Finding Drexler

[e_blazer]

Which is why making the playoffs this year or next would be counterproductive to the talent acquisition phase the team is in.

In my opinion, the overall talent level on the team, with the exception of the missing top-caliber wing, is pretty good. If we can get the missing wing this year and complete the core, I can see a quick reboot to contention by moving some of the young guys in lopsided deals for more proven role players. I'm hoping that this is a pit stop in irrelevancy land and that Olshey can finish off the necessary modifications next summer before hitting the gas. I'm getting too damned old to be watching the Blazers rebuild for another decade.

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

It resets each year, past drafts aren't factored.

Yes I know. But I believe it resets with the moratorium. Which would mean after the draft concludes and we made our selection

 

[Orion Bailey]

In my opinion, the overall talent level on the team, with the exception of the missing top-caliber wing, is pretty good. If we can get the missing wing this year and complete the core, I can see a quick reboot to contention by moving some of the young guys in lopsided deals for more proven role players. I'm hoping that this is a pit stop in irrelevancy land and that Olshey can finish off the necessary modifications next summer before hitting the gas. I'm getting too damned old to be watching the Blazers rebuild for another decade.

Were on the same page my man!

 

[PtldPlatypus]

When we miss the 2016 playoffs and are confirmed to be able to keep our 2016 pick, we would still owe (potentially) our 2017 pick, so we would not be permitted to trade our 2016 pick pre-draft because it could possibly violate Stepien.

 

[BonesJones]

Le sigh.

We already traded our first next year. We can't trade it again until after we make the pick if we can keep it due to protections on the pick

Our pick is top 14 protected in 2016 and 2017, If the pick isn't conveyed then it becomes a 2nd rounder I believe in 2018.

Le sigh

I guess I wasn't clear. Im suggesting trading Denver something like a future 2nd and Harkless for our own 2016 pick. Basically reacquiring our 1st in full. It's not too valuable to Denver since our pick is likely gonna end up as 2 second round picks down the road.

Once you get that pick back you send it over in the package for Cousins

 

[Nikolokolus]

In my opinion, the overall talent level on the team, with the exception of the missing top-caliber wing, is pretty good. If we can get the missing wing this year and complete the core, I can see a quick reboot to contention by moving some of the young guys in lopsided deals for more proven role players. I'm hoping that this is a pit stop in irrelevancy land and that Olshey can finish off the necessary modifications next summer before hitting the gas. I'm getting too damned old to be watching the Blazers rebuild for another decade.

I'd say that would be the best case scenario. I usually steer closer to the mean in my predictions.

So if you think I'm being overly negative, here's my thought process: In my view, everything right now boils down to whether or not Damian has another (significant) leap in the quality of his play (especially on defense) and whether or not any of the guys currently on the roster can turn into an All-Star caliber player. If the answer is "no" to either of those questions, then you can bring in all of the roleplayers you like via trade, but it still won't get this team any closer to a title.

To quickly return to being a playoff team Neil would have to hit a home-run in the draft or somehow orchestrate a franchise defining trade. Either is possible, but I would say neither is probable.

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

I'd say that would be the best case scenario. I usually steer closer to the mean in my predictions.

So if you think I'm being overly negative, here's my thought process: In my view, everything right now boils down to whether or not Damian has another (significant) leap in the quality of his play (especially on defense) and whether or not any of the guys currently on the roster can turn into an All-Star caliber player. If the answer is "no" to either of those questions, then you can bring in all of the roleplayers you like via trade, but it still won't get this team any closer to a title.

To quickly return to being a playoff team Neil would have to hit a home-run in the draft or somehow orchestrate a franchise defining trade. Either is possible, but I would say neither is probable.

Drafting someone that's a home run is probably more likely and better suited for future moves too. It's easier to compete with a rookie performing beyond his contract for cap purposes, than to have three max guys with vet guys willing to come for cheap. And we don't have a LeBron or organization like the spurs to do those things.

It sucks being a bottom of the barrel market and organization to free agents

 

[BlazerWookee]

Development and winning are not necessarily co-variant.

"Winning" <>"Trying to win."

Just sayin'.

 

[BlazerWookee]

Players and coach are always going to try to win. I don't think the organization is projecting and intention to lose to the players. Philly though is pretty clearly not caring about winning at all. Portland may not win many games but that will be attributed to simply not having the front end elite talent needed. They will though try to win every game.

And fans should root for them to win every game.

 

[Denny Crane]

Yes I know. But I believe it resets with the moratorium. Which would mean after the draft concludes and we made our selection

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q87

Teams are restricted from trading away future first round draft picks in consecutive years. This is known as the "Ted Stepien Rule." Stepien owned the Cavs from 1980-83, and made a series of bad trades (such as the 1982 trade mentioned above) that cost the Cavs several years' first round picks. As a result of Stepien's ineptitude, teams are now prevented from making trades which might leave them without a first round pick in consecutive future years.

