ESPN Reports: POR MIN working on deal 2 1st and vet SF from another team?

[Nikolokolus]

If Minny wants Nic that badly, they can just give Portland more for him. Or no deal. Hardball, Neil!

Precisely. The currently reported offer of Kyle Korver and two picks late in a bad draft don't really add up to compensation and I think Neil has scenarios valued appropriately.

Of all the options on the table I think it goes like this in terms of value:
Nic slightly overpaid > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later) > Kyle Korver plus two anemic picks.

Now if the offer were sweetened, say removing lottery protection, or putting a better wing player in the deal then I'd listen to Minny's offer, but that hasn't happened (yet).

 

[Nikolokolus]

Agreed. Any while we're at it, pick up Webster or Darko on the cheap, and then match Batum. I still don't see what leverage Kahn thinks he has here - if Batum REALLY wants to play in Minny, decline our match, and sign for the QO. We get Nic for 1 more year and can plan around not having him in 2013.

Fuck Darko. That's subtraction by addition.

 

[NorthBayBaller]

Precisely. The currently reported offer of Kyle Korver and two picks late in a bad draft don't really add up to compensation and I think Neil has scenarios valued appropriately.

Of all the options on the table I think it goes like this in terms of value:
Nic slightly overpaid > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later) > Kyle Korver plus two anemic picks.

Now if the offer were sweetened, say removing lottery protection, or putting a better wing player in the deal then I'd listen to Minny's offer, but that hasn't happened (yet).

From our side, some Wolves fans don't want to get into the 'Jaric' situation again by giving up 1st round picks that end up being lottery. There is risk there, maybe too much for both sides. I actually wouldn't mind giving up DWill if it meant a better contract for Nic.

This board is actually pretty solid when you don't have guys like Fez spamming it up.

 

[RR7]

Precisely. The currently reported offer of Kyle Korver and two picks late in a bad draft don't really add up to compensation and I think Neil has scenarios valued appropriately.

Of all the options on the table I think it goes like this in terms of value:
Nic slightly overpaid > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later) > Kyle Korver plus two anemic picks.

Now if the offer were sweetened, say removing lottery protection, or putting a better wing player in the deal then I'd listen to Minny's offer, but that hasn't happened (yet).

Korver is only guaranteed for 500,000, I believe, next season, so i think it would change to

Nic slightly overpaid > Kyle Korver(waived) plus two anemic picks. > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later)

 

[PtldPlatypus]

As far as Korver is concerned, the fact that Chicago is willing to part with him for a second-round pick speaks volumes. If we're looking at draft picks as currency, wouldn't the pick that Chicago would allegedly receive in this deal be better value than Korver himself anyway?

And I agree with Nik on sweetening the deal. 2 unprotected picks + Ridnour + Webster, or Williams + a pick--those might be decent value.

 

[Eastoff]

As far as Korver is concerned, the fact that Chicago is willing to part with him for a second-round pick speaks volumes.

THIS

 

[BrianFromWA]

If the compensation wasn't so poor I'd agree. Frankly I'd rather have cap room to make an unbalanced trade than two picks in the twenties in what many are predicting will be a terrible draft.

you'd get both.

 

[glazeduck]

Of all the options on the table I think it goes like this in terms of value:
Nic slightly overpaid > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later) > Kyle Korver plus two anemic picks.

Proably worth pointing out that doing a S&T where we bring back significantly less in salary than we would have going out would result in a very large TPE, which we could also use to enable lopsided trades. If we're not going to use cap space to sign free agents, there really isn't much difference...

 

[BrianFromWA]

Korver's non-guaranteed for only 500k.

I think the reason he's being talked about is b/c, with Webster and Miller, MIN could bring back ~20M in salary and give that team only 1.5M in guarantees after they waive those 3. It doesn't help us, but it could help us get a guy (or two) who's overpriced with some younger players or assets. I don't think ANYONE is saying "Korver would be our starting SF on Opening Night".

