and the Thunder were a 50 win team.

Meaning, the rosters they played on weren't chuck full of inexperienced players like the Blazers roster is currently.
 
julius said:
At least they're playing defense this year.
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Well... They are really tall this year. I'm not sure if anything else has actually improved. They are more experienced and have taller, better defensive players.

But yeah. They are a more imposing defense, for sure.
 
Cugel said:
A key part of an assist is scoring the bucket. Plus, Chauncey's offense is so iso heavy it aint funny.
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Per NBA.com, we're 12th in isolation percentage. So middle of the road.
 
I think it would do well for all to exert a bit of patience on this kid. He is young, did not benefit from college coaching and has not been handed the keys, so he is questioning his role.

Give him another year or two before calling a bust, would be my thought.
 
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He's showing more comfort attacking and getting into the lane. That's very good.

He just can't finish still when he gets there. He needs to find out what Dame did and who he worked with and do that.
 
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