The Stepien rule applies only to future first round picks. For example, if this is the 2011-12 season, then a team can trade its 2012 first round pick without regard to whether they had traded their 2011 pick, since their 2011 pick is no longer a future pick. But they can't trade away both their 2012 and 2013 picks, since both are future picks. Teams sometimes work around this rule by trading first round picks in alternate years, or by giving one team the right to swap picks with the other.

 

[oldfisherman]

It appears our best option to land an all-star caliber wing player is to draft Ben Simmons. He is projected to go #2 and sounds like a much better version of Batum. If we land the #1 pick, trade it for the #2 pick and a player or second first round pick.

If we win too many games and do not land the #1 or #2 pick, it would imply some of our guys have developed nicely. This also implies we have more assets to trade to move up in the draft to get Simmons.

So we will have either the number 1 or 2 pick, or, have developed enough players to move up in the daft to land Simmons. A win-win plan.

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q87

Teams are restricted from trading away future first round draft picks in consecutive years. This is known as the "Ted Stepien Rule." Stepien owned the Cavs from 1980-83, and made a series of bad trades (such as the 1982 trade mentioned above) that cost the Cavs several years' first round picks. As a result of Stepien's ineptitude, teams are now prevented from making trades which might leave them without a first round pick in consecutive future years.

The Stepien rule applies only to future first round picks. For example, if this is the 2011-12 season, then a team can trade its 2012 first round pick without regard to whether they had traded their 2011 pick, since their 2011 pick is no longer a future pick. But they can't trade away both their 2012 and 2013 picks, since both are future picks. Teams sometimes work around this rule by trading first round picks in alternate years, or by giving one team the right to swap picks with the other.

Ummmm yes I know Denny. that still has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. The pick in 2012 is already traded buy protected. If we get to keep the pick in 2012 because we miss the playoffs, if we were to trade it before picking a player. Theoretically we would be violating the Stepein rule because 2012 and 2013 were both traded before we made either pick. Which is why I said technically we can move our 2012 pick, just not until after we draft a player with it (loophole being we draft a player for another team)

 

[Denny Crane]

Ummmm yes I know Denny. that still has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. The pick in 2012 is already traded buy protected. If we get to keep the pick in 2012 because we miss the playoffs, if we were to trade it before picking a player. Theoretically we would be violating the Stepein rule because 2012 and 2013 were both traded before we made either pick. Which is why I said technically we can move our 2012 pick, just not until after we draft a player with it (loophole being we draft a player for another team)

I think it clearly states you don't have to wait for the draft.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Ummmm yes I know Denny. that still has nothing to do with what I'm talking about. The pick in 2012 is already traded buy protected. If we get to keep the pick in 2012 because we miss the playoffs, if we were to trade it before picking a player. Theoretically we would be violating the Stepein rule because 2012 and 2013 were both traded before we made either pick. Which is why I said technically we can move our 2012 pick, just not until after we draft a player with it (loophole being we draft a player for another team)

As we did with our draft day trade of RHJ three weeks ago.

 

[Jayps16]

I really like Ingram in the draft this year, kid looks like Durants baby brother. With how bad we're going to be this year (25-30 wins), we'll have a real shot at landing him, adding a potentially elite wing scorer with Dame and hopefully a developed Vonleh inside. Could be a good core looking forward.

I think this year we "tank" in the sense that we just play what we have, play hard and don't hand guys minutes just because they're young, but we're gonna struggle to win in the west.

To further along the aquiring of potential through the draft I'd try and pull something like Plumlee + Connaugton and pieces to Boston for Brooklyns 2016 pick, Plumlee would pair nicely with Sullinger/Olynyk and rumor was they liked Pat. Brooklyns gonna be a lotto team this year, and to further that along I'd offer them some 2nd rounders to take Joe Johnson off their hands, giving them luxury tax relief and a big trade exception. Turn around and buyout Johnsons contract, and we preserve our own tanking while setting up the acquired pick to be even better.

 

[TBpup]

It appears our best option to land an all-star caliber wing player is to draft Ben Simmons. He is projected to go #2 and sounds like a much better version of Batum. If we land the #1 pick, trade it for the #2 pick and a player or second first round pick.

If we win too many games and do not land the #1 or #2 pick, it would imply some of our guys have developed nicely. This also implies we have more assets to trade to move up in the draft to get Simmons.

So we will have either the number 1 or 2 pick, or, have developed enough players to move up in the daft to land Simmons. A win-win plan.

"Win 10 for Ben!

 

[ripcityboy]

Yeah. An all star wing player, that's exactly what we need..... and we can't sign one through free agency, so all we need to is hire one through Labor Ready!

 

[Orion Bailey]

Yeah. An all star wing player, that's exactly what we need..... and we can't sign one through free agency, so all we need to is hire one through Labor Ready!