 

[RR7]

Proably worth pointing out that doing a S&T where we bring back significantly less in salary than we would have going out would result in a very large TPE, which we could also use to enable lopsided trades. If we're not going to use cap space to sign free agents, there really isn't much difference...

If we still had cap space, then the TPE is worthless. We'd have to renounce the TPE to use space. So if we carry it into the season, it'd be no different than carrying our cap space in.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

Korver's non-guaranteed for only 500k.

I think the reason he's being talked about is b/c, with Webster and Miller, MIN could bring back ~20M in salary and give that team only 1.5M in guarantees after they waive those 3. It doesn't help us, but it could help us get a guy (or two) who's overpriced with some younger players or assets. I don't think ANYONE is saying "Korver would be our starting SF on Opening Night".

But according to Batum's agent, Blazers want a guy who sits on the three point line and just shoots. I think Blazer are in hot pursuit of Krover.

 

[BrianFromWA]

damn, I keep forgetting how Ndaiye is the Chess Master and we're all the rubes.

 

[Further]

I fully believe that PA will not bite on the bullshit currently being offered. The Wolves need to either pony up some real talent or just risk giving Batum a offer sheet.

If it gets that far, then Batum will have to decide if he wants to sign the offer sheet knowing that if the Blazers match then he is here a long time.

And if he signs the offer sheet, then PA & Co can decide to let him walk or sign Batum, but either way it will be better then some shitty picks

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

and two picks late in a bad draft

WAY WAY WAY too early to call it a bad draft. The 2012-13 college season is months away!!!

 

[noknobs]

WAY WAY WAY too early to call it a bad draft. The 2012-13 college season is months away!!!

The fact remains that this package of shit Minnesota is offering us for our 2nd best player, when we have leverage, is nowhere near good enough.

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

The fact remains that this package of shit Minnesota is offering us for our 2nd best player, when we have leverage, is nowhere near good enough.

Agree. I just think its ridiculous to already call the 2013 draft "bad".

 

[Mediocre Man]

Agree. I just think its ridiculous to already call the 2013 draft "bad".

How about it's not being viewed as a very strong draft from some of the draft experts like Givoni and such?

 

[blazerboy30]

Precisely. The currently reported offer of Kyle Korver and two picks late in a bad draft don't really add up to compensation and I think Neil has scenarios valued appropriately.

Of all the options on the table I think it goes like this in terms of value:
Nic slightly overpaid > Cap room (enabling lopsided trades later) > Kyle Korver plus two anemic picks.

Now if the offer were sweetened, say removing lottery protection, or putting a better wing player in the deal then I'd listen to Minny's offer, but that hasn't happened (yet).

Are those actually the options though?

Couldn't it be:
1) Nic overpaid
2) Let Nic walk for nothing but have cap room to use later this year or next summer
3) Get 2 draft picks, a SF and have cap room to use next summer (depending on who the SF is)

To me, option 3 looks the best if the price for Nic really is 11.5M / year.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Agree. I just think its ridiculous to already call the 2013 draft "bad".

From a fan point of view, it may indeed be ridiculous. However, from a GM point of view, you need to decide NOW about your feelings for next year's draft. For example, would you trade pick #6 in the 2012 draft for #6 in the 2013 draft? What about #15 for #15? #25 for #25? These are the types of decisions GMs have to make right now. The consensus is that most GM wouldn't make any of those trades, they like the 2012 draft better.

So, in that sense the 2013 draft is "bad." It doesn't mean there won't be a lot of good players drafted next year.

 

[Duckhook]

Are those actually the options though?

Couldn't it be:
1) Nic overpaid
2) Let Nic walk for nothing but have cap room to use later this year or next summer
3) Get 2 draft picks, a SF and have cap room to use next summer (depending on who the SF is)

To me, option 3 looks the best if the price for Nic really is 11.5M / year.

Your last option looks good on paper, until you look at where those draft picks are. They're most-likely in the 20s so that means cap locks on the rooks and unless they're a diamond in the rough it's a bad move. The SF being mentioned is Korver who will most-likely be waived by Chicago anyway. Cap room next summer? Maybe.

 

[Sedatedfork]

Your last option looks good on paper, until you look at where those draft picks are. They're most-likely in the 20s so that means cap locks on the rooks and unless they're a diamond in the rough it's a bad move. The SF being mentioned is Korver who will most-likely be waived by Chicago anyway. Cap room next summer? Maybe.

The picks are still tradable pieces even if you don't want to use them.

 

[Duckhook]

The picks are still tradable pieces even if you don't want to use them.

I understand that. But the value of those picks are significantly less being that low in the draft. Other teams know that too. Do we trade Wallace for a low to mid 20s 1st rounder? Or a top-6 lottery protected? I just don't see much value in those pics unless you have your eye on more Euros.

 

[Nikolokolus]

WAY WAY WAY too early to call it a bad draft. The 2012-13 college season is months away!!!

No not really. I trust guys like Dave Telep, Jonathan Givony and Chad Ford when they say it's going to suck. The incoming crop of HS seniors have been under observant eyes for awhile now.

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

No not really. I trust guys like Dave Telep, Jonathan Givony and Chad Ford when they say it's going to suck. The incoming crop of HS seniors have been under observant eyes for awhile now.

Players develop. Freshman step up! Shit happens!

 

[Mediocre Man]

Don't be so sure Portland and Minny are even the two teams that will get something done for Batum
Eastern and Western conference teams have both expressed interest in him
Allen could simply tell Olshey to try to get a deal done with SA or Toronto
Leaving Minny up a creek

Could we maybe get a better offer from someone else?
Only the brass really knows, and I assume they do
My hope is Williams or keep Nic
I think we will probably hear something before the weekend
Nic probably really doesn't care where he ends up anyway
Going to play with Rubio, Parker or staying in Portland

So what do you all think?
On one hand Nic is only 23
On the other hand he really hasn't shown anything more than role player abilities, but he had Nate
Never the less, this is a tough one to really be on one side or the other, IMO

 

[Mediocre Man]

So no more S&T possibilities

 

[Nikolokolus]

Are those actually the options though?

Couldn't it be:
1) Nic overpaid
2) Let Nic walk for nothing but have cap room to use later this year or next summer
3) Get 2 draft picks, a SF and have cap room to use next summer (depending on who the SF is)

To me, option 3 looks the best if the price for Nic really is 11.5M / year.

I guess it comes down to what people think Nic is going to be worth at 23, 24, 25 and 26 ... with Nate gone and Nic getting paid like a go to guy, I wonder if his mentality might change? Sometimes money makes people lazy and other times it provides a sense of validation. I'm sort of betting it's the latter with Nic.

Of course I could be wrong.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Players develop. Freshman step up! Shit happens!

Probably a couple of guys will surprise, but beyond that how many are going to end up like Austin Rivers and Harrison Barnes? Guys regress from their lofty projections too.

 

[blazerboy30]

Your last option looks good on paper, until you look at where those draft picks are. They're most-likely in the 20s so that means cap locks on the rooks and unless they're a diamond in the rough it's a bad move. The SF being mentioned is Korver who will most-likely be waived by Chicago anyway. Cap room next summer? Maybe.

I'm not saying that picks in the 20's are worth a great deal, but how is getting 2 picks, regardless of position, worth less than getting nothing? Maybe I'm underestimating the amount of cap hold. What is the cap hold for those picks?

 

[GrandpaBlaze]

Are those actually the options though?

Couldn't it be:
1) Nic overpaid
2) Let Nic walk for nothing but have cap room to use later this year or next summer
3) Get 2 draft picks, a SF and have cap room to use next summer (depending on who the SF is)

To me, option 3 looks the best if the price for Nic really is 11.5M / year.

If Nic is fairly highly valued around the league and we are not getting value out of him in the current scenario, why not keep in as possible use in a future trade? It is not necessarily that we have to keep him indefinitely if we keep him.

Gramps...