I think Manpower might have better talent...

 

[e_blazer]

"Win 10 for Ben!

"Lose 72 and hope the guy we draft doesn't play like poo!"

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

I think it clearly states you don't have to wait for the draft.

That would violate the stepein rule. Becausethe draft hasn't happened yet so technically you'd be out two first rounders in a row.

The way to circumvent that is as I've said. Make the pick for the team, make the trade after the draft.

 

[Denny Crane]

That would violate the stepein rule. Becausethe draft hasn't happened yet so technically you'd be out two first rounders in a row.

The way to circumvent that is as I've said. Make the pick for the team, make the trade after the draft.

It's not considered trading away two FUTURE picks if one is for this current season. The current season pick is not a future one. That's how the FAQ reads. It doesn't say anything about having to pick first. There are ramifications for trading the pick vs. trading the picked player, too. The pick costs $0 for cap balance.

 

[Denny Crane]

http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2013/12/trading-future-draft.html

The Stepien rule, named after former Cavs owner Ted Stepien, was established so that franchises couldn’t trade away all their future first-round picks. Even teams like the Knicks, Nets, and Lakers, who are more willing than most clubs to part with draft picks, can only trade first-rounders for every other season. For instance, Brooklyn has traded away its 2014, 2016, and 2018 first-rounders — since the team isn’t allowed to give up back-to-back future first-round picks, that means the 2015 and 2017 picks can’t be offered up in deals, but the 2020 pick can.

Of course, in spite of the Stepien rule, a team could still end up without a first-round pick on an annual basis, since the rule only applies to future first-rounders. So a team like Toronto, which traded away its 2013 first-round pick, is now free to move its 2014 first-rounder, if it so chooses. In other words, a team can give up back-to-back first-round picks if the first of those two drafts has already passed.

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

It's not considered trading away two FUTURE picks if one is for this current season. The current season pick is not a future one. That's how the FAQ reads. It doesn't say anything about having to pick first. There are ramifications for trading the pick vs. trading the picked player, too. The pick costs $0 for cap balance.

No. Read it again. The 2011 pick doesn't matter because it had already been made when the 2011-2012 season was happening. Then it specifically states that you cannot trade the 2012 pick if you've already traded the 2013 pick. The 2012 pick would be for the current season

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2013/12/trading-future-draft.html

The Stepien rule, named after former Cavs owner Ted Stepien, was established so that franchises couldn’t trade away all their future first-round picks. Even teams like the Knicks, Nets, and Lakers, who are more willing than most clubs to part with draft picks, can only trade first-rounders for every other season. For instance, Brooklyn has traded away its 2014, 2016, and 2018 first-rounders — since the team isn’t allowed to give up back-to-back future first-round picks, that means the 2015 and 2017 picks can’t be offered up in deals, but the 2020 pick can.

Of course, in spite of the Stepien rule, a team could still end up without a first-round pick on an annual basis, since the rule only applies to future first-rounders. So a team like Toronto, which traded away its 2013 first-round pick, is now free to move its 2014 first-rounder, if it so chooses. In other words, a team can give up back-to-back first-round picks if the first of those two drafts has already passed.

Thanks for highlighting what I've been saying.

 

[magnifier661]

Thanks for highlighting what I've been saying.

Read section 6793.1.23 1a where it clearly states that popcorn should not be allowed to pop in a microwave.

 

[Denny Crane]

Thanks for highlighting what I've been saying.

You don't have to wait for the draft to trade this year's pick. It is not a future pick. So you can trade 2012 and 2014 in 2012, then in 2013 trade your 2013 pick. It makes no difference to the league if you draft for someone else or just trade the pick. For CBA purposes, the pick costs $0 for trade/cap ballast, but the drafted player's salary DOES count.

 

[Harry's Raincoat]

Now, back to the regularly scheduled program .......

Stages of Team development (IMO):
1. Player and Asset gathering (i.e. Drafting, Signing FA's)
2. Identify and obtain core starting players, secure long term contracts for these only
3. Identify and obtain reserve / bench players only after Step 2
4. Win

We are only on step 1. We have to gather (more and) better assets by drafting them or signing them and then possibly trading them to get to step #2.
You gotta have more chips in your pile in order to raise the bet!

 

[BBert]

Clyde Drexler isn't walking through that door!

 

[BlazerWookee]

Clyde Drexler isn't walking through that door!

Not if he knows what's good for him, he won't!

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

You don't have to wait for the draft to trade this year's pick. It is not a future pick. So you can trade 2012 and 2014 in 2012, then in 2013 trade your 2013 pick. It makes no difference to the league if you draft for someone else or just trade the pick. For CBA purposes, the pick costs $0 for trade/cap ballast, but the drafted player's salary DOES count.

No you can't. You can't trade your future 2013 pick (future because the draft has not occurred yet even of it's the 2012-2013 season) when you've already dealt your 2014 pick.